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This is more than a little scary
shmokes:
Holy mother of god, you are slaughtering your facts.
The enormous 10 commandments sculpture was IN the courthouse, not in a church by the courthouse.
Nobody wants churches to be required to marry gay people. They want county clerk offices to issue marriage licenses to gay people. They want gays to have the legal rights that go along with marriage such as custody and visitation, etc. Nobody thinks that gays have an inherent right to be allowed into a Mormon temple. WTF?
And, of course, the President is allowed to read the bible. He just isn't allowed by the constitution to require it or have an official bible reading session at work. He could, perhaps, have a "do what you want" time in which many people chose to read the bible, but he could still run afoul of the constitution if it was in reality just a thinly veiled bible study that created a hostile atmosphere for people who did not want to participate in the religion stuff.
Ravant:
"The enormous 10 commandments sculpture was IN the courthouse, not in a church by the courthouse. "
I wasn't talking about the national issue. I'm referring to a local incident where a church, across Route 24 from the court complex in Riverhead, NY, was forced to take down their statue because a group of people decided the church placed it there to purposely influence the courts' judgements. It was a BS call though, because the church and the statue were there for about 30 years longer than the court complex.
"Nobody wants churches to be required to marry gay people. They want county clerk offices to issue marriage licenses to gay people. They want gays to have the legal rights that go along with marriage such as custody and visitation, etc. Nobody thinks that gays have an inherent right to be allowed into a Mormon temple. WTF?"
Actually... I was pulling the "forcing churches to marry" from another local leftist group that actually attempted to take a friend's pastor to court because he refused to perform the marriage. Instead of going elsewhere, and peacefully getting the legal rights via other means, they decided to attempt to have the pastor nailed for discrimination against homosexuals.
"And, of course, the President is allowed to read the bible. He just isn't allowed by the constitution to require it or have an official bible reading session at work. He could, perhaps, have a "do what you want" time in which many people chose to read the bible, but he could still run afoul of the constitution if it was in reality just a thinly veiled bible study that created a hostile atmosphere for people who did not want to participate in the religion stuff."
I agree with you on that. The moment he starts requiring bible studies, or otherwise forcing his religion into other people's lives is the moment he oversteps his bounds. He doesn't require them. They happen on everyone's own choice. This kind of goes along with the "moment of silence" in public schools. What is so bad about it that leftists have to fight it? I mean, granted, I haven't actively participated in any religion since Junior High School, and think they're all farsical, I still see no wrong with a moment of silence. Here's what digs at me the most. Back when I was in junior high school, I nearly got expelled for taking a day off to get my Confirmation. Now granted, it wasn't all that important to me, and I WAS using it as an excuse to get out of class that day, doesn't mean they have to threaten to expell me. My parents were the ones who wanted me to get my confirmation... so I did. I'm going to be penalized by the system for my religion? I mean, when my family spoke up and threatened to take it to court for religious discrimination, they shut up REAL quick about expelling me, but still. The fact that they even discussed trying annoys me.
ChadTower:
--- Quote from: shmokes on February 03, 2005, 02:11:52 am ---He could, perhaps, have a "do what you want" time in which many people chose to read the bible, but he could still run afoul of the constitution if it was in reality just a thinly veiled bible study that created a hostile atmosphere for people who did not want to participate in the religion stuff.
--- End quote ---
A "do what you want" time? What is this, second grade? ALL work is a "do what you want" time, but if what you want isn't work, you get fired.
As for the Democrats attacking a President for reading the Bible, they are not attacking a President. They are attacking a Republican. If Clinton had been a Bible studier it would never have become an issue nor would anyone have ever heard about it.
DrewKaree:
--- Quote from: shmokes on February 03, 2005, 02:11:52 am ---
He could, perhaps, have a "do what you want" time in which many people chose to read the bible, but he could still run afoul of the constitution if it was in reality just a thinly veiled bible study that created a hostile atmosphere for people who did not want to participate in the religion stuff.
--- End quote ---
What if he called that "do what you want" time a different name, though? What if he called it "Winter break" or "Spring break" instead?
Those terms are used and some here have said those are "thinly veiled" religious celebrations. Why don't they run afoul of the constitution? Aren't those terms used to disguise a hostile atmosphere for people who don't want to participate in the religion stuff?
;)
mr.Curmudgeon:
--- Quote from: DrewKaree on February 03, 2005, 10:52:54 am ---What if he called that "do what you want" time a different name, though? What if he called it "Winter break" or "Spring break" instead?
--- End quote ---
What I don't understand is why you need everyone else (including public institutions) to constantly validate your religion? As long as they aren't stopping you from practicing outside of their property, what's the problem? We live in a country with many different faiths, what makes you so comfortable with ignoring others?
Is it just a coincidence that "Winter Break" and/or "Spring Break" occur at time that allows you to celebrate the two largest Christian holidays? Has it stopped you from getting your kids Christmas presents now that it's called it "Winter Break?"
Would it make you happier to call them "Christians Are Better Than You Break" and "All Other Religions Worship a False God Break?"
My preference, just for the record, is "Get Off The Cross, We Need The Wood Break"....