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Author Topic: Macross PCB, Different Version's?  (Read 919 times)

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Falken Hawke

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Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« on: March 26, 2023, 12:40:58 am »
As I was burning in the replacement RAM on my board, I was watching Del's Arcade YouTube video featuring Yotsuya's Macross cabinet.


I noticed that his attract mode is different from mine. At first I thought it was a DIP switch setting but the only setting is for demo sound which made no difference on or off.

I would like to ask anyone else who has this title if your attract mode matches Yotsuya's.

I just got curious when I saw the difference so would like to see where the rabbit hole leads 😁

TIA

yotsuya

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2023, 12:23:12 pm »
How is yours different?


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Falken Hawke

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2023, 12:45:11 pm »
After the Macross title screen, my board switches to one of two cinematic cut scenes before displaying the high scores.

I saw one of the cut scenes showing in the picture you posted for your completed project posting so it does show up.  I'm really curious about why they didn't in the video.

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2023, 04:16:17 pm »
After the Macross title screen, my board switches to one of two cinematic cut scenes before displaying the high scores.

I saw one of the cut scenes showing in the picture you posted for your completed project posting so it does show up.  I'm really curious about why they didn't in the video.
Have you tried setting the dipswitches to free play like Yotsuya's cab in the video?

Free play doesn't skip the cut scenes in MAME v0.152 or v0.238, but it might do it on original hardware.

- If free play skips cut scenes on your PCB, that could indicate a minor error in the emulation. (Nothing currently reported on MAME Testers.)

- If free play does not skip cut scenes on your PCB, it appears that Yotsuya has a PCB/ROM variant/bootleg not currently preserved in MAME.


Scott

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2023, 11:30:06 pm »
Already done, findings have not changed.

I also filled the top 10 high scores with no change so I'm wondering if the game was played to the end when the video was taken.  After all, if it's running in Zapcon, someone probably played it through.

For me, checking that will have to wait.  I don't have the skill to play through the game quickly and I have other things to complete as well.

Haze

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2023, 07:04:16 pm »
I think there's a high chance of it being a different code revision.

Falken Hawke

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2023, 10:18:07 pm »
Maybe as the pics of his board in his project thread match pics of the board elsewhere.

However, the conditions for the operation of the game at the time of the video versus his photo when he completed his project aren't obvious.  I'm wondering if there is a trigger that isn't well known but I'm not dismissing a different version either.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,142020.msg1483020.html#msg1483020

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2023, 12:17:19 am »
the pics of his board in his project thread match pics of the board elsewhere.
For those who don't want to scroll through the 10 pages of Yotsuya's build thread, here's the post with PCB pics.
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1423842.html#msg1423842

Can't tell from those pics  if there are any ROM labels or PCB markings on Yotsuya's board that indicate a version number or release date.

When you first go into service mode (DIP SW1#8 to up), the center of the screen shows "11th Jun. 1992" (cropped pic below) for a second before proceeding to the monitor adjustment pattern.
- I'm guessing that this might be the revision/release date for the version in MAME.
- Do both of your PCBs show the same date?


Scott

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2023, 01:49:07 am »
My bench uses a LCD so won't show the first few seconds of power up.  My raster CRT's are buried so it may be a while before I can check.

bobbyb13

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2023, 03:57:13 am »
My bench uses a LCD so won't show the first few seconds of power up.  My raster CRT's are buried so it may be a while before I can check.

Unless you bring it up to my shop that is!
Now you gents have me all curious about what is up.

When you off work again?
Relax, all right? My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools! I can fix it.

Falken Hawke

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2023, 04:57:00 am »
I have a family trip coming up so won't be free 'til next week.  I was thinking about using that tiny cabinet waiting for parts to try this  :D

Haze

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2023, 06:09:36 am »
the pics of his board in his project thread match pics of the board elsewhere.
For those who don't want to scroll through the 10 pages of Yotsuya's build thread, here's the post with PCB pics.
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1423842.html#msg1423842

Can't tell from those pics  if there are any ROM labels or PCB markings on Yotsuya's board that indicate a version number or release date.

When you first go into service mode (DIP SW1#8 to up), the center of the screen shows "11th Jun. 1992" (cropped pic below) for a second before proceeding to the monitor adjustment pattern.
- I'm guessing that this might be the revision/release date for the version in MAME.
- Do both of your PCBs show the same date?


Scott

You can't trust the date shown on the NMK games, we've seen multiple cases of completely different builds with the same date, and even different games with the same date.  Either they forgot to update it, or it has some other meaning like the engine date, or project start date, rather than the build date.

Likewise NMK don't seem to do anything to differentiate versions with labels.

The only real way to know is the dump them.

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2023, 03:00:52 pm »
You can't trust the date shown on the NMK games, we've seen multiple cases of completely different builds with the same date, and even different games with the same date.  Either they forgot to update it, or it has some other meaning like the engine date, or project start date, rather than the build date.

Likewise NMK don't seem to do anything to differentiate versions with labels.

The only real way to know is the dump them.
If Yotsuya is willing to dump some ROMs from his PCB, which ROMs are most likely to show if there is a different variant?
- a03 looks promising. (main CPU)
- a08, a09, and a10 might have something relevant. (proms)
- a01, a02, a04, a05, a06 and a07 don't look very promising for the difference noted.  (audio CPU, oki sound chips, tiles, and sprites)

Quote
921a03              0524288    maincpu
921a02              0065536    audiocpu
921a01              0131072    fgtile
921a04              2097152    bgtile
921a07              2097152    sprites
921a05              0524288    oki1
921a06              0524288    oki2
921a08              0000256    proms
921a09              0000256    proms
921a10              0000032    proms


Scott

Haze

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #13 on: March 29, 2023, 05:09:19 am »
Assuming it isn't a prototype, then it's only really likely that the maincpu ROM will differ, with a very small chance of the audiocpu ROM differing

For games of this period the GFX/Sample/PROMs were usually finalized before release (and are often mask ROMs)

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Re: Macross PCB, Different Version's?
« Reply #14 on: March 29, 2023, 03:45:00 pm »

If Yotsuya is willing to dump some ROMs from his PCB


Ill get right on that.


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