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Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
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Jabba:
I see where you are going with this. I think maybe the title of your post is probably misleading. Maybe if it was "Keyboard Encoder Programming" so something different it would not have raised some hackles in here. I personally bought both the Opti-pac and the I-Pac (T-Sticks, etc) mostly from reviews and feedback on this forum. Did not really know of the RandyT's product back then.

I personally believe that competition is always good for all, the buyer and the seller.

Anyways, my .02 cents...

Edit: Typo
MoonDog:
Disclaimer:  I'm new here so my comments don't necessarily reflect those of the community.  (I should have included that before.)

Your initial post said "the actual ipac board would cost $5 in parts to make".  This implies to me that you would be making an exact copy of the hardware (noted that you would not be pirating the software).  I'm all for competition as I stated, but this seems a bit like cheating.  To follow the car analogy it seems more like copying an existing car exactly (Corvette for example) but putting a different motor in it.

Providing alternatives is great.  Getting help from others and offering to provide your time and effort at no cost is what BYO is all about.  Lots of developers have donated countless hours to provide MAME, front ends, etc. for free.  The difference I see is that these projects aren't duplicating existing commercial products.  The "spirit" of MAME is to keep classic arcade games alive without taking away from existing products that are still generating revenue for the rights holders.  Are MAME roms illegal?  I think so.  But can you go buy a brand new Crystal Castles arcade machine from the manufacturer?

$80 does sound a bit steep for an encoder.  If you can do better and want to donate your work to others that's great.  If you do it by taking design work from others it hurts them and in turn the rest of us.  Making a copy isn't exactly competition and if I felt like my R&D effort for something was just going to be borrowed from somebody else I would be less inclined to spend the time and money.

I don't know what your exact plans are so maybe you are proposing a legitimate competitive product.  To me (and others apparently) it sounds like you are just looking to copy someone else's hard work.
coin_door:
A few good points,

 Maybe the title of my thread was missleading. ( An unitentional mistake )
I have changed the title as suggested.

I dont intend to copy any parts of the Ipac. But because I intend to use the same chip as Ipac I expect the circuit to be similar, but not a copy.
Getting back to the old car analogy, unfortunaletly they all need four wheels and a steering wheel etc. So it is very hard to make a car with square wheels just avoid people saying it is a copy. The card I intend to make will quite possibly look similar, just because that is the nature of designing around such a chip. One of the alterations i intend to do with the board is have spade lugs on it instead of screw terminals. I want to do this, not for the purpose of change for change sake but I feel it would be easier to chop and change controls.

I guess the only thing I am copying is the concept of Ipac. But we must realise that this is not a new concept. There are countless  interfaces in the market today. The only other thing I am copying is using the cypress chip. But I guess I would have eventualy worked out about using that for myself anyway. This chip is ideally suited for such a job.
Tiger-Heli:
I stayed out of this thread earlier, but let me add a few comments:

--- Quote ---I dont intend to copy any parts of the Ipac. But because I intend to use the same chip as Ipac I expect the circuit to be similar, but not a copy.
Getting back to the old car analogy, unfortunaletly they all need four wheels and a steering wheel etc. So it is very hard to make a car with square wheels just avoid people saying it is a copy. The card I intend to make will quite possibly look similar, just because that is the nature of designing around such a chip.

--- End quote ---
Okay, this has been extensively covered in other filelds.  As it relates to circuitry, the best example would be something like a computer motherboard.  If you have the same components connected to the same traces, (even if the traces run to different locations), it's a copy.

--- Quote ---One of the alterations i intend to do with the board is have spade lugs on it instead of screw terminals. I want to do this, not for the purpose of change for change sake but I feel it would be easier to chop and change controls.

--- End quote ---
Bad idea, IMHO.  Not only are spade lugs likely to break off with repeated use, but they require you to crimp terminals onto all of your input wires which requires additional time.

While I don't mind competition or seeing alternative products on the market, many of your statements make me less than excited about your ability to carry this out.  Feel free to prove me wrong . . .

For example:


--- Quote ---I guess the only thing I am copying is the concept of Ipac. But we must realise that this is not a new concept. There are countless  interfaces in the market today.

--- End quote ---
If you define an "interface" as a device which accepts a button press and sends a code to make a keypress to the computer, then I count about 23 products, (including discontinued and keyboard hacks).  I don't include the AKI as this is basically a gamepad encoder, and I suppose I missed Druin's interface, but the number is not countless . . . (ref.  http://www.mameworld.net/tigerheli/encoder/index.htm)

--- Quote ---The only other thing I am copying is using the cypress chip. But I guess I would have eventualy worked out about using that for myself anyway. This chip is ideally suited for such a job.

--- End quote ---
Interesting to me that you can judge that the chip is ideal for the job when you have no idea how to program it.  Seems like the buttonbox did fine with Atmel and PIC chips.  And I think the MK series used a different chip as well.  For that matter, I imagine the HotRod and X-Arcade encoders use a different chip as well.  Probably the KeyWiz does also.

--- Quote ---I am wondering if there is anyone who would help me with this project that could write a similar program to what is on the Ipac board. I wouldnt want to copy the residual program that is on the ipac board, but to just get the board to function the same.

--- End quote ---
This is probably the part that bothers me the most.  Your only intent is to make the board function the same - - - .  The MK64 and KeyWiz both added and removed features that the I-PAC supports (and took shots b/c of them).  If you said "I just want the board to take a button press to an input (with no shift function), but to be programmable." or "I want features A, B, and C of the I-PAC along with features D, E, and F of the KeyWiz." I would give you some credibility.  But wanting the board to function the same smacks of piracy and/or a lack of creativity in being able to determine which features are useful and not useful.

Now that I'm done with criticism, my advice would be to do an internet search and see if that explains how to program it.  Or contact Cypress tech support and see if they can suggest any resources.
wboy:

--- Quote from: coin_door on October 28, 2004, 09:06:06 pm ---I dont know if you know , but to buy an ipac in Australia costs $80 + 10% tax
I find this hard to accept when you can go out and buy a fully working USB gamepad for $15  (Brand new, out of the box). I would guess there isnt much difference ?

--- End quote ---

On the Ozstick site, the IPAC2 sells for $80 INCLUDING GST.  Delivery will cost you $8.40

Ordering directly through Andy in US dollars, you pay $39 for the IPAC2 and $12 delivery, which roughly converts to $69AUD in total based on the dollars current worth.  NO GST applies as it is a imported good!

Don't recall any of my arcade favorites having logitech USB gamepads attached when I was growing up.

I own two JPACS and AVGAs, and they are worth every cent when compared to the time it allowed me to save when making my Arcade Cabinets MAME capable...
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