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| Arroyo:
--- Quote from: bobbyb13 on April 08, 2023, 06:13:18 am ---This is actually a 110 degree angle tube! --- End quote --- Good stuff Bobby. If you wanna double check you can look at the tube itself. There should be an embossment in the glass indicating the size and angle of the tube. The convention is diagonal length in inches followed by a V and then the degree of the tube. So for yours if it is indeed a 110degree tube you should find 19V110. Here is a conversation on the topic: https://forums.arcade-museum.com/threads/90-100-110-degree-how-do-i-know.309041/ Here is an example pulled from that thread: Pulled from my thread for reference: --- Quote from: bobbyb13 on April 08, 2023, 03:43:41 am ---And so, my FIRST question would be what fuses have you settled on for power supply feeds? --- End quote --- As for the fuse. Hard to be sure from you pic but I am going to assume that you have the fuses coming on the output side of your power supplies. I assume you are using these in an attempt to protect the electronics. You shouldn't need any. If you look at the power supply from an Atari vector brick here: What you'll note is that there is no fuse coming off the transformer to create the 50VAC power that is for the monitor (red arrow). I'll show the connection to your power supplies in a second. You'll see that there are fuses for the other power lines highlighted by the green arrows. Specifically 10.6VDC, 36VAC, 6.1VAC. If you follow back the 50VAC line (red arrows), you'll see they don't have a fuse (purple arrows). There is a blue arrow pointing to a main fuse of 7Amps Slow Blow. This is for the cab overall and for the 120VAC line that attaches for marquee lighting and other misc (fans and such). Highlighted by yellow arrow. The 50VAC heads directly into the 15 pin Molex connector. Specifically on pins 13 and 15 (14 is ground): Follow the red arrows. Then it comes into the Deflection board via the connector as shown here: Note the pins 13 and 15 (red arrow) which heads into the deflection board where there is a set of 5amp Slow Blow fuses. The +24V and -24V are separated via the diodes (CR14-CR17) and smoothed with capacitors . You can see the positive voltage, ground and negative voltage heading off to the High Voltage board through a connector as indicated by the Blue Arrow. From here it is brought to the High Voltage PCB as indicated in the blue arrows, and you can see your +24V and -24V on the red arrows. Here is a component view of the deflection board on an Amplifone where you can see the two 5 Amp Slow Blow fuses (highlighted in red arrows): So the deflection board should have the fuses in place to handle the voltages coming in, hence why I said you don't need them coming off your power supplies. If it would make you more comfortable having something there then you can add redundancy with 5amp slow blows. If you want to really be comfortable than you could contact Shilmover on KLOV. BTW - all of these schematics can be found online. And if you don't know about ArcMissions site storing these (you can thank bperkins01 and MikeA), then you can find a lot of great stuff here: https://arcarc.xmission.com The above used schematics from Major Havoc for reference: https://arcarc.xmission.com/PDF_Arcade_Atari_Kee/Major_Havoc/Major_Havoc_SP-252_2nd_Printing.pdf and from the Amplifone manual: https://www.arcade-museum.com/manuals-monitors/Atari%20Monitor%20TM-239%201st%20Printing%20Amplifone%2019in%20and%2025in%20Color%20XY.pdf |
| bobbyb13:
Outstanding info Arroyo, appreciate you taking that time. I knew very little about electronics when I started on this hobby and learn best through specific examples like this still, so thank you. :cheers: Fear of blowing things up to begin with (when I knew even less than I do now!) made me want to fuse the power inputs. Man did I go through a lot of 3 amp fast blow fuses- and continue to think I ruined something. And that was because the only info I could find about it anywhere was difficult to find to begin with (and on facebook?!) and turned out to be wrong- of course. It is the primary reason I started this thread actually, to start the conversation here and hopefully catalog some helpful info for others in the future. Original vector hardware was really finicky and not robust and so many who talk about the stuff speak in hushed grave tones with stories of component meltdowns and unsalvageable monitors. Turns out they are less complicated than raster monitors. Appears to me that issues with original ones were mostly inadequate transistor cooling, tired power supplies, and video input signal voltage spikes, so if you bulletproof those you can have a reliable monitor. When you look at what you and I are putting together these issues have been well addressed so it will be interesting to see what we get for longevity. These new reproduction parts are better in nearly every important way from what I can see. I need to check that tube embossing. It's a big one though, so it is going to be a weird number! |
| bobbyb13:
To confirm what I thought I read in the E.I.A. registration document for this TV, tube embossment shows... 25 V 110 Maybe was a blessing that this thing had a bonded yoke. Not like anything else I could find was going to work well with this tube anyway. The upper left hand corner has some convergence weirdness at the very outside corner, really only noticeable in menu borders and test screens. Still looks really good in gameplay somehow. It will be interesting to see if playing with magnet strips stuck somewhere on the tube can fix that, since yoke position or ring adjustments are completely out of the question in this instance. Yet another thing that I have yet to find a well done "How- To" on- Purity and convergence. I've read a few things that gave me huge confidence in my ability to tune up an image, and in practice I get little to nothing for results. Disheartening really, since I would like to get it better than 'good enouugh.' |
| Zebidee:
There are plenty of CRT convergence setup guides and videos. Problem is, they sometimes leave you feeling more confused. For me, I find the best approach is to think of it as three phases to perform & complete in sequence, before moving onto the next: "purity, static convergence, and dynamic convergence". If you don't do the steps sequentially and in order things tend to get messy. Purity phase means getting colour right/balanced. Input a white signal, or use a screen or solid colour red/green/blue, then move the yoke back/forth and/or the first pair of rings (closest to front, two magnets) to get a solid full-screen of colour/white). After this phase, if you moved the yoke, you can put back your rubber wedges and tighten it up again. Static Convergence phase is about bringing red & blue together. Input a crosshatch pattern (turn off green if you like). Adjust the second pair of rings (middle, 4 magnets.) Dynamic Convergence means bringing the green together with the red & blue. Use a crosshatch pattern and adjust the third ring pair (closest to back, 6 magnets). The term "dynamic convergence" also includes a bunch of other later-stage convergence adjustments, mostly for picture edge, such as tweaking pots for pincushion, linearity, hourglass etc, adjustments in service menus, and so forth. I like to think of this extra pot-fiddling as an additional "tweaking convergence" phase. To help understand all this, remember that the cathode ray guns are (usually) lined up R-G-B (or is it B-G-R?) such that GREEN is in the middle. You have a TPG, it is great tool for this. Unfortunately my experience is all based on raster monitors, not vector & any differences. |
| bobbyb13:
There ARE many- and they are all just vague enough to make the whole thing impossible to do well- after even multiple attempts. :-\ Vector stuff is different, but mercifully the menu that Chad made for this setup includes a host of great test patterns all with the ability to swap colors throughout. I wish someone who knows well how to do it would put together something with pics or video, including caveats and explaining what is going on when things aren't going properly. Merely a list of steps (even a thorough one!) on how to do it is simply inadequate for learning how to do this. I'm sharper than the average bowling ball and fairly patient, and I still can't get anything to look right! |
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