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Slow running beat em ups
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torez:
He could either find/borrow some cheap-o video card or he could get a newer computer, think the former would be more efficient first.  His video card is really old and he needs all that video ram to load all these graphics.

I remember back in 1999 I got PCI Starfighter with 8 MB video ram (16 MB was much more expensive).  It replaced my 4 MB card that only played smaller games.  In these days I used NeoRageX and I was able to play some Neo-Geo games.  PCI Starfighter added a bunch of them as playable (Metal Slug comes to mind).  Been getting the roms from Geoshock then and spanning them with Winzip onto dozens of 1.44 MB floppies (started in 1998 with Geoshock).  Even formatted them to 1.72 MB (Microsoft distributable standard) for *extra* space lol.  Finally got a zip drive, so started getting bunch of stuff on these 100 MB disks every time :).  Wow, these were interesting times.

Anyway, that check for bottlenecks is not something I do all the time.  It's just a recommendation, so he can learn something from it.  As it's an AGP slot card (probably at 4X), finding/borrowing a used card should be easy.  Talking about bottlenecks, right now the hdd is the major problem for the whole system.  Myself, I would replace the hdd with a newer one that is quiter and has less chance of a failure than the old/used up one and then reinstall.  Most likely his disk is 5400 rpm with 20-30 GB and 1 MB cache anyway.  It all depends from how much money he is willing to spend to just play these few more games.  I would go with the swap first, as the system is still perfectly good for other things besides gaming and I'm sure that after doing this he will gain some fps in Mame games.

Cheers
Glaine:

--- Quote from: CheffoJeffo on November 28, 2006, 09:19:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: torez on November 28, 2006, 04:35:23 pm ---
--- Quote from: CheffoJeffo on November 28, 2006, 07:37:47 am ---This is  a rather naive way to "find bottlenecks" and is typically employed when people don't know much abut the processing being done (which is 99.9% of the time these days, but still ...).
--- End quote ---

Do you speak from experience or have you read it somewhere?  More than 20 years of dealing with computing here and 10 helping others, so I doubt my naive approach here.
--- End quote ---

Congratulations ... yes, it is from experience... :dunno

Swapping components is a blind form of finding bottlenecks -- it is more important to understand what is going on in the underlying processing in order to correctly determine the source of the problem.That was my only point with that statement, although I also doubt your naive approach.


--- Quote ---If you read my comment correctly, I was talking about better 2D support for Mame with a better card.
--- End quote ---

I I read your comment incorrectly, then I apologize ... although it appears I was not alone.

I do think he needs more horses under the hood for what he wants,

Cheers.

--- End quote ---

I absolute second Jeffo here.
First, I hate it when people equate time with quality experience.
Second, you are way way better off knowing the specs and what you need than buying parts cuz it will probably help.
Third, it's been said, Zinc is a made for emulating these titles in 3d using your graphics card, mame is not.

Please be glad that people are trying to help. I'm only mad here because your taking a tone.
torez:

--- Quote from: Glaine on December 08, 2006, 11:52:57 am ---
I absolute second Jeffo here.
First, I hate it when people equate time with quality experience.
Second, you are way way better off knowing the specs and what you need than buying parts cuz it will probably help.
Third, it's been said, Zinc is a made for emulating these titles in 3d using your graphics card, mame is not.

Please be glad that people are trying to help. I'm only mad here because your taking a tone.

--- End quote ---

What kind of approach to find a solution is saying "ooo, buy a new computer" without trying anything else first?  Not everyone has $1,000 to spend to just play couple more games.


--- Quote ---First, I hate it when people equate time with quality experience.
...
I'm only mad here because your taking a tone.

--- End quote ---

Looks like you are taking a tone here.  FYI, I hate when people make generalizations like this.  Trying a newer/different video card (with more memory) does not mean lack of quality experience, as it's obvious his card is very old with little memory and probably with very old drivers.  Borrowing a card is certainly cheaper than buying a new computer.  There is certainly no need to have any experience to say:  "Hey, get a new Dell" to constructively solve any question/problem.


--- Quote ---Second, you are way way better off knowing the specs and what you need than buying parts cuz it will probably help.
Third, it's been said, Zinc is a made for emulating these titles in 3d using your graphics card, mame is not.
--- End quote ---

Once again, the better video card is for the better 2D support.  Nobody is talking about 3D at this time.
Glaine:

--- Quote from: torez on December 08, 2006, 07:56:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: Glaine on December 08, 2006, 11:52:57 am ---
I absolute second Jeffo here.
First, I hate it when people equate time with quality experience.
Second, you are way way better off knowing the specs and what you need than buying parts cuz it will probably help.
Third, it's been said, Zinc is a made for emulating these titles in 3d using your graphics card, mame is not.

Please be glad that people are trying to help. I'm only mad here because your taking a tone.

--- End quote ---

What kind of approach to find a solution is saying "ooo, buy a new computer" without trying anything else first?  Not everyone has $1,000 to spend to just play couple more games.


--- Quote ---First, I hate it when people equate time with quality experience.
...
I'm only mad here because your taking a tone.

--- End quote ---

Looks like you are taking a tone here.  FYI, I hate when people make generalizations like this.  Trying a newer/different video card (with more memory) does not mean lack of quality experience, as it's obvious his card is very old with little memory and probably with very old drivers.  Borrowing a card is certainly cheaper than buying a new computer.  There is certainly no need to have any experience to say:  "Hey, get a new Dell" to constructively solve any question/problem.


--- Quote ---Second, you are way way better off knowing the specs and what you need than buying parts cuz it will probably help.
Third, it's been said, Zinc is a made for emulating these titles in 3d using your graphics card, mame is not.
--- End quote ---

Once again, the better video card is for the better 2D support.  Nobody is talking about 3D at this time.

--- End quote ---

No one is saying to buy a new machine, thats a bit silly.
And if you've got friends who will let you borrow their card to see if it helps, thats smart too.
I'm just saying to read up on things and not BUY hardware on whims.
Mame does not use the resources on your graphics card, 3d or otherwise - the processing is handled at the motherboard because the Mame devs want to keep the machine emulation as pure as possible and so they don't handle any of the processing on your card, 3d based or otherwise.
All a card will help in mame is display wise, like if you want to make mame display on a TV or some such.

Sorry I can't point to specific article, it's been a bit since my last reading but thats kind of always been the mame dev stance, archive and study purpose before playability. People have been complaining about the lack of card use and such for a long time and the only way that'll change is a modified build of the mame source optimized for card usage.

Good luck with things, let us know what you decide to do.
Glaine:
Ah, rereading this stuff I see that actually quiet a few people are suggesting to buy a new PC, and I spose I can see why, cuz the CPU chip. Because how many people really just buy that when for just a bit more you can get a whole new PC?

Sorry, didn't read everyones posts. Any who, by this time you've heard enough opinions to make an informed decision. Good luck.
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