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| Want to build (or buy) a Tron stick... |
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| Sasquatch!:
--- Quote from: 1UP on March 19, 2004, 07:56:09 pm ---Also, there is no need to modify the mold of the Tron grips to get them to fit. All you need is a shaft made to hold them on. You also need to modify your stick base to keep them from rotating. I am looking into a solution for this so that I can include the sticks on my cabinets when I start production. --- End quote --- I have a Raider Pro hacked onto a Competition on my newest cab (your old Raider Pro handle, actually :)). Bbut between using a shaft that isn't quite the same as the Competition, and doing the "nail in the shaft to keep it from rotating" trick, it still FEELS like a "hack". It's the one component on the cabinet that isn't a genuine arcade control, and it does feel like it. I have to agree that if Happ made a full-out professional Tron stick solution, I think a bunch of us would buy it. |
| Xiaou2:
you hit the nail with the hammer Sasquatch. while i was able to make some of my own controls.. i could feel the difference in the quality, play, durability..ect. i myself could be carefull not to break a controller from excess force... but i dont trust anyone else to be so carefull. i know a bunch of people that react in such a way that would destroy my controls in a heartbeat. and even so... i myself may eventually break them just because they arnt built as durable to last a long time. the tron sticks are built like tanks... and you can feel it. you could smash the things from left to right as hard as possible... and they wouldnt flinch. You didnt have to worry as you played.. wondering if you hit too hard, or feeling the thing bend or stress durring the shock. Just pure concentration on the game... and confidence that your 'tank controls' were going to open a can of whoopa$$! : ) as stated in another post... most arcade controls were designed by top engineers and tested over and over till they were perfect in feel, control, and lastability. These were playtested for hours and hours and hours. Many revisions later... and finally got the best controllers possible. (unless they were rushed or overbudget..) anyway.. think of it like this. Do you like the feel of your car's controls better than the typical PC wheel/pedal set? ...strength, durability, weight, ballence, smooth movment, no 'play', perfect tention, ect... |
| Khenemet Heru:
I'm sleepy, so if this seems ranty, please forgive, it's not meant that way, really... While I agree with a lot that has been said about original controls over hacks, and esp. with regards to the Tron type sticks, I have to say that IMNSHO most of us that are including a trigger stick like that probably have considered it as an afterthought, and as such, a lot of the CP designs I have seen (including my own in-progress design) have not taken into account the fact that the under-panel guts of the Tron sticks are HUGE, both width-wise and depth-wise. As such, a Happ's super or ultimate is in fact ideal given the tightness of space most of us have designed for, and really for gameplay should be sufficient for all but the most anal of authenticity police. With that in mind, and given the fact that even though I have scavenged a 3/8" dia. threaded hollow steel rod from a lamp to act as my wired joystick shaft, I have been searching for a month locally and on the web for a good hardened steel shaft that I can attach to the threaded rod to act as a mount for the handgrips (that need a shaft much larger than 3/8" dia.) with no success... (gasping for breath) I for one would be grateful for the design change we've all been talking about, as a handle designed for a smaller shaft would be much easier to mate to a variety of smaller joystick bases. Granted accuracy is everything in restoration and is very good for emulation... but sometimes practicality has to win out - and as I have just aquired an Astron Belt joystick (which is essentially a Tron stick with black grips and a bent steel shaft, to refresh the memory) for far too much money only to find it's way too big to fit in any CP I'll ever build, I am finally disgusted with accuracy and have swung fully over to the practical side... I WANT a hack. there's my 2.45 cents, now I'm off to dreamland... I'll probably have that dream where I'm being chased by Pac-Man again... - Shadowhawk |
| Khenemet Heru:
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on March 19, 2004, 07:09:01 pm --- Ive tried Alumilite. A shape as thin as the handles on the trigger stick wouldnt hold up. The stuff isnt very strong - and cracks into pieces if dropped. The molding material is super expensive too. I used the rtv rubber i believe. with 1 mistake in the mold could cost you 40 to 50$ a pop. I spent like $400+ to make a tron spinner... and unfortunately learned that the final part was impossible to make.. The encoder wheel was too thin for the plastic.. and cracked with the slightest pressure. Way too frail to be usefull. Im sure theres more professional plastics out there... but even so... its gona take a good chunk of change to get to the final result... that and a lot of effort and skill. --- End quote --- ok, i can buy that after seeing some of the how-tos on their website, but why make the grips that thin? we can change the mold to suit just by scraping away some clay - making it thicker, giving it a smaller bore for the handle, even making it solid if we wanted... I did silversmithing and lost wax casting, so I do know what skill goes into modelmaking for casting, and yeah it's a lot of work, but the results are worth it. So the question then becomes 'If Alumilite resin is too flimsy, are there any other easily obtainable suggestions?' - or any brains we can pick that haven't chimed in? |
| 1UP:
--- Quote ---SasquatchI have a Raider Pro hacked onto a Competition on my newest cab (your old Raider Pro handle, actually ). Bbut between using a shaft that isn't quite the same as the Competition, and doing the "nail in the shaft to keep it from rotating" trick, it still FEELS like a "hack". It's the one component on the cabinet that isn't a genuine arcade control, and it does feel like it. --- End quote --- Sure it does, because it is a hack. There's a lot of stuff on a lot of cabs out there that neither looks or feels like the real thing. But it's a lot closer than playing DOT with the cursor keys and a mouse. ;) --- Quote ---Xiaou2 As stated in another post... most arcade controls were designed by top engineers and tested over and over till they were perfect in feel, control, and lastability. These were playtested for hours and hours and hours. Many revisions later... and finally got the best controllers possible. --- End quote --- Or at least the best for the job of "played 24 hours a day in an unsupervized laundromat" controls. The materials and design on a lot of arcade controls were overkill. They were built not only to withstand a spirited game session, but to weather the attacks of the few a$$holes that would actually slam the controls with all their strength when they lost. Most people don't need that kind of robustness in their home arcade. Someone could probably come up with a slightly simplified, more compact base for a Tron stick that would do the job well enough to satisfy our expectations of authenticity, and for us to trust our rowdiest friends to play with, but maybe not the gangbanger with an attitude downtown. --- Quote ---anyway.. think of it like this. Do you like the feel of your car's controls better than the typical PC wheel/pedal set? --- End quote --- That's going a bit too far. Even the controls on the ultra-expensive top of the line multiplayer driving simulators at Gameworks can't compare with the real thing. You'd have to start comparing the controls of a Battlezone cab to the controls of a real tank, or the pushbutton controls on Asteroids to the much more complex cockpit of the Space Shuttle. I think a better analogy would be a comparison between my Honda Accord and my boss's $90,000 BMW. I'm sure the components and design of the steering mechanism of his beemer are much more precise than my Honda, but I don't know if I'd notice a difference. In the end, my car does as good a job for me as his does for him. Someone COULD make a Tron stick setup that would do the same job (or again, a good enough job for the home gamer), without all the cost and bulkiness and overkill. There's more than one solution to almost every problem, and often the best one is the simplest. I'd love to tackle this issue myself as part of the development of my cab, but first I'd need a genuine Tron stick to test and tinker with. Any volunteers? ;) |
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