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| arbrandes:
--- Quote from: wbassett on April 28, 2008, 09:18:40 am ---A major step up would be if they dropped the bulky ugly LED setup and went with a gyro system like the Wii mote and Gyration uses. (Interesting note: Gyration helped develop the tracking system for the Wii mote). --- End quote --- No can do. Gyros are not enough for absolute or constrained positioning. That's the whole reason why a Wiimote also uses IR LEDs. By the way, my only doubt regarding using the Wiimote as a lightgun on the PC is whether the available drivers support the IR tracking subsystem. If they don't, this means we only get access to the gyros. But by their very nature it is next to impossible to extract reliable absolute positioning from them, much as any kind of mouse. That's why mice suck at substituting for lightguns, another reason why there are so few PC lightgun games. Trust me, I have a gyro-equipped remote (Gyration's very own Universal Media Center Remote), and even though it's great for web browsing on the TV, Google Earth, and AudioSurf, it absolutely *stinks* as a Mame light gun. So you might as well give up the idea that you'll be rid of the IR LEDs any time soon, on any platform. |
| arbrandes:
--- Quote from: wbassett on April 28, 2008, 09:24:18 am ---Sadly I didn't find this site until after my actual build was underway and I had already purchased the TopGun. --- End quote --- Which is to say, if you had found the forum beforehand, you would still have bought the TopGun (as I did, simply because there are no alternatives), but would not be so disappointed with its shortcomings. ;) Enjoy your stay! |
| wbassett:
--- Quote from: arbrandes on April 28, 2008, 09:37:24 am ---No can do. Gyros are not enough for absolute or constrained positioning. That's the whole reason why a Wiimote also uses IR LEDs. By the way, my only doubt regarding using the Wiimote as a lightgun on the PC is whether the available drivers support the IR tracking subsystem. --- End quote --- I have seen a few people get it working fine as a mouse pointer in Windows, but haven't seen anyone use it for Mame yet. --- Quote from: arbrandes on April 28, 2008, 09:37:24 am ---If they don't, this means we only get access to the gyros. But by their very nature it is next to impossible to extract reliable absolute positioning from them, much as any kind of mouse. That's why mice suck at substituting for lightguns, another reason why there are so few PC lightgun games. --- End quote --- Like I said, I'm still giving them a try but will admit I am frustrated with it. If nothing works, then I'll play around with it, even if it works like a mouse and isn't exactly like a light gun that would be better than how it is now. Otherwise it's a $60 laser cat toy ;) --- Quote from: arbrandes on April 28, 2008, 09:37:24 am ---Trust me, I have a gyro-equipped remote (Gyration's very own Universal Media Center Remote), and even though it's great for web browsing on the TV, Google Earth, and AudioSurf, it absolutely *stinks* as a Mame light gun. So you might as well give up the idea that you'll be rid of the IR LEDs any time soon, on any platform. --- End quote --- Good points. I was looking at a lot of demo video's about the various air mice available and yes I agree they don't have any constraints and you can point them anywhere and move the mouse, so getting it to track the target with the gun is going to be a problem. Perhaps a better and more elegant LED solution for the time being. One thing I keep reading about are LED issues with the TopGun as well as interference from just about anything. In this respect, and my often made comparison, the Guncon 3 flat out works and works well, so we know this technology can be made stable and robust. Again, I want to say this to make sure I don't sound argumentative, I really am not trying to be confriontational and I am enjoying this discussion. In the big scheme of things I can afford the $66 I spent, but am disappointed. My son was thinking of getting a TopGun too because he thought it was the coolest thing ever, but he works part time minimum wage and $50 or $60 is a big deal to someone like him. I tried my gun out on three different systems too, so I am giving it a lot of attempts. If the Guncon 3 LEDs don't work (which I'm pretty sure they won't), then maybe I'll check on getting some new strips from EMS. I don't want to put a ton of money in it though and still end up with issues, but I'll go that step and get replacement LEDs before calling my experience a total failure. |
| arbrandes:
--- Quote from: wbassett on April 28, 2008, 09:59:44 am ---I am enjoying this discussion. --- End quote --- Me too! :) --- Quote ---I don't want to put a ton of money in it though and still end up with issues, but I'll go that step and get replacement LEDs before calling my experience a total failure. --- End quote --- When dealing with a niche hobby market (i.e. when you're at the mercy of only a couple of manufacturers), to get things working the way you want you end up spending a good amount of a combination of three things: time, money, and skill. Usually a lot of two of them, either time and money, or time and skill. For example, I have just spent 4 months and in excess of US$1500 to assemble my dream computer chair [1], and it is *still* missing some parts. The same goes for my open-source based home-theater PC, to which the TopGun is connected. I guess I wasn't too disappointed in the gun because I'm used to spending countless hours having to debug, adjust, and occasionally replace every single component of the system, from the keyboard to the version of Mame. Damn, I had to rewrite the Linux driver just to get Mame to see the gun! The point is that at least to me, fiddling and experimenting is just part of the fun. But that's because I'm willing to commit the (rather meager) time and resources at my disposal. If you don't have enough time and resources, and are not willing to commit to learning the required skills, then just don't start. So my advice to your son is this: "Buy your dad's gun once it's working, and let him spend money on getting it up to speed". My advice to you is this: "Since you're putting up the venture capital, get your son to take the brunt of the fiddling and adjusting." ;) Oh, and as soon as I scrounge up some more of those precious resources (this is starting to sound like an RTS game), I'm going to tackle the Wiimote idea. Will post results, naturally. ;) [1] http://picasaweb.google.com/arbrandes/TexasBallshaker5000 |
| wbassett:
--- Quote from: arbrandes on April 28, 2008, 11:01:03 am --- --- Quote from: wbassett on April 28, 2008, 09:59:44 am ---I am enjoying this discussion. --- End quote --- Me too! :) --- Quote ---I don't want to put a ton of money in it though and still end up with issues, but I'll go that step and get replacement LEDs before calling my experience a total failure. --- End quote --- So my advice to your son is this: "Buy your dad's gun once it's working, and let him spend money on getting it up to speed". My advice to you is this: "Since you're putting up the venture capital, get your son to take the brunt of the fiddling and adjusting." ;) Oh, and as soon as I scrounge up some more of those precious resources (this is starting to sound like an RTS game), I'm going to tackle the Wiimote idea. Will post results, naturally. ;) [1] http://picasaweb.google.com/arbrandes/TexasBallshaker5000 --- End quote --- No worries on his part, If I get it working reliably I'd give it to him and get another one for myself. I have to confirm this, but a third party source (doncha just hate those!) said they called Act-Labs and were told to look for a gun that works with LCD, Plasma, and projectors in June or July... so I'm going to give them a call to try and confirm that. Looks like something may be coming sooner than we thought. :) |
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