Project: My first cabinet - Mid 90s and before! [Complete]

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minorhero:

--- Quote from: Lexiq on October 13, 2023, 05:37:55 pm ---You're right - a high refresh gaming LCD with G-Sync / FreeSync will definitely get the best results (short of a CRT). They're definitely big enough too, but I found that I'd have to make my cabinet a lot wider than I wanted to get the same, or even close to the same 4:3 screen size. I feel your pain though - everything's a compromise. :)

I believe some people have mounted larger monitors vertically so the unused parts of the screen are hidden behind the bezel. I suspect that comes with its own set of challenges though.

--- End quote ---

Given price differentials, I would probably use a 27" 16:9 screen which means the monitor is 24 inches wide and 14.5 inches tall. When I was in the store looking at them, I decided I could live with a screen 14 inches tall. Ideally, I would use something bigger, but going to a 32 inch monitor only nets me another inch of vertical height at the cost of almost double the price. Like you said, everything is a compromise.

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on October 13, 2023, 06:29:25 pm ---One benefit of a Large LCD type display... is the ability to use full sized Arcade Bezel Artwork in mame / emulators.

My only gripe with this... is that most of the artwork is Vector based, and not photographic. It doesnt Look the same
as the actual arcade artwork.

I get why they chose Vectorization.. especially due to the massive space it would otherwise eat up... but on the opposite
end of the spectrum... I think the way it SHOULD look, should be how you experience it.

--- End quote ---

Yeah... I really don't like the look of those artworks in the bezel. I'll skip it and just use something black behind some plexiglass to make a permanent bezel.

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on October 13, 2023, 06:45:12 pm ---BTW - I recommend making each player 7 buttons.

This will allow you to play Ultimate Mortal Kombat much easier.. as that game has a RUN button, diagonally between the main
buttons and the joystick.

Also... I recommend making that "Run" button a long-travel Pinball Leafswitch button. This will allow you to play
Rapidfire games like Halleys Comet, Asterioid Deluxe, and even Galaga (long duration firing), to be FAR FASTER, AND FAR less fatiguing.

The thing about Leafs, is that they can be switched on/off with a mere papers width of distance. This allows you to do a special trick
called "Feathering"... which cant be done with Microswitch based buttons. You press the leaf button deep enough that the contacts
make connection... and then you just have to "VIBRATE" the button... and it will create the quickest and most effortless Rapidfire
that you can produce. You dont have to fully depress (bottom out) the button each time.

With Feathering, you can maintain long duration fire sessions... such as with Galaga... and or Maximum Rapidfire sessions, needed for
a game like Halleys Comet (it rewards you with more powerups, if you can maintain an insane rapidfire rate.. and trust me, you
need all the power you can get... as quickly as possible, for that game).

Now, they do make "modern" leaf buttons... that have a much shorter travel... but, from my experience with them, they are way too
soft (even with stretching the spring out)... and will tend to fire accidentally.. with the most mildest of pressure of your fingers
merely trying to rest on them. Also, because of the shorter travel, they will always Bottom Out... and as such, they do not feel
as good, and will produce more fatigue + more Noise.

Now... Leafs are not good for All game times. Particularly with fighting games, where you need that Tactile feedback, to know
when the button has connected... in order to get the precise timing for special moves. But leafs are especially good for a lot
of the older arcade games. Especially Shooters, or other games that require rapid fire. This includes a game like
"Track and Field" where you have to tap buttons quicker.. to run faster.

--- End quote ---

I read about the mortal combat run button in someone elses build. I never played it much as a kid so it doesn't hold the same sway in my mind as street fighter. I don't think I want to add another button just for one game either. Or such was my thoughts on it. I've not really looked into leaf vs microswitch before. I think all the buttons I've seen thus far have been microswitches with leafs only being used on some joysticks. Yet another thing to think about :P

harri:

--- Quote from: minorhero on October 13, 2023, 09:40:54 pm ---I read about the mortal combat run button in someone elses build. I never played it much as a kid so it doesn't hold the same sway in my mind as street fighter. I don't think I want to add another button just for one game either.

--- End quote ---

By looking the cabinet pictures MK has unique button layout all together so if you have any muscle memory from playing the original cabinet that extra button isn't enough and for those who don't have it six buttons cover every move.

Xiaou2:
I didnt get to play MK3 that much, as by that time in my life, I was way too busy... BUT.. I will say that I LOVED
the RUN button. It made the interactions far more Dynamic... because you never knew when someone was going to
suddenly charge forwards at speed... rather than the standard FIXED ("Easy to Read") mobility speed.

I say, play a few games, to test out the Run feature, and you will be hooked too. My favorite character quickly became
the dude with the Dual Tiger-Hook Swords. Cant recall his name at the moment.

I never got good enough to know if the X-Shaped button layout would be effected much, when trying to play it with the
standard Street Fighter 2 button layout (with two block buttons in the middle, instead of one). And I never got to test
the game with a 6 button layout, before my health took a dive... and then my arcade controls got stolen =[

However, I did create a Mechanical Solution concept... where you could slide the Middle buttons vertically up towards
the monitor... to play MK games...

minorhero:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on October 16, 2023, 02:56:04 am --- I didnt get to play MK3 that much, as by that time in my life, I was way too busy... BUT.. I will say that I LOVED
the RUN button. It made the interactions far more Dynamic... because you never knew when someone was going to
suddenly charge forwards at speed... rather than the standard FIXED ("Easy to Read") mobility speed.

I say, play a few games, to test out the Run feature, and you will be hooked too. My favorite character quickly became
the dude with the Dual Tiger-Hook Swords. Cant recall his name at the moment.

I never got good enough to know if the X-Shaped button layout would be effected much, when trying to play it with the
standard Street Fighter 2 button layout (with two block buttons in the middle, instead of one). And I never got to test
the game with a 6 button layout, before my health took a dive... and then my arcade controls got stolen =[

However, I did create a Mechanical Solution concept... where you could slide the Middle buttons vertically up towards
the monitor... to play MK games...

--- End quote ---

I like the dovetail sliding buttons, that's a cool concept! It's probably not one I will go for simply because I like you didn't play much mortal combat and I honestly have about zero muscle memory for all the games I am going to be playing anyway :P I was last really active in arcades about 30 years ago. At the time I probably did have an opinion on button placement, but flash forward to today, and I will almost certainly follow the 'standard' angular 6 button layout I see most people using. Once my buttons and ipac come in, I will make a temporary control panel and play some games on the crt tv I have and on the monitors I have in my house (if I can find a nearby friend with a modern gaming monitor,) will do that as well. Then I'll decide on monitor and control scheme at the same time.

Xiaou2:
Thanks. But FYI... its not actually a Dovetail. I was just being quick and lazy, when I was putting the design together.

I was showing an issue, that if you use a piece of flat steel to mount the sliding button in.. it would be too thin near the
edges, and would likely break.

I realized that metal "C-Channel" would be the best, to give it the required strength.. and still remain thin enough to
remain between the other buttons (without spreading them far apart).

The Top designs, were me wrestling on how it would effect control panels with Plexiglass tops... and where the Artwork
layer would be placed.

The Top most pic, is where a Top Mounted Bezel (Pink), with the duplicated control panel artwork printed on top of it...
would be sitting. This would match the control panel artwork, when in the standard 6 button position. This bezel design
covers up the needed Hole in the Plexiglass.

The design below that, was probably my first design... where there is a gap in the Plexiglass, which allows it to slide.
The CP artwork was placed on top of the sliding metal c-channel, but below the plexiglass layer (it would have its own
rectangular plexiglass piece). I didnt draw it here, but you would also put a duplicate artwork layer on the bottom
ledges of the wood... OR... directly applied to the bottom surface of the main CP plexiglass.

I believe I had another idea, in which you could place two metal strips above and below the rows of buttons, which
would cover over the sliding mechanism altogether. You could then just apply the duplicate CP artwork directly on
top of these strips.

Another slightly out of reach Idea, was to get someone to Produce a "Drop in Double 6 buttons assembly" ,with the
sliding mechanism already part of the assembly. Unlike traditional methods, where you have to drill 6 individual holes...
you would then only need to cut out a large rectangle hole. The assembly would be mounted to a thin Metal bezel,
similar to how Happs trackballs are mounted, using a metal Mounting Plate. For the cleanest (flat) application, you would
then route about 2mm of the CP height down, in the "Mounting Lip" area.

This would lock you into a certain type of button.. because the assembly is a singular shell / unit, with the button holders
cast directly into the plastic shell. Ive personally always loved Happs Concave buttons, as they are far more Comfy than
Japanese Convey buttons. However, Ive wanted to try to reduce their diameter a little, to save some space. And since
all of the buttons would be in the same shell.. it would probably eliminate some of the larger bezel thickness, that surrounds
each individual button.

Anyway.. the C-Channel would have to be a lot more shallow than what I posted in that concept pic. Maybe only using
2 to 3 mm wall lengths. Just enough to give the required strength.. but not so much that it would make routing the
required groves in the CP, an issue.

As for locking it in place.. it might be easier with Magnets... but that snap clip is probably fine.
I doubt that normal play, where you are pressing directly downwards on the buttons, would cause it to slide Upwards...
so it probably only needs a clip to lock the mechanism in the UP (MK) position.

Personally, while it was SF2 that got me into fighters.. It was "Killer Instinct" that got me seriously Addicted.
The arcade manage saw that I was staring at the machine... too fearful to waste my money, trying to figure out how
to play it. He popped in some free credits, and showed me a few of the moves. Not long after that, I became a
"Regular" that was in line, to fight against the other "Regulars". The competition was pretty Fierce, and it was
an incredibly fun time.

Interestingly enough... KI borrows heavily from SFII... but it adds some extra complexity,
such as Combinations that you can creatively construct yourself. It also had "Combination Breakers" that were tricky
to pull off.. but if you did, you got these cool "Shadow Moves". Then there were the press, hold, and release based
"Enders".. that were very tricky to pull off.. but gave you extra combination speed and higher damage levels. All
very fantastic Upgrades to the Tired old SF formula... as Capcom was Milking the same old mechanisms, for way too
long.

The only other Fighter to get me so addicted, was Tekken 3. At the time of its release, I was a manager of a Time-Out
arcade, that had been bought out by Namco. It came to me, in the form of a Kit, to convert one of the other older arcade
machines. Sadly, it came right before I was set to go home from a long full day of work... But... I couldnt resist the urge
to see what this thing was like... So I began the conversion process.

After I finished the conversion.. and fired it up... The incredible soundtrack blasted, and the Iconic cutscene
played. I had never seen nor heard anything like this game, before. I started playing it, and ended up spending
the entire rest of the night.. well past closing time. It was one of the few games that I invested into learning
and playing... despite how busy I was, working like +50 hrs every week.

My Fav. character was Ling Xiaoyu. I learned every combination and trick, with her. She has an interesting blend
of Wushu, and Wing Chun like movements... and being that I was training in Wing Chun, it really impressed me.
What also impressed me, was just how many special movements, and combinations were possible, with their
combat system. It was not as easy to figure out as something like MK... but, it was also far more rewarding.
I also really loved that a lot of the movements were realistic to actual martial arts. They used some very skilled
martial artists, to capture their styles movements, and it showed.

I never got into the new Streetfighters, and found the new "Soul Calibur" arrival, to be far too Clunky for my tastes.

As for Mortal Kombat 1, it was somewhat special in that it had the Atmospheric look, that you always wanted to see in a
fighting game. The semi realism of Digitized graphics. The "Big Trouble in Little China" feel. It was almost like being
able to relive the old 70s era Kung Fu films. Though, admittedly... the gameplay was way too simplified.. and the AI
cheated way too much.

MK2 was too Cartoony for my tastes.. and IMO, while it had some positives.. it never really got me "Addicted" like the other
mentioned fighters. I also was not a fan of how they shifted from a Chinese-Centric theme.. into a "Roman" theme. That
kind of Ticked me off, to be honest.

MK3 / Ultimate... Was far more impressive than MK2. The new Auto-Combination sequences, were fun to execute, and fun
to watch. The game was much more fluid, fast, and dynamic. Especially with the new Run button mechanic. I was initially
skeptical about it... until I played a game with it.. and found it to be an actual Game Changer. As most fighters are locked to
a set movement speed... making it too easy to predict, what they were trying to do, and where they would end up. You also
had to react a lot quicker, when a fighter suddenly rushed you.

The graphics were still a bit Cartoony, when you compare them to MK1's digitzed characters.. but, I could accept it better,
as the game played so much better / deeper / faster.

That said... I was still working in the Arcade at that time, and I didnt have any leftover time to dedicate to learning all of the
new Combinations and stuff. So, I only ever learned a few, and Ive forgotten them by now. And personally, I cant play
fighter on a standard PS style gamepad. It has to be an arcade stick + 6 button layout.. or.. one of the rare gamepads that
have dual rows of 3 buttons.. similar to what Sega had released for the Genesis. I have no idea why the industry keeps that
awful diagonal 4 button layout. Especially considering how many people love to play fighters, on these various consoles.

Something to note... is that the Original Arcade version of Tekken 3, has a special High-Resolution mode (Interlaced).
You went into the service mode, and you could toggle the Interlaced output... then reboot the machine, and the graphics
looked SO much better.

Ive tried that in one of the later versions of mame... but it just Crashed the game. Hopefully that will get fixed one day.

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