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Hey y'all, looks like the pope might be about to die
GGKoul:
--- Quote from: ChadTower on April 04, 2005, 07:51:21 pm ---Actually, no one is debating it because it's not debatable.
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danny_galaga:
--- Quote from: HarumaN on April 04, 2005, 05:04:14 pm ---
--- Quote from: danny_galaga on April 03, 2005, 10:01:44 pm ---catholics need no longer be embarrassed by easter sermons. perhaps the new pope will make it so that he isnt pope for life. oh, and maybe get with the times and allow contraception...
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[Monty Python]
o/~
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jbox:
--- Quote ---Actually, no one is debating it because it's not debatable. Law did the things I say he did and it is documented. The Pope did what I say he did and it is documented. These are facts, clear, true, and easily proven.
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Agreed. I think the bitter-sweet irony is that the people who are most horrified by this are the people who want to believe the message, but have only just now come to realise that you can't always trust the messenger. I think that scandals like these are worse than a million "evolution" papers, and the Church's indecision towards stomping down on them like an Old Testament God is (in hindsight) going to be one of the major causes of its slow and painful death march. >:(
Personally, I believe that any non-congregationally elected church is doomed, and haven't considered myself Catholic for a very long time. Because of that, the people I feel most sorry for are the abuse victims that still want to hold that membership even with what has happened to them. Having worked with people who have been traumatised, the key to their healing is never in punishing anyone**, but in them coming to terms with the fact that it's over. My main worry is how people can reach that point if they keep showing up every week to the exact same environment, denying themselves the kind of change that demonstrates their ability to retake ownership of their lives again? :-\
** = 'key' != 'everything', so in a case where someone is a repeat offender locking them up may be the only way to make it 'over'. Just that it is the stopping that is most important, not punishing. Having 50% of the worlds' Catholics switch denominations next Sunday is going to do more good in the long term than simply having a few dozen priests locked up (although I would like to see both happen).
jbox:
--- Quote ---hehe. what ive never understood is why contraception is not allowed. one would imagine its because god wants you to be trying to make a baby every time you do 'it'. ok, so if you have a condom or are on the pill then obviously you are hoping you ARENT making a baby. so far, so good. so what about the rhythm method or good old fashioned 'pulling out'? isnt that 'doing it' with the hope that you arent making babies? surely god knows you dont want a baby and so that is a sin?
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Let's be completely honest about this, that the real reason they don't mind the rythm or withdrawal methods is that they don't work. If they worked with anywhere near the percentage that either of the others did you can bet they would be on the list too. "Now honey, you know God doesn't like it when you only consent some of the time..." ;D
Officially of course, it's not specifically about you *wanting* or not wanting a baby, although I assume it is sinful to not be fruitful and multiply, it's mostly about whether or not you've given God some good odds for making life should He choose to do so (aka 'open to love and open to life'). Apparently microscopically tearing the tip is not on God's "To-Do" list, even though He could just blame it on Entropy, but keeping little J alive for over a week is. 8)
--- Quote ---oh, and whats with the celebacy? for the first 1000 years or so god though it was ok for priests to be married. then he changed his mind?
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Some of the kids actually started winning court cases about inherenting some of the land/assets their dad's were working on. That's what put a stop to it, the $$$'s were going the wrong way. :angel:
danny_galaga:
apparently toothe church was getting embarrassed by the priests 'antics' with the opposite sex. obviously in those times they thought that if you arent married, you arent having sex and therefore you must be pure :angel: