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sort of legal roms question
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elvis:

--- Quote from: RayB on October 18, 2006, 10:56:49 am ---I'd like to hear your solution Elvis. What would be better than the current copyright system?

Your digital argument is quite flakey, considering I can do the same minute analysis of ink droplets being arranged on processed trees.

The length of copyright is flawed. The DMCA is flawed. But I hope you aren't one of these nuts that argues there should be no copyright on anything.

--- End quote ---
Absolutely not.  Copyright is a very important process in ensuring that inventors are given the time they need to fairly bring their product to market, and prevent other people from using the exact same system/process unfairly.

Emphasis on words like "fairly" and "unfairly".

Current copyright laws aim to be anti-competitive.  They don't just stop another group making the same item/system/formula/whatever, they stop them competing AT ALL.  People holding copyrights are abusing them and the legal process itself to extend them where they don't belong.

The grand irony of it all is that copyright was designed to give inventors a fighting chance.  Today it's used by the rich and powerful to stifle invention and hold technology back.

Just because I think something is flawed doesn't mean that I think it should be stopped all together.  Don't assume I'm that black and white about it.  Copyright needs to go back to grassroots and people need to remember why it was ever conceived in the first place.  The points you touch on above are a good starting point.  Decreasing the time frame of copyrights (particularly in such a fast moving industry as technology) as well as scrapping the blatantly anti-tinker laws like the DMCA would be a damned good start in fixing some of these issues.

I'm a firm believer in capitalism, but not at the cost of society.  Call me a "socialist capitalist" if you like, but copyright needs to serve the people fairly across the board, and not only those with all the money.  I believe in getting rich by working hard, not by being an arsehole and stopping your competitors from even being able to try in the first place.

As for my "flaky" digital argument - the point is that a paper/ink scenario costs money.  In my little mental game above where I propose I could constantly re-arrange my hard disk sectors over and over again and potentially make a copy of all the data in the world past, present and future - this costs me nothing in terms of physical resources (other than my initial hard disk outlay).  Again, you can't apply a "ink and paper" analogy to anything digital (doing the same mental game with the printing press would cost you MILLIONS in paper and ink). 

The problem with law in general is that the vast majority of the laws in developed countries dealing with digital technology *ARE* based on paper and ink, or other archaic technologies.   Again, I have no desire to destroy the copyright system all together, and I don't condone copyright infringement in the slightest.  But the simple fact of the matter is that the laws governing copyright are out of date, and need updating.  Things like ad-skipping, digital format shifting, and other technologies where are perfectly fine are being held back not because of progressive laws, but because of archaic ones.  These need to be updated to reflect what's really going on, and not some outdated and simple incorrect analogy of technology today based on the technology of 100 years ago.  We're making laws today on oranges based on what we used to do 100 years ago with apples.

End rant.  Thank you for listening.
Chris:

--- Quote from: elvis on October 19, 2006, 10:44:47 pm ---Absolutely not.  Copyright is a very important process in ensuring that inventors are given the time they need to fairly bring their product to market, and prevent other people from using the exact same system/process unfairly.

--- End quote ---
Actually, that's patents.
elvis:

--- Quote from: Chris on October 19, 2006, 10:46:41 pm ---
--- Quote from: elvis on October 19, 2006, 10:44:47 pm ---Absolutely not.  Copyright is a very important process in ensuring that inventors are given the time they need to fairly bring their product to market, and prevent other people from using the exact same system/process unfairly.

--- End quote ---
Actually, that's patents.

--- End quote ---
Actually, it's both.  Hence me saying it is a "process" and not a single step.  I'm well aware of the differences between the two.

But argue on semantics all day if you like.  That seems to be all anyone every does these days, instead of actually moving to fix the bigger issues at hand.  Too many lawyers clogging the system with petty arguments.  And lets face it, as long as they're getting rich they aren't going to care about the bigger picture.
 :soapbox:
Chris:

--- Quote from: elvis on October 19, 2006, 11:45:10 pm ---Actually, it's both.  Hence me saying it is a "process" and not a single step.  I'm well aware of the differences between the two.

But argue on semantics all day if you like.  That seems to be all anyone every does these days, instead of actually moving to fix the bigger issues at hand.  Too many lawyers clogging the system with petty arguments.  And lets face it, as long as they're getting rich they aren't going to care about the bigger picture.
 :soapbox:

--- End quote ---
Well, it's not just semantics because of the huge difference in time limits.  I think most of the "classics" patents have expired.  The copyrights keep getting extended, though... they won't expire in our lifetimes.  :(  The system is in pretty serious need of reform!  I don't think a lot of the patent/copyright examiners are really versed in software issues.
elvis:

--- Quote from: Chris on October 20, 2006, 12:55:09 am ---I don't think a lot of the patent/copyright examiners are really versed in software issues.
--- End quote ---
I think you are being very diplomatic when you say that.  I would go as far as to say they are utterly clueless when it comes to anything remotely involving software and/or digital technology.
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