Not sure if I WANT a career.

[paigeoliver]

I am sitting here at work, I just finished up a 4 hour marathon session of Mario Kart, and I was trying to decide if I wanted to eat cereal, watch Star Trek, or post on message boards next when I had a realization.

I am just not sure if I WANT a career. Right now I get paid for an unsupervised 8 hour shift that consists of about 30 minutes of work, and 7 hours and 30 minutes of video games, movies, food, soda, internet, and computer.

I mean, what kind of real world job could begin to compare? I might stop thinking about other career paths and simply think about simply moving to another employer that offers insurance and vacation days.

[Daniel270]

As long as you're HAPPY at what you do, then go for it!  Too many people have "careers" that they're not usually very happy with, having higher stress which leads to health problems down the road.  The main concern would be that you keep enough money to pay your bills and have enough left over to do things you love to do... whether it's arcade games, going bowling or watching Jessica Simpson on the big screen. 

[Bones]

You get 7-1/2 hours per day to do pretty much anything you want and you want to move to an employer that offers holidays? 

You could use this time to do part time work and maybe double your income which will subsidise any insurance costs, or you could even learn to play the bag-pipes in this spare time.

[paigeoliver]

You get 7-1/2 hours per day to do pretty much anything you want and you want to move to an employer that offers holidays? 

You could use this time to do part time work and maybe double your income which will subsidise any insurance costs, or you could even learn to play the bag-pipes in this spare time.

Well, I am still guarding a phone, so I can't go wander the streets or go wait tables or anything.

I used to do some serious ebay selling from work, but it quickly took over my whole life.

I'm a hotel auditor, I sit behind the counter at a hotel in the middle of the night. I have like 10 minutes of paperwork to do, 5 minutes of deliveries, and like 15 minutes of assorted stuff (routing phone calls, checking people in, etc). So, basically I can do whatever I want, as long as it doesn't look bad, or keep me from answering the phone/minding the counter.

[Bones]

No, I didn't actually mean get up and work elsewhere..... Something flexible like a data entry job, the kind I see here advertised for mothers who stay at home and have a computer, stuff like that.

You could do this 4-5 hours per day, still do your current job and have heaps of time to goof around. Another 100 hours pay per month (even at bare minimum wage). would be beneficial and you could afford some bag-pipes.

[paigeoliver]

No, I didn't actually mean get up and work elsewhere..... Something flexible like a data entry job, the kind I see here advertised for mothers who stay at home and have a computer, stuff like that.

You could do this 4-5 hours per day, still do your current job and have heaps of time to goof around. Another 100 hours pay per month (even at bare minimum wage). would be beneficial and you could afford some bag-pipes.

From what I understand those positions (along with essentially every other "work from home" business you can find) are scams.

But I COULD create a fake (but cute) 19 year old female persona and draw crappy pictures of unicorns and sell them on ebay. You know what, that might be the ticket right there.

[Bones]

From what I understand those positions (along with essentially every other "work from home" business you can find) are scams.

Me must live in very different lands.

I am 100% positive if I picked any average industrial area and started knocking on doors I could find work that I could do at home.

It might be boring repetitive stuff like folding customers statements and putting them in envelopes at end of month, but it would be something that would generate additional income.

Edit-Bloody quotes....

[GameOver]

I am sitting here at work, I just finished up a 4 hour marathon session of Mario Kart, and I was trying to decide if I wanted to eat cereal, watch Star Trek, or post on message boards next when I had a realization.

...Right now I get paid for an unsupervised 8 hour shift that consists of about 30 minutes of work, and 7 hours and 30 minutes of video games, movies, food, soda, internet, and computer...

You're my HERO!  Are you hiring?  When can I start? 

[M3talhead]

I am sitting here at work, I just finished up a 4 hour marathon session of Mario Kart, and I was trying to decide if I wanted to eat cereal, watch Star Trek, or post on message boards next when I had a realization.

I am just not sure if I WANT a career. Right now I get paid for an unsupervised 8 hour shift that consists of about 30 minutes of work, and 7 hours and 30 minutes of video games, movies, food, soda, internet, and computer.

I mean, what kind of real world job could begin to compare? I might stop thinking about other career paths and simply think about simply moving to another employer that offers insurance and vacation days.

I did that for about 2 years, work the night shift at our IT shop.

When there isnt anyone around using the machines, its hard for computers and servers to crash all by themselves. We were just there incase WWIII broke out. I can't tell you how many trips to Blockbuster I made, or how many late night Taco-Hell orrs were put in, but what I can tell you, is that it gets old. After about a year of playing games every night, beating them, and realizing how much time you've wasted, it leaves nothing left at home when you get off work.

On top of that, advancing up the corporate ladder (I.E. making more money) becomes harder since nobody is there to see the quality of work you do. I finally got off the graveyard shift and began working among the land of the living, and I can tell you this.....the money you make after people start to recognize your performance outweighs the "game time" you have as a zombie.

[SOAPboy]

I am sitting here at work, I just finished up a 4 hour marathon session of Mario Kart, and I was trying to decide if I wanted to eat cereal, watch Star Trek, or post on message boards next when I had a realization.

I am just not sure if I WANT a career. Right now I get paid for an unsupervised 8 hour shift that consists of about 30 minutes of work, and 7 hours and 30 minutes of video games, movies, food, soda, internet, and computer.

I mean, what kind of real world job could begin to compare? I might stop thinking about other career paths and simply think about simply moving to another employer that offers insurance and vacation days.

I did that for about 2 years, work the night shift at our IT shop.

When there isnt anyone around using the machines, its hard for computers and servers to crash all by themselves. We were just there incase WWIII broke out. I can't tell you how many trips to Blockbuster I made, or how many late night Taco-Hell orrs were put in, but what I can tell you, is that it gets old. After about a year of playing games every night, beating them, and realizing how much time you've wasted, it leaves nothing left at home when you get off work.

On top of that, advancing up the corporate ladder (I.E. making more money) becomes harder since nobody is there to see the quality of work you do. I finally got off the graveyard shift and began working among the land of the living, and I can tell you this.....the money you make after people start to recognize your performance outweighs the "game time" you have as a zombie.

Laptop
Internet
Pick any MMO title

7 hours goes by realllly fast when your grinding off a few levels in a MMO.. Could do that for decades myself

[ChadTower]

On top of that, advancing up the corporate ladder (I.E. making more money) becomes harder since nobody is there to see the quality of work you do.

Advancing up the ladder can be overrated.  I did that.  I spent my time as a co-op, then as a junior engineer, an engineer, a senior engineer, then as an engineering manager.

After 5 months of managing, I left to move back down to senior engineer/architect.  I was sick of being responsible for others' work without producing anything tangible myself.  Being a manager sucked HARD.  Twice the stress and four times the accountability.  I can easily see why people without the technical skills cling to management because it's all they can do at this level, but it was not for me.

The idea of climbing the corporate ladder to the top, at least in my field, is outdated. 

[Stingray]

Completely different line of work, but I have pretty much the same schedule as you Paige. I have to answer the phone a few times a day, each call takes a couple minutes. I have a few people that come in my office every day, those take about as ling to deal with as a phone call. The rest of the time, I'm more or less just goofing off. Ain't life grand?

-S

[Scott84]

If your not gonna get a careeer. Then you better start saving a pension by yourself.

[ChadTower]

They main factor here is insurance and salary.

[Bones]

Advancing up the ladder can be overrated.

[ChadTower]

Yep, me too.  When I was interviewing for this spot, the company was thrilled they were pulling me back down (their opinion, not mine) to fill a role for which I was far more than qualified.  In my mind, it was escape from management and slipping into a nice, easy, low stress senior engineer's role again.  Now I work a straight 40 and see my kids every night.

[TOK]

I have good days and bad days, but I'd rather work hard and have the house, cars, motorcycle and other stuff than have a cake job and scrape by.
I can drink and watch movies and play games after work or on weekends.

[Dartful Dodger]

I mean, what kind of real world job could begin to compare?

When I was waiting tables through college, I hated it and wanted to find a "real world" job.

[shmokes]

Well, I dont know how many hours you had to work for that 12k, but garbage men do get paid quite a bit -- about $20/hr usually.  And these days all they do is drive up and push a button to make the truck's arm reach out, grab the garbage can and dump it in the truck.

Maybe you should take a closer look at possibly shoveling garbage.

[GameOver]

I mean, what kind of real world job could begin to compare?

...wait tables with him on the weekend.

[Bones]

Yeah in my new job, well the one I have had for the last 3 years, I start at 7:00am and finish at 3:00pm. I am home by 3:30pm and get to spend time with the kids.

Prior I was working 7:30am to 5:30am as a manager, by the time I got home at 6:30pm or 7:00pm there was just no quality time for me to do anything and I just felt trashed and angry all the time. As for weekends, by the time I started feeling even slightly relaxed and de-stressed it was time to go back to work.

I can say that even if my new job paid less I would still be happier. Sure I might have a TV for my cab instead of a D9200, but things like this are a small trade off in the big scheme of things.

The only real thing I lost in the transition was a company car. Again, small time payoff considering everything else.

[ChadTower]

I have good days and bad days, but I'd rather work hard and have the house, cars, motorcycle and other stuff than have a cake job and scrape by.

If you did enough prep work, got enough higher education, and were skilled enough, you can have a cake job and still make an excellent salary.

[GameOver]

I have good days and bad days, but I'd rather work hard and have the house, cars, motorcycle and other stuff than have a cake job and scrape by.

If you did enough prep work, got enough higher education, and were skilled enough, you can have a cake job and still make an excellent salary.

Sounds like you speak from experience!  Pretty subjective, tho.  How much is enough?

That sounds like a lotta work.  How about a dollar and a dream, baby!

[hyiu]

My $0.00002 of personal opinion...

if you're still young, I would say don't slack off in your career AND education.

yes, you'll have a good time now, and probably make enough for you to spend (and then a little bit left...)

but what you need to look into is the future.

I think a normal path for a guy (or even a woman) is to get married, have kid(s) and so on.

in this society, although you are not necessary to completely supply for your girl / wife / kids... it is pretty normal for the family to "lean" on the "man of the house"... the husband...

you don't need a well pay job now, but you do need to be good at something that can make money...
it can be design, programming... ebaying... selling...

but I think watching movie / playing video game / ... etc doesn't really fall into category.

imagine, 10 yrs from now, can you still do this job ?? More realisitcally, do your employer still wants you ?? If there is no skill required, why not hire a even cheaper college dropout at that time (young and strong) why still keep you ??

and if they don't keep you ?? Can you still make a living which is same or better than now ??

well... of course, there's no guarantee (even if you're good at something...) but I still think having sort of a "plan" is better than none.

you can call me navie, but I believe that if you work hard, in the long run, in life's own strange way, it'll pay off.

[TOK]

I have good days and bad days, but I'd rather work hard and have the house, cars, motorcycle and other stuff than have a cake job and scrape by.

If you did enough prep work, got enough higher education, and were skilled enough, you can have a cake job and still make an excellent salary.

I'm a telecomm field dude. I worked in management for two years. All I thought I wanted while I was working outside was to get an office job. I did it, and it was the biggest mistake I ever made. After two years I was ready to quit if they couldn't get me back out in the field. Working in an office was hell for me. I didn't laugh at the cutesy crap other people found funny, didn't like politically correct banter, and really hated the butt-kissing politics (and hated getting my butt kissed when I was the one tasked with OK'ing contracts). The only good days I had were when it rained, and that was just because I wasn't outside.
I realized there were about 80% more nice days than crappy ones.
A field position opened, I took a step back, and have never regretted the decision. I have a company vehicle (to take home, too), can get all the overtime I want, I'm out on my own all day, and I'm accountable only for my own work
Time drags for me if I'm not active, I'd rather be hustling and have the day go quickly.

I realize everyone's different. One persons cake job is another persons hell.

[paigeoliver]

...

[Bones]

Also, realistically, I am over a decade behind on any prep work, and I am going to have a felony (credit card fraud) haunting me the rest of my life. Not to mention the fact that I am not eligible for student loans anymore, since I didn't make any payments on my original ones for years and they eventually garnished them.

Karma.

[Bones]

And by nothing but sheer coincidence, I have just been handed an Internal Vacancy position for a job very similar to what I do now but in one of our "sister" companies.

The difference? This place is less than 1 mile from where I live.

Ohhhh.... very tempting.

[paigeoliver]

And by nothing but sheer coincidence, I have just been handed an Internal Vacancy position for a job very similar to what I do now but in one of our "sister" companies.

The difference? This place is less than 1 mile from where I live.

Ohhhh.... very tempting.

Take it, take it. You can save plenty of money for new motorcycles by not having to drive to work anymore.

[Scott84]

All i know is that im not settling for working for anything less then $50,000 CDN.

Houses around where i am cost $300,000-$400,000. Im sure with me and my future wife we need to make $100,000 atleast to keep living in this beautiful but costly city that we are in.

[Bones]

Take it, take it. You can save plenty of money for new motorcycles by not having to drive to work anymore.

I have made a call to discuss the position and still waiting for the phone back.

At the surface, this new job appears to involve more physical work day-to-day than I currently do. This may be a problem.

The truth is my hands are absolutely ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. Sure I can lift stuff, like building my cabinet on the weekends but my hands always ache until around Wednesday after pushing myself on Saturdays & Sundays.

I suspect this new job would put me in a whole world of discomfort lasting 24/7.

[Scott84]

what exactly is wrong with your hands? Arthritis?

[shmokes]

I expect that when I finish school I'll very likely get hooked up with a law firm and get worked like a dog.  I'll probably be making really good money, but I'll likely be working 60 and 70 hour weeks.  But then I'll move up the ranks and as new kids fresh out of law school are hired I will work less hours and make even more money.

[Bones]

what exactly is wrong with your hands? Arthritis?

I broke 5 metacarpals, radius, scaphoid and ulnar styloid in a motorbike accident last year.

Arthritis should strike with great vengeance and furious anger in about 10 years.

[shmokes]

...in a motorbike accident last year.

It's a chopper, baby.

[M3talhead]

what exactly is wrong with your hands? Arthritis?

I broke 5 metacarpals, radius, scaphoid and ulnar styloid in a motorbike accident last year.

Arthritis should strike with great vengeance and furious anger in about 10 years. 

Dont worry, by then, your ---tallywhacker--- will be to limp to mess with anyway......

[Bones]

Dont worry, by then, your ---tallywhacker--- will be to limp to mess with anyway......

Hey c'mon, I will only be 45 in 10 years. I have a lot more action left in me than 10 years worth! 

The doctors say if it were not for my giant Australian genitalia which cushioned the impact I would have suffered spinal injury.

[duffjr]

hey which mario kart do you play?  i don't like any of them much except the one for snes.  here is our site:  smk.lportal.net

we are having an international meetup in a couple years and will eventually offer real money when we have careers.

[danny_galaga]

wait a minute...
has anyone ever seen paige and stingray in the same room together...

[rchadd]

read the book "rich dad poor dad"

getting a career and working within the "rat race" is not a way to become wealthy. working harder is not the only way to make a living.

http://www.richdad.com/
 

[ChadTower]

Sounds like you speak from experience!  Pretty subjective, tho.  How much is enough?

That sounds like a lotta work.  How about a dollar and a dream, baby!

I do speak from experience.  Though there are others in my workgroup who find the job very challenging, or who are at the limits of their skills, I find it absolute cake because I have a stronger technical background and experience base than they do.  And that takes into account being the technical resource of our group.

As for money, obviously not posting a number, but I make enough that I was able to buy a house in Eastern MA, we have two reliable cars, and we don't hurt for money.  My wife has always been home with the two kids so we can raise them properly.  This is NOT a cheap cost of living area... but with some basic lifestyle sacrifices, we do quite well.

It CAN be done, but Paige has put himself so far behind and disqualified a few options, that he's going to have a hard time with it.  Then again, if it were easy, he'd have already done it.

[Santoro]

Paige, two things.

Business is becoming more competetive every year, and therefore companies are becoming more and more efficient..

[ChadTower]

Yeah, but some people would look back and say that you spent your life managing machines that make rich people richer.  I feel like that in some ways about my career.  That is why I stepped back from it and put the focus on my family.  When I interviewed here my primary requirement was that I was coming here so that my career could support my family from now on, rather than having my family support my career.

I think that was the day I changed back from a career to a job.

[paigeoliver]

read the book "rich dad poor dad"

getting a career and working within the "rat race" is not a way to become wealthy. working harder is not the only way to make a living.

http://www.richdad.com/
 

I am on another forum based on finances, and they tore that book completely to shreds, it is a total fabrication. The "rich dad" did not exist, and his actions were completely illogical to those in the know.

[paigeoliver]

Well, they HAVE to have someone minding the counter, they can't ship that overseas. There is simply no way around staffing the counter overnight at a full service hotel.

Also.

I come from a lower class background. I am single. I cannot get student loans. I have a brief criminal record. I make no impression at interviews. I am 28.

I would have to focus my life COMPLETELY on "the rat race" for a decade just to get my foot in the door, and then I would be facing age discrimination for the entry level positions.

[ChadTower]

I come from a lower class background. I am single. I cannot get student loans. I have a brief criminal record. I make no impression at interviews. I am 28.

Every one of those is an excuse.  Even the sum of their detractions is not enough to prevent advancement.  What is preventing your advancement is the fact that you don't seem to want it very much.

I would have to focus my life COMPLETELY on "the rat race" for a decade just to get my foot in the door, and then I would be facing age discrimination for the entry level positions.

And your point is...?  That is the cost, you either want it or you do not want it.  You would not be facing age discrimination at 34, which would be the latest time at which you hit the entry level.  If you did it well you could hit them at 31 or 32.

[paigeoliver]

I come from a lower class background. I am single. I cannot get student loans. I have a brief criminal record. I make no impression at interviews. I am 28.

Every one of those is an excuse.  Even the sum of their detractions is not enough to prevent advancement.  What is preventing your advancement is the fact that you don't seem to want it very much.

I would have to focus my life COMPLETELY on "the rat race" for a decade just to get my foot in the door, and then I would be facing age discrimination for the entry level positions.

And your point is...?  That is the cost, you either want it or you do not want it.  You would not be facing age discrimination at 34, which would be the latest time at which you hit the entry level.  If you did it well you could hit them at 31 or 32.

34?

How in the world can a single person, who makes $11.35 an hour (too much to qualify for any student aid, unable to receive student loans due to past problems), ever get a degree in 5 years?  I couldn't even come up with the money for it in that period of time, much less complete the classes.

I would LIKE to have a better situation, but I sort of feel like it is just something doomed to failure.

[ChadTower]

34?

How in the world can a single person, who makes $11.35 an hour (too much to qualify for any student aid, unable to receive student loans due to past problems), ever get a degree in 5 years?

[Santoro]

Paige, I don't mean to say that your job will be shipped overseas, they will just look at the productivity an adjust the job so that you have to work harder for your money.

I have seen a lot of hotels that have the gift shop right next to the check-in counter.

[paigeoliver]

I went to a tech school briefly. It took me years to pay those 6 months off. I never learned a single thing, and I was miserable from the 30 hours of classes per week (combined with 40 hours of work, and then church on sunday). I knew every single thing they were teaching, and I was more knowledgable than my teacher was in one of the subjects).

I am legally required to work full time, otherwise I go to prison (still have a year and a half of that left).

I filled out the FAFSE last year under the pretense of going to community college, I didn't qualify for anything.

And from what I understand from reading the student loan stuff is that I am no longer eligible because of my previous ones.

I could pay for part time community college, after 4 years of that I would be 33 and have 2 years done. Then what? All nontraditional education costs an arm and a leg, it would take me 3 years of work to pay for each part time year afterwards.

[ChadTower]

Right... well, you're convinced.

You need to stop thinking about the things you cannot do and start searching for things you can do.  Until you do that you will never move forward.

[ChadTower]

I have an idea.  Most of your problems stem from your past problems with the law.  You're not sure what your options are, but you (at least say you) have a sincere wish to improve yourself and your career options.  Who could you ask for advice on this?  Who would know your exact situation and what your best options are?

Your PO would be that person.  I bet your PO would know exactly what you could do and may be able to guide you to specific places or connections his office has.  I would be surprised, as well, if he doesn't have some discretion about that full time or prison concept.  That is meant to keep you from being idle or supporting yourself illegally.  It is not meant to be a limiting factor in advancing your personal situation.  Maybe he can skew it a bit if you have proof that you are in school and succeeding.

[paigeoliver]

I don't have an officer anymore, I have an 800 number that I call and punch some buttons, and every once in a while it tells me I have to send a paycheck stub in. I can leave a message when I call in, my last message garnered a response 18 months later.

But, I only have 1 year and some odd months left of that, so that part of it isn't so limiting.

The limiting part is the fact that if I am disqualified OFFICIALLY from many many companies, fields and positions, and I am disqualified unofficially from many more. Remember, I make no impression in interviews, never have. I have gotten all my jobs from nepotism, or from employers who simply hire everyone they interview. I have never gotten a job from a "real" interview. So I am not going to be the guy who they "have to have" so much that it overcomes my record.

That means I can either lie about it, and hope no one checks (I really don't want to do that), or I can pursue something like being a diesel mechanic or something else skilled, but blue collar, in which case it won't matter.

I could probably get myself one of those worthless 2 year degrees fairly easily, but the one that counts would be a massive challenge.


One other issue, I also sort of feel that if I throw myself completely into chasing a degree for the next decade that I will sabotage any chance I ever had at marrying a nice youngish girl. Not that I seem to have much chance now. 

[ChadTower]

Erm, where do you think is more likely you're going to find that youngish girl?  Sitting in a trailer or in college classes? 

A 2 year degree is not worthless if you use it as a stepping stone to a 4 year degree.  The 2 year degree is only worthless if you stop there.

Your answers are so damn obvious and you have no desire to see them.  You are a crappy interview.  So change that.

[paigeoliver]

Erm, where do you think is more likely you're going to find that youngish girl?  Sitting in a trailer or in college classes? 

A 2 year degree is not worthless if you use it as a stepping stone to a 4 year degree.  The 2 year degree is only worthless if you stop there.

Your answers are so damn obvious and you have no desire to see them.  You are a crappy interview.  So change that.

Actually I wouldn't expect to meet anyone doing either one. I HAVE gone to college in the past (only have a few credits, but I have gone). Went to Community College for most of a semester without ever even having the occasion to speak to a single person. Tech school at night was slightly better in that aspect, I did talk to people, BUT EVERYONE was a strung out full-time worker/full time student, and there wasn't an unattached girl in any of my classes.

Almost all my friends met their wives in college, but they all met them in the socializing of dorm life, and not during lectures. That is one thing I can say FOR CERTAIN that is closed off to me now.

This hasn't been entirely fruitless, it has persuaded me to at least give the old "disco with books" another shot.

[ChadTower]

Most of a semester of Community College?  Been to Tech School, apparently didn't finish?

Sounds to me like you have a larger root cause problem to address, bro.  You need to figure out why you never start the things you finish.  That will always haunt you and be a huge obstacle.

[Stingray]

Almost all my friends met their wives in college, but they all met them in the socializing of dorm life, and not during lectures. That is one thing I can say FOR CERTAIN that is closed off to me now.

Why do you say that? I never lived on campus, but I went to plenty of dorm parties and met (and dated) a lot of hotties as a result. All you have to do is make  some friends who do live in the dorm. 28 is not[/i] that much older than the typical college student, despite the fact that you seem to have convinced yourself that you're a fossil. I'm 35, and I'm certain that if I started college classes today, I could be at a dorm party this weekend.

-S

[ChadTower]

I went to some parties at my brother's college when I was in my late 20s... I felt really out of place.  I agree with Paige on that one.  The 35 year old in the room may be accepted by the guys, but unless you're hot, the girls want little to do with you.

[Scott84]

Its never too late to go to school. Life sucks sometimes and you gotta suck it up and make change. Go to school all day and work all night. Thats what my life is like currently. Thankfully they gave us laptops at school and i can surf all day while learning stuff.

The only way to be sucessful in life is view your life as successful. If Paige is having the time of his life doing what he is doing then leave him be. Paige is more then knowedlgable that he can go out and do things and get a degree, get a better job. Make a difference.

All we need to do is motivate!

[Stingray]

I went to some parties at my brother's college when I was in my late 20s... I felt really out of place.  I agree with Paige on that one.  The 35 year old in the room may be accepted by the guys, but unless you're hot, the girls want little to do with you.

Phew. It's a damn good thing I'm so frackin' hot then.

-S

[ChadTower]

. If Paige is having the time of his life doing what he is doing then leave him be. Paige is more then knowedlgable that he can go out and do things and get a degree, get a better job. Make a difference. 

Did you even read this thread?  He came to us.

[Santoro]

Yeah, but some people would look back and say that you spent your life managing machines that make rich people richer.

Everything is relative, my friend.

[ChadTower]

You could also say that if you were not doing that, someone else would be... therefore, you could be doing something more personally rewarding without impacting what you currently do in the least.

IMO, way too many people spend their lives fighting to get up the corporate ladder without realizing at some point to step back and live for a while along the way.  I was going that direction myself when I pulled the plug and decided to spend max time with my kids.

[Santoro]

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you.  I have climbed the ladder rapidly and am concerned about the fact that my quality of life seems to get worse with each rung I climb. 

I live live in a similar circumstance to you... Nice suburb of a major US city, three kids, two cars, stay-at-home-wife.  My problem is that I am getting paid a career rate, stepping back to a 'job' would mean I have to pick up and move to a cheaper area.  We are torn as to whether that is worth the disruption to the kids.

[ChadTower]

What would happen if you moved down the ladder a rung to a job for which you are overqualified, yet still paid a livable wage?

[Santoro]

'Livable' is the key word there.  Livable where? It woud be tough to take any cut and stay where I am. 

[ChadTower]

That does make it more challenging. 

[paigeoliver]

Most of a semester of Community College?  Been to Tech School, apparently didn't finish?

Sounds to me like you have a larger root cause problem to address, bro.  You need to figure out why you never start the things you finish.  That will always haunt you and be a huge obstacle.

Community College. I was working a full time job AND a part time job in an attempt to actually pay for myy classes. Did 40 hours at one job, 30 at another, and had a few classes in my few off hours. I burned out quickly.

Tech School. Sanford Brown does "quarters" not semesters, and you literally sit through 4 hours of class 6 days a week. I did a "half quarter" (an intro deal, 2 days a week for a rather short period), and then a full quarter. I got my schedule for my next "quarter", and I promptly left the school. I was $8000 in the hole for those classes, I had not learned a thing, and I was presented with another schedule of 24 hours per week of classes that would not teach me anything, had nothing to do with my supposed program of study, and would cost me another $6000. I simply refused to take on that kind of debt and stress in a program that had not taught me anything, and might never.


I am way too old, calmed down, and conservative to hang out in dorm rooms smoking pot and trying to chat up drunk girls fresh out of high school. Last year I went to my denomination's college age retreat, I was among the older people who went (there were perhaps a half dozen of us in the 24-27 age range). I found I simply could not relate to guys that age at all. Did fine with the girls though, I could talk to them just fine, and I spent most of the weekend with a couple of college freshman girls. But they seemed too young for me to actually get interested in.

[Scott84]

. If Paige is having the time of his life doing what he is doing then leave him be. Paige is more then knowedlgable that he can go out and do things and get a degree, get a better job. Make a difference.

[Stingray]

I am way too old, calmed down, and conservative to hang out in dorm rooms smoking pot and trying to chat up drunk girls fresh out of high school. Last year I went to my denomination's college age retreat, I was among the older people who went (there were perhaps a half dozen of us in the 24-27 age range). I found I simply could not relate to guys that age at all. Did fine with the girls though, I could talk to them just fine, and I spent most of the weekend with a couple of college freshman girls. But they seemed too young for me to actually get interested in.

Damn that whole "time difference" thing. Where's Bones when you really need him? I'm on pins and needles waiting for his response to this statement.

-S

[shmokes]

I never learned a single thing, and I was miserable from the 30 hours of classes per week (combined with 40 hours of work, and then church on sunday).

I love how you quit school because you never learned anything that you didn't already know, but continue going to sunday school.  Church is so dumb.  Believing in god or some kind of higher power, while there is little logical reason to do so, is fine if it gives you a sense of security.  But why waste one of the few days you get to yourself sitting there having someone tell you stuff that you've known your entire life?  At least with each new semester at the school you would finish with a subject and move on to another one.  Do you really think that god is so insecure that she sits up in heaven, omnipotent, omnicient, and yet fawns over our gushings and compliments about her?  Do you think that her confidence is so feeble that she will be sent into a rage if you don't sit for hours every week listening to someone tell you the same things that they told you last week (and every week for as long as you can remember)?  Rubbish.  We aren't made in god's image.  She's made in ours.  By that, I mean flawed.  She's a crazy, jealous ---smurfette---. 

Anyway, if you could stick with any given plan for more than a couple months maybe you'd actually have finished your introduction courses and moved on to the specialized, advanced courses where you could have started gaining some useful knowledge/skills.

[ChadTower]

IIRC, he said he teaches sunday school for kids, not sits in church and listens to mass all day.

[paigeoliver]

IIRC, he said he teaches sunday school for kids, not sits in church and listens to mass all day.

What I teach is children's church, which is where the kids go rather than being bored to death by adult sermons that they can't understand.

I teach the 3-5 age group, which is REALLY frustrating, it is near impossible to target a lesson at that wide of an age range (and it doesn't help that all the pre-done lessons they give me are aimed at second graders). If either the 3 or 5 year olds were gone it would really help me, but engaging both ages is tough.



I actually don't attend sunday school, my church doesn't currently seem to offer a class suited for me. The only adult class that isn't "couples", "seniors", "women", etc is taught by a very nice guy who gives an hour long monologue that would go over the head of most ministers. 

I would actually prefer to teach sunday school to that same age group, but someone else has done that class for years.

And schmokes, thank you so much for your well thought out and insightful critique of Christianity.

Truthfully I am not very involved in my church anymore. Not like I used to be. I used to go to church 3 times a week (plus sunday school), and I hosted a bible study (that makes 4), and there was the church softball team (that makes 5), plus there were frequent other events.

Now I just go on sunday morning, and teach my class once a month (also on sunday morning). My beliefs aren't any different, but before a lot of it was social, and that part is mostly gone (the whole 20s scene sort of vanished at my church in the last couple years, all the single people got married or moved, we stopped having activities, etc).

[Bones]

Damn that whole "time difference" thing. Where's Bones when you really need him? I'm on pins and needles waiting for his response to this statement.
-S

I missed my chance. The moment has now passed.

[hyiu]

Paige... after reading your msgs, I think you have a motivation problem..
before things even start, you already claimed the outcome... FAIL...
that's no good...

I have a master degree, however, I still have not break the 6 figure yet.... (which is bad for me...)
among my friend... there's one.. who doesn't even have a college degree, he's well into 6 figures... what does he do ?? car salesman, chinese kitchen.

EDUCATION is always good. not just technical stuff... I mean in general.. even history, physics, .... all knowledge is good...

but if you have problem with financial aid... don't need to break your back to go for a 4 yr college...

how about sales ?? a lot of sales positions doesn't require a degree...

also... how about something like real estate broker license ?? those doesn't take much $$, and you can get it in about 2 months of courses...

you said you never make an impression at interview...
let me tell you this...
AT WORK, EVERY NIGHT, YOU HAVE 7 HOURS TO PRACTICE TO THE MIRROR !!!!!
How about that ?? go surf web...
learn the posture, learn what to say, learn what to ask, learn how to dress, learn what to bring, learn what to prepare...
give yourself A MONTH !!!

go to 1 of your friend and practice afterwards...
yes, it sounded dumb and stupid, but it works...
keep working on it until you make an impression at interview...

what I'm saying here is...
you see a problem and you stopped there saying because of your past, it won't work....
that's not good...
you need to apply BYOAC mind to the problem... OK !?!?!

you want to play ikari warrior, find a way to mount the mouse to the joystick to rotate !!!!
 

if you're already very happy about yourself now, and feel comfortable about your future, then by all means do nothing...
but if you want a better life (not corporate ladder stuffs... not millionare...) just have more $$ in your pocket in general...
just more steady life in general....
then instead of wasting 7 hrs each night playing video game, watching movie, surfing web..... spend 1/2 the time to improve yourself !!!!!

read some reviews, buy a few books on sales technique....
(ULTIMATELY, EVERYTHING IS SALES.... either you sell a service, or you sell good, or you sell yourself...)

in your case, with your past, office work might not be the best for you... (hey... I really donno here...)
but if white collar is no good.. try blue collar !!! fixing car is always good... fixing house is always good.... plumbing / electric ... all those are decent jobs !!....

you can wire a cab, how about a house ?? you said you have a past... then work cheap for 6 months.. give them some advantage so that they let you step into the industry... let you prove yourself...

and FORGET about getting girls for now... even if you meet one, do you think you can afford her ?? treat her to decent places, movies, and all that ?? Come on... not that all girls are materialistic... but if you simply cannot provide, its a turn off...

when your life is settled... on track... then girls will come....
although I don't know you in person, my guess is.. girl should be low in your priority list for now... even if you put it up there, you won't score much anyway....  (by that, I don't mean to diss you.... ok ??  )

ok.... I guess I speak too much.....

[GameOver]

Holy crap!  You guys were busy on this one today...let's see we got

Chad    14 posts
Santoro  5 posts
Singray   3 posts
Paige      8 posts

All between 7:30am ET thru 2:25 ET

from our distinguished group of senior (software?) engineer, global desktop support lead, and propane gas rep (taste the meat, not the heat!) telling a hotel night auditor how to get it together.  Sounds like you guys need to practice whatcha preach!  I'm gonna report the whole lot of ya to each of your respective HR depts (where the hot chicks are). 

I expected better from you, Stingray.  You're the official slacker yet only managed 3 posts.  This will reflect badly in your review.   

Paige, don't listen to these guys.  They're trouble.  'Go read Rich Dad, Poor Dad'!

[Kremmit]

There's going to be a huge constriction boom a couple hours downriver from you.  You're pretty handy, I imagine you could handle framing or plumbing.  Oh, and electricians make bank.  Know anything about 'lectricity? 

Smart construction laborers often transition into their own small construction companies, once they've learned the ins & outs of the biz.  And nobody will care about your record.  My mother in law just built a house, the general contractor is a convicted felon- and for something worse than fraud, too.  He did time in Pelican Bay for whatever it was.  He's living high on the hog, got a hot wife, two kids, a nice new two-story home on 5 acres, a nice truck (contractors all have nice homes & trucks), horses, dirtbikes, a boat, etc.

Of course, they won't have internet on the job site.  No Sugar Corn Pops, either.

[Scott84]

There's going to be a huge constriction boom a couple hours downriver from you.

[paigeoliver]

I briefly left my hotel job to be involved in a small construction company owned by friends.
The boom is slowing, and they are now losing money on contracts they made 3 and 4 years ago when gas was $1.25 a gallon.

[Bones]

Maybe you could join Amway.

[DrewKaree]

Maybe you could join Amway.

One doesn't "join" Amway.  You are assimilated.

[Bones]

Did you just call me an ass?

[markrvp]

Maybe you could join Amway.

One doesn't "join" Amway.

[DrewKaree]

Maybe you could join Amway.

One doesn't "join" Amway.  You are assimilated.

   ROTFL 

I went to enough Amway rallies with my parents to fully appreciate that statement.

I was badgered by enough of them to know the depth of truth present in that truth

On the minus side, though, I never ended up with a part time job that made me more money than my full time job.

Seems MLM isn't for slackers.  Who knew?

[Daniel270]

is Amway even still in business?

[Bones]

That's a good point. I haven't had any attempted canvassing for many years....

[Daniel270]

the reason I ask...  I've used their products (particularly the laundry soap), but haven't seen anyone still in the business to ask....

[paigeoliver]

is Amway even still in business?

Yes, but they are more focused on the "Quixtar" name now, which is their internet branch.

Now this is a HOOT. Let me explain how Quixtar works. You pay THEM money and in return you get a code you can give to people so that they can get into Quixtar's "Internet Mall". You get a percentage of the sales, and you can recruit people of course.

Yes, their solution to e-commerce is a website that you can only get into by meeting a member in person and getting a code. There are no sales, as the prices are amongst the highest on my web.

They have a "business meeting" at my hotel every few months, credit card is declined every time. Seems to be about 70 percent turnover in the group from one meeting to the next.

[paigeoliver]

the reason I ask...  I've used their products (particularly the laundry soap), but haven't seen anyone still in the business to ask....

They are, if you want to order the soap just find a Quixtar person (might be one here), and you can get the little code to order it from their website.

My boss at work is one, but I am not going to get the code from her, because I want her out of that nonsense, 2 years with no sales, you think she would get the idea, but she hasn't.

[Bones]

Although far from a fan of this particular type of business, I think for certain people it can be successful.

[duffjr]

this isn't for everyone, but many people do live like this:  you can be a hustler or professional gambler.  most weeks, you'll be living in a cheap hotel, but other times, you'll be partying with the world's elite.

[paigeoliver]

Although far from a fan of this particular type of business, I think for certain people it can be successful.

Yes, but the statistics in the company reports show otherwise.

Main problem is that no one wants the products, no one buys the products other than people who sell them. The public just doesn't want to buy their household goods from a "friend" at twice the cost, and have the friend trying to recruit them all the time.

Now Avon and Mary Kay are MLM too, but people actually buy those products. Very, very, very few of their salespeople make more than fast food wages.

[Bones]

Yes, but it is a numbers game.

You recruit enough people believing in their dream and all using the products themselves and this can represent a substantial turnover of product. Product in which some of the original inflated purchase cost is filtered back to you, the sponsor.

The people that succeed in this business are the ones that build the enthusiasm in their group. They are a particular type of person and the best word I can find is FAKE.

This type of scam is not reliable on external sales which in fact represent a insignificant part of the total turnover.

Remember,  70% turnover still means 30% stay!




Disclaimer:Bones is in no way affiliated with Amway or any Australian Adult Sex Shops.

[Kremmit]

My buddie's wife & mother-in-law are heavy into Quixtar.  There's more to it than just the internet code.  They also get rebates on the stuff they buy themselves.  But wait, you only get the rebates if you buy enough stuff that month.  So they go and buy a year's worth of toilet paper, or "try out" some new granola bars, or whatever, just to make their monthly quota.  They go to like 3 meetings a week, so the local motivational Quixtar priest can keep the fires stoked, and make sure that nobody has been telling them they've been getting ripped off.  Oh, and the prices on the stuff?  They can order from a lot of online stores, like Target.com, at the same price you would pay if you walked into the store- plus they get their rebates, so that's a good deal, right?  Oh, wait, I forgot, they pay shipping on all this crap they could just get at Target, or the grocery store.

I briefly left my hotel job to be involved in a small construction company owned by friends.
The boom is slowing, and they are now losing money on contracts they made 3 and 4 years ago when gas was $1.25 a gallon.

I'm anticipating a construction boom along the gulf coast.  Call me crazy.

Disclaimer:Bones is in no way affiliated with Amway or any Australian Adult Sex Shops.

I believe the Amway part.

[jbox]

They also get rebates on the stuff they buy themselves.

This is one of my favourite parts of the cult. This is like people who buy a super-mega-meal which they never finish simply because it is "better value for money". Yeah, lets pay 10% more for something so that we can get 3% of that back!   

[shmokes]

My buddie's wife & mother-in-law are heavy into Quixtar.

I would divorce my wife.  There's not much that would elicit an ultimatum from me.  My wife could go back to Christianity (within reason).  She could get heavy into scrapbooking.  She could start taping daytime soaps or talkshows.  But I wouldn't stand for her getting mixed up in MLM much more than I would a drug or alcohol addiction.

[Bones]

I would divorce my wife.  There's not much that would elicit an ultimatum from me.  My wife could go back to Christianity (within reason).  She could get heavy into scrapbooking.  She could start taping daytime soaps or talkshows.  But I wouldn't stand for her getting mixed up in MLM much more than I would a drug or alcohol addiction.

Big words from a man with a disturbing <gay> pez collection.

Damn.... I just wasted my 2000th post on shmokes, I always thought I was destined for something much better.

Ohh well, at least I got the opportunity to accuse shmokes of gayness so it was not a complete waste.

[shmokes]

Still says you've got 1999.  And you know....I'd never thought of it before, but Pez Dispensers do have a bit of a phallic shape.  What would Freud say?

[Bones]

Well crap.

Being told I was wrong about my 2000th post and then having to use my 2000th post to reply and thereby acknowledge my mistake just plain outright sucks.

I'd never thought of it before, but Pez Dispensers do have a bit of a phallic shape. What would Freud say?

ya ya, pez in der archstole. deefer, deefer

[ChadTower]

I bet Quixtar sells Pez.

[Stingray]

propane gas rep (taste the meat, not the heat!) telling a hotel night auditor how to get it together. 
I expected better from you, Stingray.  You're the official slacker yet only managed 3 posts.  This will reflect badly in your review.   

For the record, I gave up the propane job recently. I'm now working at (or maybe in) a gay bar. We still use the same slogan though.

-S

[ChadTower]

From propane to pro pain.

[duffjr]

i recently left my job that sucked--12 bones an hour and i had to work at least another year to make 25 as a waiter which isn't bad but it's only 25 or so hours a week and too far from school.

i took up internet poker and sports betting.  it has been profitable at times i've concentrated, but i have this problem of letting it ride on longshots so my profits are minimal.  if you have balls of steel and don't mind playing with 30% of your savings on any day, it won't take more than a few weeks to start to profit from a game.  there is this one guy that always gives me money when everyone else is beating the crack out of me....as long as i don't lose my head, i will leave up 100 in 30 minutes when this guy shows up.  but there are so many deals that if you are a break-even player, you can still profit for a few months off site bonuses. 

and if you refer a big money player, you can make a few grand a month just off that one guy until he quits his addiction.  if you know many rich businessmen, this can be a highly profitable business without the horrible losses that a gambler can take at any time.

[Truecade]

Become a plumber.  Seriously.  The pay is very good, and it's something that society will always need.  There is much more to the job than unclogging people's toilets.

Case in point:  I spent 5 years getting an engineering degree while one of my neighbors started training as a plumber about 10 years ago.  I've been an engineer for almost seven years and he makes more $$$ than me and works fewer hours. 

I've read about people with technical degrees becoming plumbers because the pay is better and there's less stress.  And to be honest, I've personally never met a poor plumber.....

Food for thought.

[duffjr]

or a poor locksmith...the bastard came to open up my arcade machine...he used my screwdriver and wedged it open and i said that doesn't count as unlocking it, so then he said he attempted to unlock it before realizing it was the wood.  he gets to charge 15 bucks for 2 minutes of work.  then the guy comes to clean my carpet at 10, and he says, "you know how much money i've made today?  600 dollars.  doing what?  sucking water.  i mean i do a good job but the pay is great.  you don't need school."

[ChadTower]

It wasn't 2 minutes of work.  It took him how long to drive to and from your house?  That is part of his workload.

[duffjr]

no he had a visit across the street and i asked him over.  plus, he charged 65 bucks to dig a key out of my car in 5 minutes.  if i only, i had had his miniature tools.

[ChadTower]

Hey, I have some advice for you.

Stop losing your keys.

[duffjr]

i don't have a keyrack or a keychain.  i figured keys should be safely hidden two years before i would ever need them again.