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TOKN KB16 (Tiger-Heli's Testing Complete)

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Tiger-Heli:


--- Quote from: Chris on June 21, 2005, 12:31:22 pm ---Hey, didja see this appended to his current eBay auctions?

"In an effort to keep the general public well informed about the speed, performance, and reliability of Tokn Media's line of encoders, we've published the readme doc that is part of the documentation distributed to each paying customer on the toknmedia website. Reading these docs goes a far way in getting the best out of your purchase. Be sure to check it out. 16 simultaneous keypress supported. No ghosting, no delays, no stuck keys. We make this claim in no others terms but absolute. Others won't, other can't. Check one out. Cheers, Mattp Tokn Media"

--- End quote ---
Un-f'ing believable.  I hadn't seen that.

Technically he's correct, though -  :D  (You can get 16 simultaneous keypresses.)  Of course you get this whenever you press 15 or sometimes 14 keys.  And no one else claims to sell a 16-input encoder without ghosting.  They all claim to (and do) sell 28 or 32 or 56 input encoders that don't do this!!!!

KevSteele:

Gotta love "the big lie" - the bigger and more absolute you say something, the more likely people will believe it.  :-\

No ghosting? To quote Tiger, Unfrikin' believeable...

Mattp has sent me several emails saying that there is absolutely no ghosting. I've replied that I was able to reproduce Tiger's findings, and that we had three different units showing the same exact behavior.

To quote Mattp:


--- Quote ---Kevin,
You can rest assured that we have test fixtures and data to back our claims.
You can also rest assured that there are unqualified individuals out
there creating
their own test fixtures and publishing their own test data without
consent nor the
simplest courtesy of sending an email to Tokn Media addressing their
concerns.
If you personally have developed a test fixture this would be your
starting point.
If you have a simple sketch or drawing, we will gladly inspect it to see
that the wiring
complies with the design concepts behind Tokn Media's encoders.
Any path other than this taken by any parties outside of Tokn Media are
being treated
as wreckless behavior on the part of those individuals.
Best regards,
Mattp
Tokn Media
--- End quote ---

He's sent me some pretty strange emails recently - weird and kind of frightening rambling, actually.

Kevin

NoOne=NBA=:

What kind of "test fixture" do you need?

If you hook up Button 1-6, as labelled, you should NOT, under ANY circumstance be able to produce ANY keypress other than a button that is pressed MANUALLY.

This product doesn't do that.
I don't know what they call it at TOKN, but everyone else I know calls it ghosting.
The only way they can claim that there encoders don't ghost is if they developed another, proprietary name for it--like interpolating.

If you press buttons 1/2/3 simultaneously, the encoder will "interpolate" that you really wanted to send a button 4 press as well, and will automatically do it for you.

Randy and Andy really need to get some of their encoders up on ebay, to keep the people that don't know any better from getting worked by this guy.

jjd:


--- Quote from: KevSteele on June 21, 2005, 02:37:32 pm ---Gotta love "the big lie" - the bigger and more absolute you say something, the more likely people will believe it.  :-\

No ghosting? To quote Tiger, Unfrikin' believeable...

Mattp has sent me several emails saying that there is absolutely no ghosting. I've replied that I was able to reproduce Tiger's findings, and that we had three different units showing the same exact behavior.

To quote Mattp:


--- Quote ---Kevin,
You can rest assured that we have test fixtures and data to back our claims.
You can also rest assured that there are unqualified individuals out
there creating
their own test fixtures and publishing their own test data without
consent nor the
simplest courtesy of sending an email to Tokn Media addressing their
concerns.
If you personally have developed a test fixture this would be your
starting point.
If you have a simple sketch or drawing, we will gladly inspect it to see
that the wiring
complies with the design concepts behind Tokn Media's encoders.
Any path other than this taken by any parties outside of Tokn Media are
being treated
as wreckless behavior on the part of those individuals.
Best regards,
Mattp
Tokn Media
--- End quote ---

He's sent me some pretty strange emails recently - weird and kind of frightening rambling, actually.

Kevin

--- End quote ---


Well that tourques me off a bit.  I DID give him the courtesy of sending Mattp an email prior to my testing.  He actually replied and encouraged me to publish my results. 

I guess that is wreckless and unauthorized?? Since when does someone need authorization to review thier experiences with a product anyway?  Wreckless?  I noted very clearly that I wired the encoder exactly as shown and received perfect results when only 1 or 2 inputs were used at the same time. 

I hope that my refund is in my mailbox when I get home next week...



jjd:

In fact, here is the email that I recieved.  Please note that the email says to feel free to cut and paste to the message board.

Joseph,
>>Thanks for the digging. As a representative for
>>TOKN, I can say clearly
>>state that my intentions are not to misrepresent the
>>product.
>>The alt-key passthru issue and the LED behaviour are
>>described in the release notes readme.txt. These
>>were known and documented from day 1.
>>The scroll lock programming needs a better
>>description, I agree.
>>Once in programming mode via scroll lock, you're in
>>until the next power cycle
>>or replug of the encoder. Not ideal but we're
>>looking at that for the next release. We're also
>>beta-testing the latest code release with a transmit
>>FIFO resize for the KB32 which is something that the
>>KB16 will benefit from.
>>Time to dot the Is and cross the Ts!
>>Here lies the growing pains. The eBay ad description
>>evolved as more users
>>inquired about its capabilities. I will review you
>>findings and see
>>if I agree. I'm open and looking for a better
>>product design in the long run.
>>If it warrants a diode, I'll document as such and
>>likely add it to the respin.
>>Phew! This has been quite a fiasco. Let me take a
>>look.
>>Your input is greatly appreciated and will result in
>>a better product in the
>>long run. Please encourage any other users to chime
>>in on the message board as TOKN has become a target
>>of much scrutiny in the past week.
>>Feel free to cut and paste to the message boards.
>>We're on it, checking it
>>all out. Thank you so much for your assessment. Lil
>>TOKN KB16 is growing
>>and is going to have to tighten up!
>>Cheers,
>>Mattp
>>Tokn Media
>>P.S. ReleaseManagement.pdf coming soon to the
>>website!

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