gas pumps

[missioncontrol]

I'm not one to say much about the price of gas but last night when I headed off to work it was $2.69.   Today on my way home after classes it ranged from $3.09 and up. There were gas lines everywhere....

first I tried to go to Sam's (usually the cheapest) It was unreal I couldn't even see the pumps from the lines of cars.

another place on my way home had a line

[Stingray]

That's great.

-S

[walls83]

a $1.69 a gallon last night where the hell do you live.? In 1980?

[missioncontrol]

doh I ment $2.69


I need sleep

[Stingray]

Just asked someone in the office if he noticed the gas prices while he was out earlier. He said gas has gone up by about 10 cents a gallon since this morning. He didn't notice any long lines though.

-S

[shmokes]

When I was in high school (1993-96) gas was less than $1 per gallon.

[Stingray]

When I was in high school (1993-96) gas was less than $1 per gallon.

When I was in high school (1985-1988) I once bought gas for 49 cents a gallon. That was a one time deal, but it was generally about 69-79 cents. I remember when it hit a dollar I thought that was just outrageous.

-S

[Shape D.]

When I was in high school (1993-96) gas was less than $1 per gallon.

Back in the good 'ol days 97 cents. Now we got these whippersnappers behind the counter wanting us to pay $3.20. and their customer service skills are terrible. dang kids.



Oh crap, I'm getting old.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

mrC

[Dartful Dodger]

Fill your tanks now.

[Shape D.]

Wow, I would have thought premium would have been a different appendage.

[missioncontrol]

well I left for work around 11:00 P.M. last night....

got out of classes at 3:00 P.M. today.....


a little bit more than 10 cents for us.....

and I saw the lines it was wild........

btw some call-ins to the radio station (News A.M. ) reported $3.24 right off the interstate.......

[missioncontrol]

Wow, I would have thought premium would have been a different appendage.

yeah....

no more sons........ 

[Shape D.]

One "beanbag" per gallon. And three gallons wouldn't get me very far.

[Arcadiac]

Here in Louisville, KY, $3.09, all stations raised to this price at the same time, up from $2.46 in some places just yesterday. 
No lines here, people wouldn't pay $2.69 last week, maybe we're getting a bit smarter about the price-gouging. 
Real or imagined gas "crisis", as soon as the media reports a
"projected increase", prices go up, usually within a day!
$3.09 is more than double the price this time last year, somethings gotta give!

ARCADIAC!

[Ed_McCarron]

somethings gotta give!

Yep.  I'd like to see it be the taxes we pay on gas.  We've got to cut back on OUR spending to make ends meet, I'd love to see the government do the same.

Heard something on the radio a month or so back... Some politician in Jersey was getting criticized by other politicos for actually suggesting that the gas tax be used only to fix the roads, clean the air, etc...

I think its time to hold the government responsible for it's spending.  I'm getting tired of handing them a third of my paychecks and seeing nothing for it.

[Shape D.]

They were originally expected to drop after this weekend. I'm guessing now it will take longer. I bet after thanksgiving it will be a little easier on us though.

[Clonedsheep]

How far is everyone driving in a day? That is the scary part. I am driving close to 40 miles a day with school and work. I was planning on upgrading my ride to a nice truck but now I think I will wait a bit.

[Ken Layton]

When I was a kid, gas was 19 cents a gallon.

[Dartful Dodger]

When I was a kid, men didn't drive 4 cylinder cars.

[shmokes]

  We've got to cut back on OUR spending to make ends meet, I'd love to see the government do the same.

Don't get me wrong, I would absolutely love to see that.  But I think you are confusing revenue with spending.  For example, Bush has made good on his promise to lower taxes, but has significantly increased federal spending. 

C'est la vie.

[DrewKaree]

When I was a kid, gas was 19 cents a gallon.

Of course, cars weren't invented yet at that time, so you guys just looked cross-eyed at 'em and wondered what that stinky juice that caught fire was for

[Zakk]

It's $1.29 a litre here.

[GameOver]

When I was a kid, gas was 19 cents a gallon.

Whoa!  We can only wish.  I tried to check your profile for your age, but it seems not many folks around here like to share that info.  That's ok Ken - we gotcha figured out by your $.19/gal reference!  Isn't that when the Edsel was the rage?

I'm in metro Richmond, VA.  Premium went to @$3.05/gal here today (Wednesday).  Not too bad except I commute 65 miles/day, and the wife just started back to school 75/miles day.  OUCH!

[SirPoonga]

It's Katrina's fault.

Anyway, for those outside the US, yeah, we know you pay more, too bad for you.  But when gas has prices have doubled in the last two years that is budget changing difference.  It is also putting alot of small businesses in trouble or under.

[Ed_McCarron]

It is also putting alot of small businesses in trouble or under.

I work in a field service capacity and may drive 2 hours to get to a job.  My truck has a 34 gallon tank.  Costs about $80 to fill up.

Guess how much of a "Fuel Surcharge" gets tacked onto the bottom line now.

[SirPoonga]

Yep, my mom is a book keeper for a small trucking company.  She doesn't think they will survive this fall.  She's been working there for almost 10 years now.

[Zakk]

It's Katrina's fault.

Anyway, for those outside the US, yeah, we know you pay more, too bad for you.

[JackTucky]

Oh, that's right, as long as it's not happening in the US who cares. 

Now yer gettin it!

Art

[paigeoliver]

One easy trick I noticed about when it is a good time to fill up and when it is a bad time is the price difference between regular and diesel.

If regular is higher than diesel than the price is gouged, and you should avoid buying gas. If regular is cheaper than diesel then it is a good time to fill up.

Last night the station next to my work had regular more than 40 cents higher than diesel!!

Btw, I drive a Geo Metro on a 10 mile commute!!! I get mileage in the high 40s! Society will fall apart from high gas prices before it actually effects me!! 

[DrewKaree]

That doesn't make sense.  Diesel is less-processed oil, right?  It should always be less than gasoline because of that, at least it's been that way a good chunk of my life.  The only reason it hasn't been more popular is the notion that it's dirtier than gas and less efficient, I thought....yet another reason it was cheaper.

Meh.  We'll go back to driving Chevettes, Pacers, and Gremlins again unless we need to haul stuff around - kids, trailers, cars, etc.

[paigeoliver]

That doesn't make sense.  Diesel is less-processed oil, right?  It should always be less than gasoline because of that, at least it's been that way a good chunk of my life.  The only reason it hasn't been more popular is the notion that it's dirtier than gas and less efficient, I thought....yet another reason it was cheaper.

Meh.  We'll go back to driving Chevettes, Pacers, and Gremlins again unless we need to haul stuff around - kids, trailers, cars, etc.

Historically diesel has always been about 10 cents a gallon more in my area, so my advice may be regional.

[DrewKaree]

Historically diesel has always been about 10 cents a gallon more in my area, so my advice may be regional.

Same here - the regional part.  That's something I didn't consider.  Do you guys have to deal with that reformulated crap we're forced to use?  I know IL, WI, and MN have to use it (but I don't think it's statewide in any of those states), but I dunno if MO has to.

[DrewKaree]

I just saw a story on the news about gas being jacked up in Georgia all the way to $5.87/gallon.

[sodapopinski]

in one of the largest oil producing regions in north america and its going up another 20 cents per litre by midnight. $1.25/L. its crazy

[paigeoliver]

No lines here at all, no one is even buying gas. Not even at the gas station next to my work, the James Taylor concert just let out across the street and there is only one lone car getting gas, (lots of them parked buying sodas and stuff though).

Same thing at the station by my house where I stop for a soda every night, one car getting gas, half a dozen people buying slurpies and lotto tickets.

[quarterback]

I just saw a story on the news about gas being jacked up in Georgia all the way to $5.87/gallon.

I heard the same thing earlier.  $6 in Atlanta and you had to wait in line to get it.

[SirPoonga]

It's Katrina's fault.

Anyway, for those outside the US, yeah, we know you pay more, too bad for you.

Oh, that's right, as long as it's not happening in the US who cares. 

Convenient you only quote partial and not all of what I said.  It all goes together.  The point was gas price doubling, no matter where you are at, is a big budget changing matter.

You don't see me complaining that the drinking age in Canada is 19, you can legally smoke a joint in Amsterdam, or australia's television is completely digital so when it gets broadcasted over here it gets downgraded.  Get with it, each country is different and their own pros and cons.  If you don't like people in the US commenting on how expensive gas is just walk away, because we can point out advantages you have over us also.  No need to make it worse.

[paigeoliver]

I'd buy gas for $7 a gallon if I could get some of that free canadian healthcare!!

Most of the rest of the world is better equipped to deal with higher gas prices, the sheer SIZE of American, combined with it's terrible zoning laws, lack of usuable public transit for 95 percent of the population, and (stupid) cultural nuances assures that Americans drive a whole lot more than people in most other countries.

[GameOver]

I just saw a story on the news about gas being jacked up in Georgia all the way to $5.87/gallon.

I heard the same thing earlier. $6 in Atlanta and you had to wait in line to get it.

Paige's old sccoter is lookin' pretty sexy now...

[Bones]

Paige's old sccoter is lookin' pretty sexy now...

No it's not.

[GameOver]

Paige's old sccoter is lookin' pretty sexy now...

No it's not.

Aren't you sposed to be workin' on your cab?  Go cut some wood or paint 'sumpin!   

[paigeoliver]

Paige's old sccoter is lookin' pretty sexy now...

No it's not.

I agree, right now my "old scooter" is sitting parked, with the handlebars missing. I have the parts to repair it, but my left hand is still damaged, and it hurts too much to seriously grip tools hard, which is what I will need to do to fix it.

[Bones]

You want to be very careful paige. There is a bone in your wrist known as a scaphoid bone. It is common to break this bone and not be aware of it, people just think their wrist is a little sore. I can confirm this, I broke mine and it feels very different to other breaks.

It is easy for this bone (if not promptly identified as damaged and treated), to be starved of blood flow and die.

This bone is in the centre of our wrists with an orgy of bones surrounding it. The scaphoid bone is substantially responsible for normal wrist movement due to it's direct interaction with the surrounding bones. When this bone dies your wrist is fused together and then you might as well not have a wrist at all. It will be completely useless. You won't be able to hold a drink, put change in your pockets or a million other things you probably would never consider.

Scaphoids break as a result of an "open hand fall".  A scaphoid break is usually treated by 8-10 weeks in plaster compared with 6 weeks to most other breaks because of its unique nature and vulnerability. I am not trying to spook you but I do know a little about these things.

[paigeoliver]

The pain is actually in the hand, and not the wrist. If we are going to point at a bone, then the pain comes from the area where the bone leading up to the pinky is.

[Bones]

That's a metacarpal bone. I broke 5 of those. You would know it if they were broken or even fractured.

[paigeoliver]

Right now my bigger problem is my left ankle. It wasn't really hurt in the accident (only a tiny bit of pain, which passed after a few days), but 2 weeks ago I played a few rounds of "Pump it Up" and woke up the next morning with a pretty bad limp that hasn't gotten any better.

[psik0tik]

I own a painting company and I spent over 300 filling up 4 trucks today...this is going to suck.

[Jabba]

Prioces jumped 20% overnight here in Canada. Its amazing how quickly these &^%&^%& gas companies can jack the price!!! $1.26 a litre at a local gas station I passed this morning on the way into work!

[Zakk]

Check SirP's post above.  Too bad for you, Canuk 

What really reeks is that we don't even get ANY petrolium from the states. In fact, Ontario gets most of our gas from Alberta, and the rest from Europe.  We are suffering a 'shortage' because the states have requested more from Alberta, and of course they'll send it there before they give it to us.  We should stick some cows and softwood into the deal, if they don't buy all three, they don't get any!   

I think Canada is like #2 in the world for oil reserves.  I wonder how quickly GW would see 'terrorists and Canadian WMD's!!!" here if we cut off supply.  Dang, we'd have $.03 cents a liter if we weren't sending it all stateside.

I, for one, am hiding my maple leaf WMD's as we speak... 

[Harry Potter]

Fuel in Australia is on $1.20 per litre at the moment. Considering 6 months ago it was around 90 cents that's a bad rise. And they're tipping it may go up to $1.60 soon.

May be a good time to buy a bike.

[Stingray]

Gas has gone up by almost 25 cents a gallon since yesterday morning here.

-S

[SirPoonga]

I think Canada is like #2 in the world for oil reserves.  I wonder how quickly GW would see 'terrorists and Canadian WMD's!!!" here if we cut off supply.  Dang, we'd have $.03 cents a liter if we weren't sending it all stateside.

Really but it looks like Canada is our main import if I read this correctly
http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/data_publications/company_level_imports/current/import.html

Of course, if you total up the entire middle east it blows away what we get from canada.

[Zakk]

We want Alaska back!!!  Take your shiny beads! 

[SirPoonga]

We want Alaska back!!!  Take your shiny beads! 

Sorry, changed my post, had to go look for stats to back it up

[SirPoonga]

Check SirP's post above.  Too bad for you, Canuk 

I want to clarify my point before this gets out of hand.

First, I direct you to
http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/global_gasprices/

You will see that the main reason other countries pay more is because the gas is taxed more.
So when you say "well, your lucky you pay that for gas" what you are really saying is "out tax structure is different and gas is taxed higher than you".  But you fail to realize then that we probably have some stuff stuff taxed higher than you. 

It's like when I lived in Minnesota.  I had a Wisconsin friend visit and we were at some outdoor mall.  I was complaining about the price of some shirts.  Every MNers reading this right knows exactly what I am going to say.  He turns to me and says "Well, your lucky you have no sales tax on clothes."  That may be so.  However, WI has a different sale tax structure but pull about the same amount of money.  For WI there is a 5.5% sales tax on everything.  For MN there is a 6.5% sales tax, clothes are expempt.

So comments like "why are you complaining about your prices rising" are stupid.  You probably have less tax on something else compared to us.  Unfortunately the governments needs to make their money some how.

[Jabba]

Ahh, come to Canada. Everything, I mean EVERYTHING is taxed at 15% (some variance across Provinces). 7% for the Feds and 8% for Provincial. Services included. That doesn't include Income Taxes, Property Taxes. If I had my way, I'd move to NH. 0 sales tax, but I think the property taxes are herfy though....

[SirPoonga]

0 sales tax, but I think the property taxes are herfy though....

Exactly my point.  we may have less tax on some stuff compared to you but we also have higher on other stuff.  Like I said, when all is said and done the government still needs to make its money.

[Stingray]

the government still needs to make its money.

Hold the phone, I thought they were they guys who print the money. Who prints the bacon?

-S

[SirPoonga]

the government still needs to make its money.

Hold the phone, I thought they were they guys who print the money.

So?

Who prints the bacon?

Slaughter houses

[Stingray]

the government still needs to make its money.

Hold the phone, I thought they were they guys who print the money.

So?

So, uhm... I dunno.

Who prints the bacon?

Slaughter houses

Is that a branch of the treasury dept?

-S

[missioncontrol]

Asheville, NC update  ****

gas in now anywhere from $3.39 and up (that is if they have any)

most places are out of the cheap stuff so add another 20 cents to that.....

the places that do have it have lines again today....

people are filling up every gas container they own......

[missioncontrol]

oh and between work and school I drive about 90 miles a day.....

and that's if I don't have to go anywhee else.....

I have to fill up every four days........

[Jabba]

Well, at least I only drive about 10 miles a day back and forth to work. I usually have to fill up every two weeks. But still, 80$ to fill up is STEEP man! I could buy 6 Joysticks for that amount 

[Dartful Dodger]

I've got over 3/4 of a tank, it might get me through the weekend, but prices go up so quickly, and go down so slowly, that I'm not sure if I should wait till Tuesday or just keep filling my tank until prices hit 3.50, then just hope they go down before I go empty.

[DrewKaree]

Paige's old sccoter is lookin' pretty sexy now...

* DrewKaree searches for some more rocks

It's pretty simple, really.  Combine a decent travel holiday and the loss of a few refineries and the laws of supply and demand are displayed in vivid detail.  The problem isn't that we have a loss of oil, so Bush is doing a dumb thing by tapping the reserve. 

What the hell good does getting more OIL do us, when the problem that no one seems to be willing to face is that none of us put oil into the gas tank of our car.  The problem is that we have less refineries to turn the oil into the stuff that we DO put into the gas tank of our car. 

As Zakk said, their prices are going up because we asked "pretty please", so they have less to sell in their country.  Less here, our prices go up.  Having to buy it from Canada, the prices go up.  Shipping it from Canada, Canada's prices go up. 

Take the whole fiasco in GA.  Some newspaper printed some inane story about how we're gonna be running out of gas, and everyone panicked and drove to the gas station.  That area is going to quickly be out of gas precisely because everyone wants to fill up before they "run out".  In turn, it's going to cost more to replace that gas because of the refinery issue.  With people panicking the way they were, they'd have to raise prices even more, because perhaps now, instead of ordering one truckload of gas, now they've got to order two truckloads, and it's gonna take longer to get there.  Longer to get there means it costs more for shipping it...and so on and so on.

For the love of Pete, I bought gas yesterday morning at about 5 A.M. and it was $2.69/gallon.  2 hours later, it was $2.99/gallon.  Today, it was $3.29/gallon.  There WILL NOT be a shortage of gas.  These prices will keep people from buying as much gas, or waiting until they really need to.  Just look at some of the comments in this very thread.  Because of the refinery issues, the increase in prices will allow the stations to cover their prices in having gas replaced.  Because of the refinery issues, it may take longer to have the gas shipped to the stations, and THAT will be the reason you won't be able to get gas at one station, but go right up the street, try a different station, or perhaps different "brand" station (hit a Citgo instead of a BP, or whatever) and you'll get gas. 

The problem is the refineries and the stupid, downright idiotic rules and regulations in place at the local levels in your areas.  I'm in WI with SirP, and check this out.  He lives about 2 hours away from me.  In my area, or actually an area that extends to about an hour-ish away from him, the stations are FORCED to pay for some stupid reformulated gas that is proven to be LESS efficient, and cost MORE money.  And as someone pointed out, if all these political blowhards on ANY side of the aisle wanted to do something to reduce prices, they'd temporarily suspend the numerous taxes on each gallon of gasoline.  To say "Bush has to do something about the price of gas in this time of crisis" is simply pointing out to everyone that you're an idiot and don't understand or care to educate yourself on all the things that go into the cost you are paying for gasoline right now, and gives credence to someone using a disaster to further their political aspirations.

4 trucks @ $300?  This isn't meant to be a "I can top that", I'm just pointing out that I'm getting hit pretty good too.  I have 1 truck, 3 large machines, and several 2-stroke machines I had to fill up today.  $284.34  It simply makes piss-poor business sense to not pass along these costs to the customer, as it's the price of doing business.  There's a reason people who do service-type work like painting and landscaping usually limit themselves to a certain area to begin with - you'd lose your shirt on travel and fuel.  Why would such an exorbitant increase in gas not be passed on....or do people still bid out jobs based on the gas prices at the time they founded their companies?

Not ripping on you, just explaining good business practices.

[Zakk]

It simply makes piss-poor business sense to not pass along these costs to the customer, as it's the price of doing business.

[DrewKaree]

It simply makes piss-poor business sense to not pass along these costs to the customer, as it's the price of doing business. 

Umm, you're fired as my landscaper. :zing!:

The way I see it, you can afford to buy my gas for a few months   Heck, sell a few more houses and pay my freight, and I'll commute!

[Zakk]

How true!  Check that latest PM!  I think I can finally afford to become a Republican! 

(you're still fired, gouger).

[Setabs]

I just hate that as of right now the $3 gas that we pay cost the gas station we got it from less than $2.50 to purchase it.  IE they paid a certain amount for a truck to fill there tanks.  That i believe is the only cost of gas they incur.  So the gas should be a fixed price at that station until there next shipment arrives, then it can go up according to the price of that shipment.

Let me try and explain alittle more.

A station received it gas on Friday and paid say 2.15 per gallon.  they set there price at 2.30.  Then over the weekend they raise the price because of how much a barrel is trading for.  Then hurricane hits, supply gets restrained and they raise the price more.  Two weeks later when prices start to come down they receive there next truck of gas at 3.00 per gallon.   So the whole time gas prices where going up they where just increasing there profit.  I think its pretty f'd up that oil companies are getting record profits.

[/incoherent rant]

[DrewKaree]

How true!  Check that latest PM!  I think I can finally afford to become a Republican! 

(you're still fired, gouger).

You've got a lot of learning to do before you can apply to become a conservative.  (Republicans have to learn a handshake and buy several uniforms.  I can't be bothered with all that hoopla.)

You can't fire a fellow conservative.  We've gotta look after our own, and you probably didn't realize it before, but you're in the pocket of Big Lawn, of which I am a member.  Get back in line before we have to slap a few random zoning laws on you

[DrewKaree]

That i believe is the only cost of gas they incur.

Gas stations are one of the more tightly contested products in the market.  There's about a 1% profit margin.  The reason it's worthwhile is quite simple.  We need it, and that percentage of something we need is pretty good.  It's the same situation with grocery stores.  What are we gonna do, not eat, not use gas to get to work?

Also, the cost to them from their wholesalers goes up just as fast. 

So the gas should be a fixed price at that station until there next shipment arrives, then it can go up according to the price of that shipment.

Let's say they sell gas at $2.  Let's also say that now because of the hurricane, it costs them $2.40.  Obviously it's gonna cost them more for the same reason it's costing us more - less supply.  The purpose of having a business is to make money, yes?  Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.  Then they have to turn around and buy the next container of gas for $2.40.  You're saying that they should lose the profit they WERE making on the $2 gas, and also lose money on the gas @ $2.40, because any profit they make on it was lost on the last batch.  Let's say it keeps going up.  At what point is it ok for them to try to make a profit? 

It's the same with ANY business.  The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.  If your COSTS go up while your company is in business, you'd be a fool to continue to keep your PRICES the same. 

So the whole time gas prices where going up they where just increasing there profit.  I think its pretty f'd up that oil companies are getting record profits.

The whole time gas prices were going up, you see them as increasing their profits, but when they have to pay the higher prices when they're "out" of that cheaper tank of gas, are you going to feel similarly for THEM when they lose money in your scenario by having to pay a higher price for the gas when they run out?

To add to this with an example, when the Atkins diet was in the news daily and was being tried by everyone under the sun.  I always buy eggs at Sam's club.  Not because they're tons cheaper, but they're pretty reasonable, and we eat a lot of 'em.  Not because we're Atkins freaks, but we just like eggs.  They were $5/box.  The Atkins thing goes nuts.  The box of eggs went up to $13.  It was simple.  I just wasn't going to buy it at those prices, or I was going to work around it - $20 purchase at the grocery store = free dozen eggs, for example.  The price of that box of eggs now?  $6.  Higher than I used to pay, but a price I'm willing to pay and consume at the same rate.  How many folks aren't going to drive somewhere for a vacation because gas is too expensive?  How many people are going to think twice about using their cars or taking alternative methods to travel somewhere?  It's simple.  When less gas is being purchased, the price WILL come down.  It makes piss-poor business sense for gas companies to chase profits at the expense of sales.

I think its pretty f'd up that oil companies are getting record profits.

It's simply not true.  The profit margins are around the 6-7% range.  They may have spikes here and there, but you're being mislead.  Oh, and here's yet another little problem.  IF everyone thinks the oil companies are getting record profits, it's simply foolish to sit there and not take advantage of it.  ANY of these oil companies can be used to your advantage.  Buy stock in them.  It's pretty simple.  Make the higher price work for you, if you think you're getting hosed six ways to Sunday.  Oh, but that involves taking a risk that the company won't give back as big a return.  Well, it's not as simplistic as this, but in a way it is.....if you think they're screwing you through higher prices, and screwing you through keeping all those profits, then you only have a few solutions. 

• Join 'em.  Buy stock, pay more for gas, but offset it with profits when you sell.
• Look into it and learn how you're NOT getting hosed, and realize it's the market at work
• Lump it.  This involves the least work.  You pay the higher price, and realize the market will correct itself soon enough, and do your part to bring prices back down.  Conserve, ride a bike, ride a scooter, walk, carpool, bus it, whatever.  Solve it yourself for your personal situation
• Complain to someone about doing something, realizing it'll result in either nothing being done, or drastic "solutions" that make the problem worse, resulting first in lower prices, then in lower supply, finally in empty pumps and frustration that you can't do what you want BECAUSE of those artificially lower prices.

Really, no one ever likes to think about investing in oil companies and offsetting the "greed" of big oil by making their "evil practices" work against them, but if you think they're hosing you, that's the best way to get back at them.  If it'll make you feel better, donate your profits to the Sierra Club or Greenpeace or something

[jbox]

It's simple.  When less gas is being purchased, the price WILL come down.

For complicated markets like oil, it is possible for the peak price to actually stay there, but then be stable for a lot longer while the rest of the market catches up. Energy demand is always going up, meaning price increases in the long term regardless of evil conspiracies. Price fixing is *bad* idea, since it's cosmetic rather than structural. 

The rest was well put, although a better analogy would have been for a highly desired commodity like bac0n. 

[Gamecab]

I was 16 when I started driving in 1988.
Gas Prices were $1.05 for 93 Octane
A Pack of Malboro was $1.25

As of now $3+ a gallon for gas is plain crazy.
And a Pack of Malboro is $8.00 in NYC.

My Point: (regardless of any political view)
This Just really sucks!!

(Added Note:  I quit smoking about 8 weeks ago)

[DrewKaree]

My Point: (regardless of any political view)
This Just really sucks!!

I don't think anyone can find fault with that logic.  It's a flawless argument

For complicated markets like oil, it is possible for the peak price to actually stay there, but then be stable for a lot longer while the rest of the market catches up. Energy demand is always going up, meaning price increases in the long term regardless of evil conspiracies.

Yeah, I get that, but d'ya see how hard it is to just explain the simple stuff?  Try throwing out your "looney-tunes" idea above and see where that gets ya

Price fixing is *bad* idea, since it's cosmetic rather than structural.

They're bandying it about over here, though.  It's as if no one thinks the oil companies will simply drag their feet in producing the "correctly priced" gas, since they'll be losing money hand over fist if that happens.  Again, there's more to it than just that simplistic bit, but the bottom line is that will be the end result until the market corrects.

I WAS about to put money into some natural gas options until this happened, although I DO think the price is still gonna go higher here. 

The rest was well put, although a better analogy would have been for a highly desired commodity like bac0n.

Who....wha....did someone say b@con?  I heard tofu is selling for $10 a gallon on the forum here....woops....pound

[missioncontrol]

(Added Note:

[DrewKaree]

now if I could only give up gas I'd be a rich man......

You might become rich, but I dare say a main isn't a man unless he's got gas.  Give it up?  I think you're just pulling our finger

[missioncontrol]

[MaximRecoil]

Let's say they sell gas at $2.  Let's also say that now because of the hurricane, it costs them $2.40.  Obviously it's gonna cost them more for the same reason it's costing us more - less supply.  The purpose of having a business is to make money, yes?  Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.  Then they have to turn around and buy the next container of gas for $2.40.  You're saying that they should lose the profit they WERE making on the $2 gas, and also lose money on the gas @ $2.40, because any profit they make on it was lost on the last batch.  Let's say it keeps going up.  At what point is it ok for them to try to make a profit? 

It's the same with ANY business.  The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.  If your COSTS go up while your company is in business, you'd be a fool to continue to keep your PRICES the same.

I didn't see anyone say anything about selling "at cost". What irritates people is the fact that gas that was purchased by the gas stations for say $2 a gallon, is being sold now for like $3.50 a gallon; when they were content to sell that same $2 a gallon gas for $2.50 a gallon last week.

The price of gas at any given station should remain the same for as long as the shipment lasts.

Any station that increases prices mid-supply is price gouging, period. Of course, they have always done that.

Let's say a station gets its tanks filled every two weeks. So they pay $2 per gallon and charge $2.50 a gallon when they resell it. Fine. They make $.50 a gallon profit. They could sell every last drop of that gas at $2.50 for the two weeks and they would make $.50 profit on every last gallon of that gas.

So the next shipment comes in and it costs them $3 a gallon. Now is the time to raise prices to $3.50 a gallon.

Raising prices 3 times in one day? What in the blue hell is that all about? Did they use up and receive 3 shipments in one day? all costing more than the last one? So when gas jumps $.50 a gallon overnight, and then another $.50 cents a gallon or so over the next couple days; you know damn well that most places are suddenly making $1.50 profit off each gallon of gas that they were pleased to be making $.50 cents a gallon off just a few days earlier.

So they need to make money to cover their next shipment? LOL @ that. I'd like to know where they got the money to cover their very first shipment when they opened shop in the first place. The cycle starts with the station fronting the money for the shipment with the hopes that they can resell the entire shipment at a higher price than they paid for it. When that shipment runs out, then the cycle starts again. If you can't afford the next investment then you are out of business. It takes money to make money.

"So you like those generic canvas sneakers huh? Well, I paid $5 for them wholesale but I'll charge you $50 so I can afford to pay $40 dollars wholesale for some brand name sneakers which I will sell for $150 so I can afford to buy some top end Nikes for $100 wholesale..."

What kind of wacky business model is that? Everyone else prices their products based on what it cost them in the first place, not based on what they expect new products will cost in the future. Do car dealer triple the cost of an existing model on their lot because they hear that next year's model will cost nearly 3 times as much?

[AtomSmasher]

I drive a gas guzzling GTO, have to fill its 19gal tank 2-3 times a week and yet I could care less if gas prices are increasing.  I'm sure at some point I'll start to care, probably when I start spending $500+ a month on gas (right now its $300-350/month), but until then Que Sera, Sera

[Setabs]

Let's say they sell gas at $2.  Let's also say that now because of the hurricane, it costs them $2.40.  Obviously it's gonna cost them more for the same reason it's costing us more - less supply.  The purpose of having a business is to make money, yes?  Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.  Then they have to turn around and buy the next container of gas for $2.40.  You're saying that they should lose the profit they WERE making on the $2 gas, and also lose money on the gas @ $2.40, because any profit they make on it was lost on the last batch.  Let's say it keeps going up.  At what point is it ok for them to try to make a profit? 

It's the same with ANY business.  The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.  If your COSTS go up while your company is in business, you'd be a fool to continue to keep your PRICES the same.

I didn't see anyone say anything about selling "at cost". What irritates people is the fact that gas that was purchased by the gas stations for say $2 a gallon, is being sold now for like $3.50 a gallon; when they were content to sell that same $2 a gallon gas for $2.50 a gallon last week.

The price of gas at any given station should remain the same for as long as the shipment lasts.

Any station that increases prices mid-supply is price gouging, period. Of course, they have always done that.

Let's say a station gets its tanks filled every two weeks. So they pay $2 per gallon and charge $2.50 a gallon when they resell it. Fine. They make $.50 a gallon profit. They could sell every last drop of that gas at $2.50 for the two weeks and they would make $.50 profit on every last gallon of that gas.

So the next shipment comes in and it costs them $3 a gallon. Now is the time to raise prices to $3.50 a gallon.

Raising prices 3 times in one day? What in the blue hell is that all about? Did they use up and receive 3 shipments in one day? all costing more than the last one? So when gas jumps $.50 a gallon overnight, and then another $.50 cents a gallon or so over the next couple days; you know damn well that most places are suddenly making $1.50 profit off each gallon of gas that they were pleased to be making $.50 cents a gallon off just a few days earlier.

So they need to make money to cover their next shipment? LOL @ that. I'd like to know where they got the money to cover their very first shipment when they opened shop in the first place. The cycle starts with the station fronting the money for the shipment with the hopes that they can resell the entire shipment at a higher price than they paid for it. When that shipment runs out, then the cycle starts again. If you can't afford the next investment then you are out of business. It takes money to make money.

"So you like those generic canvas sneakers huh? Well, I paid $5 for them wholesale but I'll charge you $50 so I can afford to pay $40 dollars wholesale for some brand name sneakers which I will sell for $150 so I can afford to buy some top end Nikes for $100 wholesale..."

What kind of wacky business model is that? Everyone else prices their products based on what it cost them in the first place, not based on what they expect new products will cost in the future. Do car dealer triple the cost of an existing model on their lot because they hear that next year's model will cost nearly 3 times as much?

Thank you,  that is exactly what I was trying to get across.

Thats also why I was curious about how much profit from the pumps goes back to companies like exxonmobil and citgo.  The companies that cotrol the flow of oil from ground to gas tank.

[HaRuMaN]

I live in Southeast VA...  cheap gas is $3.19 a gallon, forget about premium.   

Gas stations here are starting to run dry, and you can't buy a gas can anywhere.  They're all gone.

[DrewKaree]

I didn't see anyone say anything about selling "at cost".

That's silly.  Even in the quote, you can clearly see the words "Let's say", as in "for example".  Also, in the "didn't see anyone say anything about selling at cost", that would also include me, since I'm anyone too.  Stop being pedantic and try to realize when people are using examples, even if they don't word it as "for example"

What irritates people is the fact that gas that was purchased by the gas stations for say $2 a gallon, is being sold now for like $3.50 a gallon; when they were content to sell that same $2 a gallon gas for $2.50 a gallon last week.

The price of gas at any given station should remain the same for as long as the shipment lasts.

Again and again, those who understand how a business works, and the economics of the situation, understand why it's being done, and if every business in the world was to run their business as "the price of our product should remain for as long as the product lasts" would be out of business shortly, because they'd be leaking and losing money faster than they could make it.  OR - they'd be increasing their prices BANG all at once to cover the now more expensive product.  To put this in words you'll understand - FOR EXAMPLE if a station has purchased gas and is selling $2/gallon and sell the entire amount, when they get their next shipment in, instead of having to raise prices a few cents at a time (or in this case, a few dollars at a time), you're INSANE to think the price would go up only at the level it's currently going up.  They'd now have to sell it at $4/gallon, and you'd be griping because it went up $2/gallon OVERNIGHT, and you'd STILL be here telling us "they're gouging us".  Your business premise GUARANTEES wildy fluctuating prices, and having them happen EACH AND EVERY DAY!  That's silly, and ignores the basic facts of business.  It's one thing to say something is a fact because of your opinion about it, it's entirely another to have it explained to you and still question why, as Setabs has done.

Any station that increases prices mid-supply is price gouging, period. Of course, they have always done that.

Any station that increased the price to the level it would need to in order to continue at the same rate they would have been at for even as short a time as the past container-full would lead to you ALSO telling us it's "gouging", so there's no winner in your scenario either, until you get a grasp on how a business works.  You seem to think that selling all that gas at the price they paid for it would result in some business utopia, but the reality is, if they did it "your way", 2 days after they ran out and prices would go overnight to a CURRENT price of $4/gallon and you'd be here carping about how they're "gouging" us.  The steady rate of increase OFFSETS - that means "helps to LOWER the cost of what's coming", in case you aren't grasping this - the radical price swings and increases that WOULD have to take place to simply remain at the same rate.

That's flat silly and ignoring simple examples you could figure out in your own life.  Don't worry, I'll bring more since you aren't getting it.   Firstly, this:

Let's say a station gets its tanks filled every two weeks. So they pay $2 per gallon and charge $2.50 a gallon when they resell it. Fine. They make $.50 a gallon profit. They could sell every last drop of that gas at $2.50 for the two weeks and they would make $.50 profit on every last gallon of that gas.

So the next shipment comes in and it costs them $3 a gallon. Now is the time to raise prices to $3.50 a gallon.

You're being purposely obtuse to think that the price the wholesaler is charging them only goes up a few cents as well as thinking even a moderately busy (let's say "for example" they take in 20 cars an hour) station has enough supply on hand to last them for more than 2-3 days.  I can't see it any other way, because in all of your examples, you tell us it's the station that's "gouging" us, and you've never addressed the fact that there's not a refinery right on the grounds of the gas station, therefore, there's FAR more costs involved than your simple and incomplete examples.  For the love of Pete, MY examples leave out things that contribute to the cost, but at least they honestly address a larger collection of what's making up your gas price.

[DrewKaree]

Raising prices 3 times in one day? What in the blue hell is that all about? Did they use up and receive 3 shipments in one day?

If you're not going to read my posts explaining this, I'm going to have to demand that you go back and do so.  Then, when you're done, respond to whether or not you think that the REASON there was a rise 3 times in one day before we go further.  You've ignored those points, and it's clouding your judgement. 

I live in a state where it's agains the law to raise prices more than once in a 24-hour period, and it's clearly been shown that your theory doesn't work when compared to the price increases across the rest of the country, heck, even using the examples here, but that isn't getting through to you because you aren't having a "discussion", you're having a "you're wrong because I'm looking at the end result ONLY, and am not interested in "talking" about it, it's "gouging" no matter how you look at it".


Yer honah, fer example:

So when gas jumps $.50 a gallon overnight, and then another $.50 cents a gallon or so over the next couple days; you know damn well that most places are suddenly making $1.50 profit off each gallon of gas that they were pleased to be making $.50 cents a gallon off just a few days earlier.


Again, I demand you read the posts explaining simplisticly the additional reasons for cost increases.  Here, I'll even lob you a sally pitch you can hit over the fences

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

WHAT HAPPENS WHEN 4-5 REFINERIES CAN'T PRODUCE GAS IN A REGION?

WHAT HAPPENS TO THE SUPPLY IN OTHER REGIONS WHEN THOSE REFINERIES CAN'T PRODUCE GAS IN ANOTHER REASON?

WHAT IS USED TO TRANSFER GAS FROM ONE REGION THAT CAN PRODUCE GAS TO ANOTHER REGION THAT CAN'T PRODUCE GAS?

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

SHOULD THE GAS BEING DELIVERED TO THE REGIONS THAT CAN'T PRODUCE GAS BE SOLD AT THE PRICE THEY WOULD HAVE PAID FOR THEIR REGION?

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

WHAT OIL OPTIONS HAVE YOU BOUGHT TO "OFFSET" THE PRICE INCREASE IN GAS?

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

WHAT ENERGY COMPANY STOCKS HAVE YOU BOUGHT TO OFFSET THE PRICE INCREASES?

Oh, and finally, since I find it crystal clear that you've either not read anything about this and are simply going on emotion, or HAVE read something about this and are simply going on emotion, what about this question:

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

And finally, I've just GOT to point something out, and this is gonna be harsh.....HowardC harch

I'd like to know where they got the money to cover their very first shipment when they opened shop in the first place.

Same as any other business, usually.  They borrow, find investors, or use money out of their own pockets.  You can't seriously be that idiotic to not realize that.  I'll simply ascribe your rant as emotions gone wild.  If you ARE that idiotic, then help us all explain how your first week of work at ANY - A-N-Y - job went.  Did they pay you cash up front for that first week of "stellar" work you did?

Seriously, think this stuff through, educate yourself on what you thought you knew but really didn't, or read what people say. 

It takes money to make money.

LOOK AT THAT!  Guys, check this out!   It's a rose growing in a pile of turds!

If that's the only business principle you understand, this SHOULDN'T have had to be so harsh.  Try Setab's "question and make counterpoints" approach.  Your "facts" are giving "shaky" a bad name.

[quarterback]

help us all explain how your first week of work at ANY - A-N-Y - job went.

[MaximRecoil]

That's silly.  Even in the quote, you can clearly see the words "Let's say", as in "for example".  Also, in the "didn't see anyone say anything about selling at cost", that would also include me, since I'm anyone too.  Stop being pedantic and try to realize when people are using examples, even if they don't word it as "for example"

You said:

Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.[...]The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.

You were responding to someone who said

A station received it gas on Friday and paid say 2.15 per gallon.  they set there price at 2.30.

So let's see; you claim that his scenario "would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2." He is giving an example in which they sell gas at a $.15 per gallon profit, not an example of selling $2 gas for $2/selling at cost. See how that works? You are better off trying your Strawman "argument" techniques in a verbal argument, rather than a written one where is is barnyard basic to establish what has been stated already; as opposed to what you claim to have been stated.

Again and again, those who understand how a business works

Sorry, but it isn't rocket science. Revenues have to exceed cost. Guess what? Selling gas for more than you paid for it will always give you a profit in that area of your business.

and if every business in the world was to run their business as "the price of our product should remain for as long as the product lasts" would be out of business shortly, because they'd be leaking and losing money faster than they could make it.

LOL. How do you figure? Everyone else can make money simply by selling at a set markup. Like I said, you don't see the price of cars sitting on a lot fluctuating daily based on projections of what future years' models will cost. They base their price on what they payed for their existing stock; period.

OR - they'd be increasing their prices BANG all at once to cover the now more expensive product.

Now you are getting the idea. That's what any other business does. 1993 Dodge trucks were a total redesign and cost quite a bit more than 1992's, which were a more or less a 20 year old design. The prices of 92's on the lot did not jump when news of the 93's came out; you know, so that the dealers could give us a nice gradual price increase on Dodge trucks in general and help them afford to be able to purchase the 93's in general. In fact, the opposite happened, like it always happens with old stock; they dropped prices to clear it out fast and make room for the new [more expensive] stock.

To put this in words you'll understand - FOR EXAMPLE  if a station has purchased gas and is selling $2/gallon and sell the entire amount, when they get their next shipment in, instead of having to raise prices a few cents at a time (or in this case, a few dollars at a time), you're INSANE to think the price would go up only at the level it's currently going up.

What are you talking about? The price would go up (or down) in direct proportion to the price that they payed for it.

They'd now have to sell it at $4/gallon, and you'd be griping because it went up $2/gallon OVERNIGHT

Again; what are you talking about? Sell the gas based on what you payed for it. This isn't complex.

Your business premise GUARANTEES wildy fluctuating prices, and having them happen EACH AND EVERY DAY!

It would depend on each business' volume. If a business typically sold a full shipment every two weeks then we would see price changes every two weeks from that particular business. If a business sold a full shipment every two days then we would see price changes from that particular business every two days.

You seem to think that selling all that gas at the price they paid for it would result in some business utopia

You seem to have reading comprehension issues. Who is saying anything about selling at cost?

the radical price swings and increases that WOULD have to take place to simply remain at the same rate.

The radical price swings are irrelevant. The issue here is about stations adjusting their prices according to what they expect to pay for it in the future, rather than what they have already paid for it.

You're being purposely obtuse to think that the price the wholesaler is charging them only goes up a few cents

"Only going up a few cents"? Where did you come up with that? Are you reading the same page that I am? I never made any assumptions about how much their next shipment would go up or come down; you know, because it is irrelevant. They should charge a certain amount over what they paid for it. That's it; that is the jist of this here.

I can't see it any other way, because in all of your examples, you tell us it's the station that's "gouging" us, and you've never addressed the fact that there's not a refinery right on the grounds of the gas station, therefore, there's FAR more costs involved than your simple and incomplete examples.  For the love of Pete, MY examples leave out things that contribute to the cost, but at least they honestly address a larger collection of what's making up your gas price.

That has nothing to do with anything. All businesses have to determine how much of a markup they need to place on their products to get ahead. Once they have determined that; then stick with it. If they have decided that they need a 25% markup on gas then fine. They can look at what they paid for the gas, tack on 25% and they're good to go. But, the way they do things, such as this $1 per gallon hike over a few days, they are simply hiking up the markup percentage on their existing stock.
 

[MaximRecoil]

Again, I demand you read the posts explaining simplisticly the additional reasons for cost increases.

[DrewKaree]

In both my current job and in the job I had prior to this one, I was paid before I ever showed up for work.  In fact, in my last job I got TWO paychecks (and those are monthly paychecks) before my job began.

I've got to look for those jobs.  I could make a fortune on those.

WHAT DO THE TRUCKS DELIVERING THE GASOLINE USE IN ORDER TO RUN?

Diesel

Which is made from?

That's silly. Even in the quote, you can clearly see the words "Let's say", as in "for example". Also, in the "didn't see anyone say anything about selling at cost", that would also include me, since I'm anyone too. Stop being pedantic and try to realize when people are using examples, even if they don't word it as "for example"

You said:

Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.[...]The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.

You were responding to someone who said

A station received it gas on Friday and paid say 2.15 per gallon. they set there price at 2.30.

So let's see; you claim that his scenario "would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2." He is giving an example in which they sell gas at a $.15 per gallon profit, not an example of selling $2 gas for $2/selling at cost. See how that works? You are better off trying your Strawman "argument" techniques in a verbal argument, rather than a written one where is is barnyard basic to establish what has been stated already; as opposed to what you claim to have been stated.

Again, I'll state that you're being purposefully pedantic, and now you're giving everyone proof that you're willing to ignore what's been written.  Your "proof" is to quote me as saying

Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.[...]The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.

and IGNORE the entire content of the post preceding those words, which bore out my point, and your little ellipsis that leaves out the entire content of the post relevant to the point.

Being purposefully misleading isn't particularly helfpul to your case when claiming you've "established" what I've said, when all you've done is dissect the words put forth until they agree with what you want to say.

Quote my words fully, and refute what was said, instead of leaving things out and claiming I'm saying something which is clear to anyone willing to read the entire post   It may not make sense to you if your point is contrary to mine, but at least be honest when recounting my words.  I've said and explained things far differently than the snippet you are choosing to manufacture.

[quarterback]

In both my current job and in the job I had prior to this one, I was paid before I ever showed up for work.

[MaximRecoil]

Again, I'll state that you're being purposefully pedantic, and now you're giving everyone proof that you're willing to ignore what's been written.  Your "proof" is to quote me as saying
Quote
Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2.[...]The goal is NOT to sell your product or service at cost, it's to make a profit.
and IGNORE the entire content of the post preceding those words, which bore out my point, and your little ellipsis that leaves out the entire content of the post relevant to the point.

Being purposefully misleading isn't particularly helfpul to your case when claiming you've "established" what I've said, when all you've done is dissect the words put forth until they agree with what you want to say.

Quote my words fully, and refute what was said, instead of leaving things out and claiming I'm saying something which is clear to anyone willing to read the entire post   It may not make sense to you if your point is contrary to mine, but at least be honest when recounting my words.  I've said and explained things far differently than the snippet you are choosing to manufacture.

What is all this? I didn't even need both of your sentences; but since they were both saying pretty much the same thing, I included them. So here is the simplified version:

He said:

A station received it gas on Friday and paid say 2.15 per gallon. they set there price at 2.30

You said:

Your scenario would mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2

See your Strawman there? He never said anything about selling "at cost" or selling  $2 gas for $2 (i.e. "at cost"). So in fact his scenario would not "mean that they sell the rest of that $2 gas at $2".

[DrewKaree]

Being purposefully misleading isn't particularly helfpul to your case when claiming you've "established" what I've said, when all you've done is dissect the words put forth until they agree with what you want to say.

Quote my words fully, and refute what was said, instead of leaving things out and claiming I'm saying something which is clear to anyone willing to read the entire post   It may not make sense to you if your point is contrary to mine, but at least be honest when recounting my words.  I've said and explained things far differently than the snippet you are choosing to manufacture.

[MaximRecoil]

Being purposefully misleading isn't particularly helfpul to your case when claiming you've "established" what I've said, when all you've done is dissect the words put forth until they agree with what you want to say.

Quote my words fully, and refute what was said, instead of leaving things out and claiming I'm saying something which is clear to anyone willing to read the entire post. Black is white.

[DrewKaree]

There, you see how that works? I don't need to reply to every word you typed. An incorrect statement is still an incorrect statement regardless of how much incoherent babble surrounds it.

Parsing words to make them appear to be what you view them to say is intellectually dishonest. 

Please feel free to continue your willful ignorance of this point.  I've got better things to do than debate with someone unwilling to accept this common point of agreement....well, not really, but now that you've employed the "I know you are, but what am I?" defense followed by the "yuh-huh!" follow-up, I have no rejoinder for something so airtight

[MaximRecoil]

Parsing words to make them appear to be what you view them to say is intellectually dishonest.

I didn't "parse words"; I quoted a sentence from you. What you were claiming the guy was saying and what he was actually saying = 2 different things; period. This doesn't really matter anyway; the gas station manager that I quoted debunks everything you have said when he states what everyone knows; i.e. he can sell based on what he paid for it; he can sell for 23 cents cheaper than his competitor because he is selling gas he bought last week. So, if he can do it, everyone can do it. Anyone who jacks the price up on gas that they "bought last week" is price gouging; plain and simple.

but now that you've employed the "I know you are, but what am I?" defense

Um, no I didn't. You + a scholar doesn't = 2 scholars, lol.

"yuh-huh!" follow-up

The only "'yuh-huh!' follow-up" came from you; you know, when you simply reposted what you had posted previously? which; would have been fine to do I suppose; if it'd had anything to do with anything. 

[duffjr]

gas here in LA reached over 3 bucks a gallon for the first time since forever maybe?

[ChadTower]

Um, no I didn't. You + a scholar doesn't = 2 scholars, lol.

Simple mathematics.

One of us is a dumbass.

I am not a dumbass.

[MaximRecoil]

Um, no I didn't. You + a scholar doesn't = 2 scholars, lol.

Simple mathematics.

One of us is a dumbass.

I am not a dumbass.

Where did you come from? I don't recall a single argument from the likes of you regarding anything I have posted.

LOL @ your paper cups from the sidelines.

[ChadTower]

It's not a shot at you, it's another example like the one you have given.

[MaximRecoil]

It's not a shot at you, it's another example like the one you have given.

Sorry, I thought it was directed at me. My misunderstanding.

[Bones]

Look for the positives.

Rising petrol prices might encourage people to make an effort and find work closer to home and/or buy smaller more fuel efficient cars. (Or better still, a motorbike.  )

All these things are good for the environment. We been pumping crap into the air for a long time, any reduction in this (no matter how minute), is a good thing. You can put a price on a gallon of gas but not on the quality of our air.

Damn, people might even re-discover they have legs and use them for those shorter trips.

[Daniel270]

Last night was the first night in a while the wife and I have been out of the house....   cheapest gas was $2.89 while most expensive was $3.47.   Not to mention we also have quite a few stations pretty much closed. 

Also, has anyone else noticed the rise of Iranian owners to alot of these places?

[missioncontrol]

Damn, people might even re-discover they have legs and use them for those shorter trips.

Come on now your just being silly, what and lose our status of being the most obese country in the world. 

[Bones]

Damn, people might even re-discover they have legs and use them for those shorter trips.

Come on now your just being silly, what and lose our status of being the most obese country in the world.

[Bones]

---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- daisy auto censor......     

[missioncontrol]

what were going to lose our title..........

quick build more McDonalds ASAP and super size everything........

[ChadTower]

(Or better still, a motorbike.  )

Yeah!  Solve our fuel problem and our obesity problem by becoming a nation of amputees.

[Bones]

(Or better still, a motorbike.

[missioncontrol]

Rising petrol prices might encourage people to make an effort and find work closer to home and/or buy smaller more fuel efficient cars. (Or better still, a motorbike.

[paigeoliver]

My Geo Metro 2 seater goes over the weight limit for driver, passengers and cargo if I have any passenger other than a child.

The cars weight limit is 330 lbs, and this INCLUDES the driver. I have a second spare tire in the trunk (10 lbs), and at any given time I am going to be wearing clothes and will probably have a big gulp and a backpack (12 lbs), that means my passenger has to weigh 68 lbs or less.

Funny thing I seem to recall my teeny tiny scooter having a 350 lb weight limit, so apparently it can haul more than the car.

[jbox]

"So you like those generic canvas sneakers huh? Well, I paid $5 for them wholesale but I'll charge you $50 so I can afford to pay $40 dollars wholesale for some brand name sneakers which I will sell for $150 so I can afford to buy some top end Nikes for $100 wholesale..."

Yes, this is a terrible economic system which we refer to by the name capitalism. The central concept of this capital-focused approach is that the supplier may choose any price to sell their good for, and the demander may choose whether or not to buy this good. In the absence of any more constraints since both entiries are free to make their own decision about what they will do with their resource (supplier has a good, the demander has some capital), we call this a free market. Whenever an entity doesn't like the other one they are free to change sides at will, and this freedom will tend to drive the market towards an equilibrium point over time.

For the record, I *do* support the idea of a free market, I just don't think we can ever have one (for various reasons).

[MaximRecoil]

Yes, this is a terrible economic system which we refer to by the name capitalism. The central concept of this capital-focused approach is that the supplier may choose any price to sell their good for, and the demander may choose whether or not to buy this good. In the absence of any more constraints since both entiries are free to make their own decision about what they will do with their resource (supplier has a good, the demander has some capital), we call this a free market. Whenever an entity doesn't like the other one they are free to change sides at will, and this freedom will tend to drive the market towards an equilibrium point over time.

For the record, I *do* support the idea of a free market, I just don't think we can ever have one (for various reasons).

That doesn't have anything to do with what I said. You quoted text from me that was showing how an ordinary business sets their prices as opposed to how gas stations set their prices. Now what does capitalism in general have to do with that distinction?

BTW; monopolies and government regulations in certain areas can pretty much negate true capitalism anyway. So while the principles of capitalism can apply at the barber shop or Circuit City; they don't necessarily apply at the gas pumps or the hospital. You know, simply not buying gas or not getting an illness/injury treated isn't much of an option for most people; their livelihood and well-being depending on these things. So we can just shop around right? Well, they all sell it at roughly the same price.

[missioncontrol]

Locking gas caps becoming scarce as gas prices soar

[Bones]

On the roads it was a white line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice. And in this maelstrom of decay, ordinary men were battered and smashed.

[rchadd]

you should quit moaning - here in the uk petrols gone over

[DrewKaree]

That doesn't have anything to do with what I said.
 

Will wonders never cease?  Are we to believe he used your words in order to say something he believes to be true?

What's next, bacon eating the humans?

[paigeoliver]

On the roads it was a white line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice. And in this maelstrom of decay, ordinary men were battered and smashed.

The Mad Max movies are pretty much my favorite films, unfortunately "The Road Warrior" itself is extremely unlikely, as all those bikers (and everyone else) would run out of gas in a couple days and then what?

[jbox]

The Mad Max movies are pretty much my favorite films, unfortunately "The Road Warrior" itself is extremely unlikely, as all those bikers (and everyone else) would run out of gas in a couple days and then what?

Sailboats and gills.

[jbox]

So you like last Thursday's petrol huh? Well, I paid $1.50 for it wholesale but I'll charge you $2.50 so I can afford to pay $2 dollars wholesale for tomorrow's petrol which I will sell for $3 so I can afford to buy next month's petrol for $2.50 wholesale...

What's that you say, the wholesale price of petrol has gone up to $3? Well, I guess I better start selling my current petrol for that much right now or I wont be able to afford to buy the next batch of petrol! 

[ChadTower]

Tank to tank funding is a business plan doomed to failure... unless you have a product that people will buy regardless of price.  Gas is such a product, unfortunately.

When it is $5/gallon, and it will be soon, people will still fill up their honking SUVs.  A guy where I work was bragging last week that just before the major spike, he filled up his motorhome, jetskis, two riding mowers, two SUVs, two cars, and motorcycle.  He also filled about ten 10 gallon gas cans as well.  All in the same day.  He probably spent $1000 on gas that day.

He was bragging about it.  He has no concept that people like him are the exact cause of our dependence on foreign oil.

[Stingray]

Gas prices have already dropped here by about 25 cents per gallon. What a suprise, the oil companies took advantage of a natural disaster and used it as an excuse to pump up their holiday weekend gasoline sales. The fact that the prices are already dropping so sharply only underlines the fact that this was true price gouging.

Yes, I read all of your arguments Drew. I still disagree with you on this one, buddy.


-S

[ChadTower]

Right, but since it went up by like 40%... it will only go down 18%.

[Stingray]

Right, but since it went up by like 40%... it will only go down 18%.

I think that's got to be the truest thing ever posted on this board. Welcome to the United States of Texaco.

-S

[paigeoliver]

Gas prices have already dropped here by about 25 cents per gallon. What a suprise, the oil companies took advantage of a natural disaster and used it as an excuse to pump up their holiday weekend gasoline sales. The fact that the prices are already dropping so sharply only underlines the fact that this was true price gouging.

Yes, I read all of your arguments Drew. I still disagree with you on this one, buddy.


-S

Prices are already dropping here as well.

All the prices are artificial anyway, it has been over 20 years since we actually had anything other than a tiny teeny super short and super local shortage of gasoline.

Nowhere are there any vehicles sitting idle because there is no gasoline to fill them. There was plenty of gas to fill demand when it was 69 cents a gallon in 1993, and there is enough to fill demand today at $2.99 a gallon.

That means SOMEONE is pocketing $2.30 a gallon on a product that was highly profitable at 69 cents a gallon.

[ChadTower]

People who pay more than a dollar a gallon for gas are supporting terrorism.

 

[Crazy Cooter]

I didn't think that's how pricing works.  In MN, gas stations are supposed to charge relative to the price they purchased it themselves.  If they buy at $2.30, they can sell for $2.35 - $2.40.  Of course 9/11 had stations charging $5+, but there was an investigation and fines were imposed.  Maybe it's different here.  I have a friend who's dad is up the ladder for Amoco (works in Seattle) and I asked him about this after 9/11.  It was my understandinding that's how it worked everywhere.

That said, I think refineries are price gouging.  They have been for years.  They're not the only ones though.  Sometimes it's the store owners.

[Stingray]

All those responsible need to be rounded up and forced to stare at Tronguy's crotch for an entire three day weekend.

-S

[DrewKaree]

All those responsible need to be rounded up and forced to stare at Tronguy's crotch for an entire three day weekend.

-S

There's no need to impose your communist punishments here.  Not only is that uncalled for, but I believe that falls under "cruel and inhumane treatment".

[Stingray]

All those responsible need to be rounded up and forced to stare at Tronguy's crotch for an entire three day weekend.

-S

There's no need to impose your communist punishments here.  Not only is that uncalled for, but I believe that falls under "cruel and inhumane treatment".

Careful there Drew. You're getting pretty far into "those responsible" territory.

-S

[lokki]

Hi,
Not sure if anybody has taken a look at

http://money.howstuffworks.com/gas-price2.htm

Interesting read.

[NY_in_TX]

Hi,
Not sure if anybody has taken a look at

http://money.howstuffworks.com/gas-price2.htm

Interesting read.

that's a little skewed because it's % versus the price of gas in 2002.  which was probably true in 2002, but now it's even a better case for paige's comments (that someone is pocketing HUGE amounts of money on their current inventories)

It's all good and bad...good that we live a capitalistic society and someone is benefiting...bad that it might cost me $87 to fill up next time I do. 

 

[lokki]

that's a little skewed because it's % versus the price of gas in 2002.  which was probably true in 2002, but now it's even a better case for paige's comments (that someone is pocketing HUGE amounts of money on their current inventories)

Hi,
I did not mean to imply that those percentages applied right now, I would say that under normal circumstances that is how gas prices get calculated.

[DrewKaree]

All those responsible need to be rounded up and forced to stare at Tronguy's crotch for an entire three day weekend.

-S

There's no need to impose your communist punishments here.  Not only is that uncalled for, but I believe that falls under "cruel and inhumane treatment".

Careful there Drew. You're getting pretty far into "those responsible" territory.

-S

I would have said "fascist" instead.  Note the proper derogatory term

[BarontheFirst]

All I got to say is right now it cost me as much to fill up my motor cycle as it did to fill up car two months ago and that just isn't right! I won't even use my van right now. Almost scared to see how much that would cost! I hope we do see a fast drop in price I am at $3.25 right now.

[GameOver]

When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

I commute 65 miles each day, paying $3.40/gal since Katrina hit.  Asked the boss if I could work from home, she let me work from home for 2 days each week.  Pretty cool of her!  I hope it works out, at least I'll catch a break from these ridiculous gas prices.

[MaximRecoil]

When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

I commute 65 miles each day, paying $3.40/gal since Katrina hit.

[jbox]

When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...

Mmmmm, lemons...

[rchadd]

you should quit moaning - here in the uk petrols gone over

[Stingray]

I won't even use my van right now. Almost scared to see how much that would cost!

I put $40 in my truck on Friday. Only gave me 3/4 of a tank. I usually fill up, but since every gas station in the world seems to make you pay in advance now, I didn't feel like going back in to throw more money at the guy behind the counter.

-S

[ChadTower]

I thank myself every day for having already set myself up with a pair of fuel efficient cars and a short work commute.  I had no idea at the time that the fuel reduction part of it would be so damned beneficial so soon.

[Stingray]

Lucky for me I have a little car that gets nearly 50 MPG. I never intended for it to be my main commuter car but it's taking me to work pretty often these days.

-S

[ChadTower]

50?  What is it?

[Stingray]

'74 Mini. It's only got a 998 cc motor.

-S

[ChadTower]

Ah, yes... there has to be a balance between economy and safety, though.  If you get hit in that thing you're people pate.

[Stingray]

They're suprisingly rugged. Somewhere I have a video of one rolling about six times. The front window popped out (intact) and of course the car got dented up all over, but nothing caved in. It's an early unibody, I'd put it up againt any modern compact car in a collision. They're small, but not unsafe, at least not in my book. Now, some oblivious soccer mom plows over me in her H2, and I'm done, but the same could be said if it happened while I was driving my Explorer.

-S

[ChadTower]

No, but that Explorer would stand up to a collision with a minivan or another Explorer, which is what will happen.  Nothing is going to withstand an H2, but since there are only like 500 of them on the road, it doesn't matter.

About the lowest you can reasonably go without sacrificing safety completely is a Civic.  Not the maximal efficiency, but better than most, and a strong safety rating for the type of car.

[Stingray]

I'd take a classic Mini over a Civic any day. Minis really are built like little tanks.

-S

[ChadTower]

That won't help you if you're hit by something tall.

[Stingray]

I don't know what you mean.



-S

[missioncontrol]

I havn't let my Bronco get less than a 1/2 a tank I'm scared to see a full fill up......

 

[Shape D.]

I bought gas last wed @ $2.99 a gallon.  I'm on E now but prices are down 14 cents from the $3.25 it was at wednesday night. I was hoping It would drop below $3 by today when I knew I would need gas again.

[ChadTower]

I'm on E now but prices are down 14 cents from the $3.25 it was at wednesday night.

That's a damn good price for E.  It's usually a lot more than that.

[missioncontrol]

let's see I have a 32 gallon tank @ 3.06⁹ a gallon......


oh man I don't feel so good   

[DrewKaree]

Seeing as how cars are being brought up now, what's the deal with that new Hummer?  The thing looks like an uglified Jeep or something.  How much is that offense to the eyes? 

And does anyone have government auctions near them that sell any Hummers from the military?  I'd like a nice slantback, mebbe with the canvas back for both nice days of the year in WI.

[MaximRecoil]

Seeing as how cars are being brought up now, what's the deal with that new Hummer?

[DrewKaree]

No, it's the Hummer H3.  A little smaller than an Envoy, and priced to compete.  Only about 30k. 



Now, if only it were styled to compete as well, we might be talking.  If I wanted an ugly Jeep, I'd have bought a Jeep and slapped some chrome and latches on it hither and yon.  I'm looking for a Hummer (as are many others here) that reeks of testosterone and gas-guzzling capabilities.

It's nice being pro-smokestack.  I also like that Hummer targets the pro-smokestack vote.

[MaximRecoil]

I'm looking for a Hummer (as are many others here) that reeks of testosterone and gas-guzzling capabilities.

Yeah, you're looking for the real Hummer/Humvee obviously. I'd imagine that even if you found one at some sort of a military surplus auction; they wouldn't go for cheap. They are actually "diesel-guzzlers". If you want to go for the gusto; pick yourself up one of these:



That old Dodge Power Wagon would flatten a Hummer; as well as scare women and children, lol.

[paigeoliver]

You wouldn't want a military hummer for anything other than off-roading. My scooter would soundly thromp one in a drag race. Slowest most ponderous thing I have ever driven.

[Bones]

Scooter and drag race do not belong in the same sentence. Please edit your last post.

[paigeoliver]

Scooter and drag race do not belong in the same sentence. Please edit your last post.

Have you ever driven a military one? My scooter seems like a rocket ship by comparison. 

[ChadTower]

A rocket ship you wouldn't even notice driving right over when it fell over and the rider was covered in road rash.   

[Stingray]

Scooter and drag race do not belong in the same sentence. Please edit your last post.

Have you ever driven a military one? My scooter seems like a rocket ship by comparison. 

Yeah, but they're geared that way for a reason. You could probably drive one up a wall. Hell, you could probably use one to pull up a live redwood by the roots, a feature that probably also appeals to the pro-smokestack crowd.

-S

[paigeoliver]

Scooter and drag race do not belong in the same sentence. Please edit your last post.

Have you ever driven a military one? My scooter seems like a rocket ship by comparison. 

Yeah, but they're geared that way for a reason. You could probably drive one up a wall. Hell, you could probably use one to pull up a live redwood by the roots, a feature that probably also appeals to the pro-smokestack crowd.

-S

Yep, I had no problem towing a trailer up a nasty 45+ degree offroad incline. Well, no vehicle related problems, I couldn't SEE anything other than sky.

[DrewKaree]

You wouldn't want a military hummer for anything other than off-roading. My scooter would soundly thromp one in a drag race. Slowest most ponderous thing I have ever driven.

You may win, but when I reach the finish line and drive over your scooter, you'll never beat me with that scooter again.

 Hell, you could probably use one to pull up a live redwood by the roots, a feature that probably also appeals to the pro-smokestack crowd.

-S

So you've seen our new bumper stickers and logo then?

[Stingray]

So you've seen our new bumper stickers and logo then?

Yeah, but it was on a pink H3, so you can imagine my confusion.

-S

[Harry Potter]

Yey, fuel has now gone above $1.30 per litre in Australia. Good thing I drive a Corolla.

This sucks.

[Stingray]

It's down to $2.89 a gallon here. That's about where it was before Katrina, I think. I really don't usually pay any attention to gas prices, I just buy gas when I need it. $3+ a gallon got my attention though.

In any case it went up for Labor Day weekend and then came back down. Too quick for supply interuptions to have played any part at all. Price gouging. I thought Bush said that wouldn't be tolerated. Oh yeah, that doesn't apply to oil companies. What was I thinking?

-S

[ChadTower]

Gas consumers took it like Singray's sig.

[Stingray]

Right in the ole archstole.

-S

[ChadTower]

Damn good thing I didn't need to fill the tank on either car over the weekend.  I could have lost $6.