Need some advice re: a potential mini racer cabinet project idea.

[MrThunderwing]

I bought one of these Thumbs Up Retro Racer mini cabinets awhile back with a gift voucher I got from my work. The games on it look and sound about the equivalent of something you'd find on the NES, but are really all just utter trash. It's got a nice little steering wheel on it though and I keep getting notions in my head about whether it'd be feasible to take it apart and stick something like an ultra small form Raspberry PI in there, and re-using the existing controls and the screen it comes with. The only problem being, I'm clueless about any kind of electrical hacking and soldering type stuff. I hooked up the Xin-Mo 2 Player Arcade Controller Interface on my Barcade about 6 or 7 years ago, so I've a vague notion of how arcade controllers and daisy chains and that work from back then, but that's about it.

What I'd really like to know, is if I can hack the controls on this thing to work like a regular PC joypad. I haven't looked inside it yet, but I'm 100% certain there's no analog steering involved, the wheel's just moving left and right like a digital d-pad and that's all I'd want to replicate, so I'm not looking for anything complex involving potentiometers or anything like that.

If it's just working on the same principle of a regular joypad, of closing a circuit when a button is pushed, could I just cut whatever wires the wheel's attached to inside it control-wise and solder them to the left and right function on a cheap (and small) USB joypad instead? Or do I need to look at getting something like an ipac arcade encoder to connect it up to? Is that even possible for something like this? (I know I'm asking a lot of questions for something I haven't even looked inside yet - I'm thinking hypothetically here...)

I had a look at the tutorials in the main section of the site, but I couldn't seem to find any info on this very specific thing I'm thinking of - specifically using the controls and buttons already built into the machine on a PI. Can anyone here suggest any helpful videos or tutorials or just provide some general advice? I'm not too worried about the the feasibility of re-using the screen 
at the moment, really I just want to figure out if re-using the existing controls is possible first.

Thanks in advance for any responses!

[baritonomarchetto]

Even is it's not your main concern at the moment, interfacing the monitor has the potential to be the most difficul part. I see no reason connecting those switches to a raspy GPIOs should be a problem.
Is a raspy going to fit in there?

[vandale]

Don't use the existing screen, just buy a cheap china lcd. Also you could use a intel stick pc allowing you to run M2 emulator. Then some Daytona art and your done.

[MrThunderwing]

Wow, I didn't even know stick PCs were a thing! That definitely seems like it would potentially be an easier solution than a PI (which I don't really know anything about). I was fully thinking I'd probably need to completely swap the screen out.

I've actually already decided on an Outrun theme for it and designed some artwork based on the standard upright to fit the mini cabinet's form factor - you can see some black and white mock up pics attached (the colour jets in my printer died ages back). I'm currently waiting on some colour vinyl sticky back plastic versions to arrive in the post. My original plan had just been to dress this cheapo mini cabinet up like an Outrun and that was it, it wasn't until  I got properly into the design bit I started to think about ACTUALLY modding it to play some MAME stuff.

[BadMouth]

Years ago I bought a similar looking non-racing mini arcade cab from a clearance bin with hopes of making a tiny MAME machine.  I had a Pi zero with retro-arc installed & a Kade encoder ready to go.  The screens were more than I wanted to spend on a novelty, so I abandoned the project.

Don't do it if you're not going to do analog controls.  Racing cabs suck without analog controls.

If you do it without analog controls anyway, limit it to Sega Genesis ports of the games since they were designed to be played with digital controls.

Pretty sure you'd have to solder or at least crimp the connections to the controls interface at a minimum.

[BadMouth]

It turns out that I actually made a project thread for that mini cab:http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,152580.msg1597351.html#msg1597351
The project was abandoned and the picture quality is horrible, but there might be something of use there.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks for the link to your project BM. I was thinking of just sticking with digital controls initially as I wasn't planning on having anything more advanced than MAME in there and I've found (from playing some 2D racers on my phone) that stuff like Outrun and Chase HQ play ok-ish like that, using my 8BitDo Zero 2 Wireless Bluetooth Gamepad Controller. Obviously, stuff like Daytona and Outrun 2 wouldn't be good.

I think I'm going to need to have a think about how advanced I'm prepared to go with this. I've got a mate who's electronics and soldering savvy, who's arm I've managed to twist into working on this with me. He also knows about PIs and MAME which is handy. Small form PI with some kind of hacked digital USB joypad and a cheapo mini screen with the intention of just 2D stuff on MAME was really all I was originally intending.

Hooking up an Arduino with a potentiometer seems like it would be the way to go forward if I wanted to turn that mini wheel into a bespoke analog device. But will whatever custom software I need to run that work on a PI? Stick based PC could be the way forward there, but this increases price substantially, but does open up the possibility of adding Model 2 Emu on it... But if I wanted to play Daytona properly, I'd need to add in a load of extra buttons.

Also, space inside is going to be very limited. I'm assuming cheapo 2.5 - 3 Inch monitors don't do sound, so I'm probably going to need a teeny weeny sound bar to fit in there... Plus, I know I'll want to light up the Marquee somehow too. Maaaaybe even look into MAMEhooker for some output lamps...

So, yeah... A bit to think about there...

Edit: Oh and Vandale's totally got me into the idea of some Daytona art to fit the cabinet. I've bought a second one off of Amazon (only £18). Even if I don't do anything with the innards, I might just dress this one up like a mini Daytona. I've already made the art now. I'll probably spray it black. I might have a go at some fake mini T moulding with some epoxy putty and try to make a tiny cardboard bezel.

[MrThunderwing]

Here's 2 different Daytona mini upright side art designs i've come up with. I've tried to keep the main aesthetic of the Daytona sit down cabs, but used a bit of artistic license. Which one do you guys prefer? Option 1 on the left or or option 2 on the right?

[Mike A]

"stuff like Outrun and Chase HQ play ok-ish like that"

Is that really the bar you want to set for game play?

I don't get it.

[MrThunderwing]

Well, nothing's set in stone yet, but I wouldn't have a problem with that particular bar: it's a tiny device, it's really going to be more of a novelty than something I'm going to be pouring hours of gameplay into. OK-ish was probably a bad choice of phrase - they play fine with digital controls.

[vandale]

"stuff like Outrun and Chase HQ play ok-ish like that"

Is that really the bar you want to set for game play?

I don't get it.

Its a novelty toy the size of your mum's dildo, its not a driving sim.

[Mike A]

I always try to set the bar high.

Even on a novelty project.

You might just want to play some kind of video of gameplay on the screen if it is a display piece.

That would greatly simplify the project.

Hacking together controls that small that still function reasonably well might not be worth the extra effort.

Whatever you decide I will watch and offer help if I can.

Oh, and vandale, If you don't like that then keep your insults directed at me, not my mother, who is the best person I know.

[MrThunderwing]

So I disassembled the mini racer cabinet today. The controls are connected up to a separate circuit board than the main game. It very handily tells you the name of each input and identifies their location in relation to the ribbon cable that attaches up to it. So, my new plan for this, is that rather than ---smurfing--- around with a PI or a stick PC and trying to figure out how to connect it to a tiny screen (which seemed far more complex than just the plug and play option I was expecting, for the really small HDMI less screen) and also getting a tiny sound bar in there, I've thought of an all in one budget friendly solution! A refurbished secondhand Android phone running MAME4DROID - it's got everything I need ready to go; screen and sound working out the box, a built in rechargeable battery and an easy to install version of MAME. I've tested it out using my own phone sizewise and it (more-or-less) fits, with the portrait version of MAME's screen appearing in just the right place for the screen (the pre-existing monitor bezel's a bit too small, but I can easily enough make a new one out of an old CD case with my Dremmel). I've got a tiny Bluetooth joypad that I can use on my phone - so the plan is to figure out a way to hook up to the existing mini control panel, so I can play this with the tiny steering wheel. My electronics savvy friend and I are going to have a think about what the best option for that would be.... So, for a not too dissimilar price to a PI, screen and soundbar, I've got a refurbished secondhand Samsung phone winging it's way to me in the post from eBay.

I bought multiple copies of the art I created for it from the printing place, just so I had plenty of spares if I messed up the application of the stickers. I decided to test one out to see what it looks like in place (I haven't properly applied the side art, it's just temporarily held in place with blu tack). I think it's turned out pretty well. I think I going to need to spray paint the cabinet black though to match the real life Outrun upright.

[MrThunderwing]

Outrun 2

[BadMouth]

Sweet!   Was not expecting leaf switch steering...

I do recommend usb input instead of bluetooth if you can find a device and fit it.  The lag is night and day, at least on my phone.

[MrThunderwing]

The only issue with that though, is that the usb socket's going to be in constant use with the power cable attached. I find the Bluetooth connectivity fine myself.

[buttersoft]

That was fast! And a really nice result, too.

[MrThunderwing]

Cheers mate, this is still very much WIP - this was me just checking that a phone running MAME would give the sort of result I was after and that I could get the screen in the right place. The actual phone that's going to sit inside it isn't with me yet, once it arrives, there's a few screw posts and bits and pieces inside I'm going to have to remove. I'm also going to have to make sure that whatever control panel solution we come up with can still fit inside.

[MrThunderwing]

Some (very) WIP test footage. It's literally just me lying my phone inside the empty shell of the cabinet, but it gives you an idea of what it should, hopefully, eventually end up like. With a bezel that's not too small in the finished article, hopefully I'll have some wriggle room with that bit of phone that's poking out the top (although, this isn't the device that ultimately's going to be used), or maybe I might need to make a small additional base to let it fit a smidge better. If I still end up with a bit of phone poking out, I'm sure I can dress it somehow to look like it's part of the cabinet.

[BadMouth]

The only issue with that though, is that the usb socket's going to be in constant use with the power cable attached. I find the Bluetooth connectivity fine myself.

Not pushing it if you are happy with bluetooth, but the solution to that issue would be an "OTG" cable with separate power.  It's basically just a cheap splitter/adapter for the usb port.  They also make them with full size USB-A on one lead which an encoder or gamepad pcb could plug into.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks BM, that's useful to know - good to have more options.

Something that popped into my brain during the night (literally - was just getting up for a pee around 4am and this thought, totally unbidden, just materialised in my brain and then kept me awake), was how to actually access MAME, once the phone's in the case. There are arcade front ends for Android, but I don't know if they can be set to auto start when the device is powered on, like I've got Maximus Arcade set to on my Barcade, and with the bezel in place I can't use the touchscreen. Fortunately technology had my back here and a simple voice command of "Hey Google, run MAME4DROID" started it up hands free. Groovy. If there's a Front End way of doing this, that'd be great, but it's good to know I can access MAME without physically having to get to the phone screen (and this is assuming the cheaper phone I've ordered from eBay can do all the stuff my regular one can)

[MrThunderwing]

The refurbished secondhand Galaxy J5 from 2017 arrived in the post yesterday. I've got it setup with MAME and stuck a load of old school racers on there and a GBA emulator (for the handheld F-Zero games). It's nowhere near as powerful as my actual phone (which secondhand goes for nearly 4 times the cost on eBay as the Galaxy), so it struggles with Outrun 2 Coast 2 Coast on PPSSPP and Daytona USA 2001 using RetroArch. It isn't quite powerful enough for Outrunners on Sega's System 32 board either. Really bizarrely, it struggles a bit with the original Outrun, but it handles all the other 2D Sprite scalers from that time with no problem: Chase HQ, Super Hang-On, Super Monaco GP, Cisco Heat, Racing Hero all play full speed, but the original Outrun has stuttery audio without the frame skip option on. It's weird, because Super Hang-On, Super Monaco GP and Racing Hero are all on later, more powerful Sega boards and Chase HQ came out 3 years after Outrun, so I don't get why the phone's struggling a bit with the older game (in all it's different ROM incarnations...). It's playable with frame skip and the audio gets sorted. The loss of smoothness is barely noticeable, but it bugs me that I can still see it...

I found a frontend for Android called DIG which can be set to auto start on power up, so that's cool. With the bluetooth controller powered on, I can get past the power on lock screen at the touch of a button. The actual physical power on button is located on the side of the phone and it looks like it would be an absolute nightmare to try and figure out a way to hook up an alterantive on/off switch to the plastic case of the cabinet. I think some sort of hinged door that allows access to it might be a simpler alternative.

My sodding Dremmel died when I was having a go at cutting out a new marquee... Alas, not simply a blown fuse in the plug.

[MrThunderwing]

OK, so trying to get the current mini-cabinet controls mapped to the 8BitDo Zero 2 Bluetooth Gamepad with a bit of soldering looks like it's going to be too problematic. So plan B is to try and hook them up to an arcade encoder that'll work on Android. Apparently the Zero Delay Arcade Encoder is Android compatible (so looks like I'll probably need to use an OTG cable as suggested by Bad Mouth).

I need some advice on wiring here though. As I mentioned in my initial post, I'm familiar with the concept of how to wire up arcade buttons to an encoder and daisy chaining them to each other and  the ground. As far as my understanding goes, a PCB is doing the same thing, with the rubber contact pads of a joypad closing the circuit rather than the arcade button. The Retro Racer mini cab's PCB actually tells you what button does what and there's a ground wire too. The Zero Delay doesn't seem to have a ground labelled on it, so how would I go about wiring that in? (Also, each wire in the ribbon cable for each input is singular, so how do they get grounded? Something on the PCB itself connecting them up?)

Any advice gratefully received, cheers!
(Link to the encoder on Amazon: https://amzn.eu/d/3Iu9Vxh )

[PL1]

I need some advice on wiring here though. As I mentioned in my initial post, I'm familiar with the concept of how to wire up arcade buttons to an encoder and daisy chaining them to each other and  the ground. As far as my understanding goes, a PCB is doing the same thing, with the rubber contact pads of a joypad closing the circuit rather than the arcade button. The Retro Racer mini cab's PCB actually tells you what button does what and there's a ground wire too.

I don't see any components like diodes or capacitors on the mini cab's PCB, just the leaf switch.
- Assuming there are no components hiding on the back, your understanding is correct and it should be easy to connect the mini cab PCB to the ZD encoder.
- The ribbon cable input pins are connected to traces (narrow light green parts of the PCB) that lead to one side of the switches.
- The ribbon cable ground pins are connected to the backplanes (wide light green parts of the PCB) that lead to the other side of the switches.  The backplanes are like a daisy-chain ground wire in normal arcade wiring.

WARNING: Ensure there are any no ground connections/wires to the PCB other than the two "GND" pins on the ribbon cable before connecting this PCB to the ZD encoder.  If there is another ground connection/wire to the PCB, the mod described below will short 5v to ground. 

The Zero Delay doesn't seem to have a ground labelled on it, so how would I go about wiring that in? (Also, each wire in the ribbon cable for each input is singular, so how do they get grounded? Something on the PCB itself connecting them up?)

Most ZD encoders are "active high" devices. (5v triggers the input port, not ground)

As you can see in this pic, the outer pins on the ZD are daisy-chained together via the outer backplane of the PCB.
- The outer backplane/pins are almost certainly providing 5v.  It wouldn't hurt to verify this with your multimeter.   
- When you press a button, the 5v from the outer backplane/pin is applied to the inner pin which is connected to the input port.  5v on the input port triggers the associated output.



Since the mini cab's PCB doesn't have any components like diodes or electrolytic capacitors on it, you can connect it to the ZD encoder.
- Connect one outer pin on the ZD (daisy-chained 5v) to one of the GND pins (daisy-chained grounds) on the mini cab PCB ribbon cable.
- Connect a different outer pin on the ZD to the other GND pin on the mini cab PCB ribbon cable.
- Connect the inner pins of the ZD (input ports) to the desired pins on the mini cab PCB ribbon cable.


Scott

[MrThunderwing]

Thank you for the extremely detailed reply PL1, it's greatly appreciated. So, just to make sure I'm understanding you correctly here, I'd be looking to wire up the ground pins like in the (crudely doodled on my phone) attachment?

[MrThunderwing]

One other question: I notice the ZD's got these two separate "Power 5v" pins - will it need an external power source from somewhere or will just plugging the USB cable into the phone suffice?

[PL1]

So, just to make sure I'm understanding you correctly here, I'd be looking to wire up the ground pins like in the (crudely doodled on my phone) attachment?

You got it.  Mini cab PCB daisy-chain to encoder daisy-chain.   

One other question: I notice the ZD's got these two separate "Power 5v" pins - will it need an external power source from somewhere or will just plugging the USB cable into the phone suffice?

Those red "Power 5v" connectors are power outputs for LEDs IIRC.

Plugging the encoder USB cable into the phone is the only thing you need for power.


Scott

[MrThunderwing]

Brilliant, thanks Scott 

[BadMouth]

Do you already have the zero delay encoder?

I would think there should be something out there with a smaller form factor and better usb connector type. Maybe PL1 can say if there is a current kade equivalent.

You might also look into the raspberry pi pico.  They are only $5.  I am assuming there is a premade image out there to use it as an encoder and that it will work with android.  It will also do analog if you decide to add it later.

[PL1]

I would think there should be something out there with a smaller form factor and better usb connector type. Maybe PL1 can say if there is a current kade equivalent.

If someone wants a small form-factor Arduino for a project like this, a Pro Micro (0.71" x 1.4" + micro USB connector length) is a great choice.
- There are plenty of inputs and, like the Ras Pi Pico, the KADE miniArcade 2.0 firmware can handle analog inputs. (potentiometers)



- If you want to insulate the Pro Micro, 3d print a case like this one.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4295684


Scott

[MrThunderwing]

I've already got the Zero Delay on order from Amazon - I just went with it as it's apparently Android compatible - form factor-wise it doesn't seem too big in the pictures, so I think it should be OK... 😬

I think, on reflection, deciding to use the Android phone for this was really creating a bit of a rod for my own back. If I were to do it again I think PI Zero 2 would be the way forward (unfortunately though, they don't seem to be in stock with regular retailers in the UK and are only available on eBay and Amazon from scalpers for 4-5 times their normal RRP. I ---smurfing--- hate scalpers...)

Just out of curiosity, Is that Pro Micro Arduino something that needs some programming ability, or are they plug and play?

[PL1]

Is that Pro Micro Arduino something that needs some programming ability, or are they plug and play?

With the KADE MiniArcade 2.0 Mapper program you don't need any programming skills, just the ability to read/follow the detailed directions in the User Guide to select the desired settings and upload the firmware to the Arduino.
- There's an Arduino-specific section of the User Guide with all the details you need to know. 

Once you do that, the Pro Micro will appear as a USB HID keyboard or a USB HID gamepad.



Just re-uploaded the Windows version of the program to Sendspace and updated the link in the first post in the MiniArcade 2.0 thread.
- The User Guide is in the "docs" folder if you want to check it out.
https://www.sendspace.com/file/y5yc5x
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,154126.msg1615622.html#msg1615622


Scott

[buttersoft]

The Arduino Pro Micros are great. Many ppl here will be able to help you troubleshoot. The pi pico is even better for windows but i'm not sure about adroid gamepad firmware. It might just work, IDK.

[MrThunderwing]

OK, thanks fellas, good to know!

A quick question about aesthetics - This is purely subjective, but I'm just curious what other people think here....

I'd been thinking about spray painting the mini cabinet black to better match the look of the original Outrun stand up cabinet, but I think I actually quite like the red cabinet with the black bordered monitor (a red cabinet seems kinda in keeping with Outrun's red Ferraris). The original Outrun stand-up had a grey monitor bezel with the route map under the screen, that did that kind of indented thing so the CRT is sunk back a bit in it (I can't think what the correct term for it is). I've removed the original bezel from the mini cabinet and cut almost all the plastic back underneath to fit the new one I've made, just leaving a centimeter or so of the original plastic to adhere the new one to. The phone screen takes up most of the display, so when I mask off the bezel and paint it, the painted edges will literally only be a a centimeter or so, so no room for the route map and it will obviously be just a flat piece of clear plastic, without the indented effect.

So, my question is this: Do you think a flat, grey edged bezel will look a bit crap? If I spray the cab black and the edges of the bezel black too, is it going to be too much black? Do you reckon I might be better off just leaving it red and the bezel edges black (like the original bezel it came with). Thoughts?

[BadMouth]

I like the red.  If it ain't broke don't fix it.
Not sure about the bezel.  I'd have to see it.
EDIT: After looking at some pics, I say black bezel.  It leans more toward the sit-down cabs, but I think the color scheme (outside of the artwork) on them looks better.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks BM. I'd pretty much talked myself into just leaving it red, good to get an additional perspective on it.

[Howard_Casto]

Patiently waiting to see how this turns out.   Out of curiosity how old and busted can a phone be to still run android mame at a respectable speed?   I've got some phones lying around but they are super jank... like tracfone jank.   

[BadMouth]

Patiently waiting to see how this turns out.   Out of curiosity how old and busted can a phone be to still run android mame at a respectable speed?   I've got some phones lying around but they are super jank... like tracfone jank.

The MAME4droid on my phone is based on MAME V.139.   There are other ports of MAME out there based on v.32.  So it's very much like a PC.  If it won't run full speed, try an older version.

[MrThunderwing]

Progress is on a little bit of a hiatus at the moment, until the encoder arrives, which Amazon is telling me will be around mid-March time. One tiny little thing I've done is paint the 'pedals' with some old silver enamel paint I had lying around and then gave them a quick wash with some watered down black acrylic, to make them look a bit more metallic rather than cheapo red plastic. I also painted up the gear stick black and silver and the top row of buttons light green (to match the Outrun start button).
The OTG cable I bought off Amazon arrived a few days ago and I was able to get a wired PC controller working with no hassle on the Android phone (literally plug n play). Having a cable plugged into the bottom of the phone makes it a bit too big for the case. I've got a very small right-angled micro USB extension on order from eBay, but if it's still too big with that, I'm probably going to need to cut a hole in the bottom and just add an additional base to the cabinet that's just a few centimetres or so.

Howard, MAME4DROID took me literal seconds to setup. I wasn't aware there were different versions (as BM mentioned), but the one I got from the Google play store just needs to install then you just direct it to your ROMs folder and you're good to go! Probably worth just giving it a shot on your old devices and seeing what results you get.

[BadMouth]

Looking good.   
Steering wheel needs a black on yellow Ferrari logo in the middle if you can one for a buck or two.  Doesn't have to be a circle.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks dude. I ordered a sheet of variable size Ferrari water transfer logos for models from eBay earlier in the week. Currently winging it's way in the post to me from China.

[buttersoft]

I've looked at all the mini-consoles coming out over the last few years and felt nothing at all. But this is somehow different, it feels alive. And i just figured out why i'm enjoying it. It's not only that some of the more respected coommunity members are weighing in, it's the way you've just encapsulated our hobby in miniature. Like a terrarium

[MrThunderwing]

Ha! A terrarium, I love that  I'd been hoping for years that Sega would produce a little arcade racer system in a similar sort of scale to the Astro City Mini. I genuinely hadn't intended for this to turn into a little project, all I'd intended to do was just dress up the original cabinet like a mini Outrun and that was going to be it.

Quick question: If I wanted to plug a little LED into the 5v power out on the Zero Delay for a potential lit marquee, what's the proper name for the 2 pin connector things on it? Presumably, I can just buy these separately to wire up to stuff?

Decided to try Daytona in MAME last night, knowing full well there was no hope in hell of it running full speed in the Galaxy. Found a ROM that wasn't specifically for MAME4DROID, but it worked. It plays about the same as when I tried Daytona out for the very first time in Model 2 Emulator on my old Pentium 4 that had about half a GB of RAM, and an ancient AGP video card.

[buttersoft]

Those are JST-XH 2-pin connectors. Lots available on ebay or aliexpress

[BadMouth]

Those are JST-XH 2-pin connectors. Lots available on ebay or aliexpress

You might also find one on a cooling fan from a pc or other electronics.

Kits of the connectors aren't expensive, but the crimping tool kinda is if you are never going to use it again.  If you know anyone into building 3D printers, they will have the tool and a stockpile of connectors.

EDIT: didn't the zero delay come with a pile of them pre-crimped to leads?

[MrThunderwing]

Good point - it does come with a load of 2 pin connectors. I was thinking I wouldn't have any spare (as in all the ones it comes with would be used up by the buttons), but thinking about it, the PCB actually only has 7 inputs, so there should be some cables to spare.

This has actually just made me think of another question: Theoretically, if I wanted to add some additional mini buttons to the cabinet (always useful to have) like a little start and 'coin in' button in the area the coin chute sticker is, what would be the best option? Googling mini arcade buttons, the Suzo Happ mini buttons stuff seems like the smallest you can get from proper arcade vendors, but I think they'd protrude way too deeply into the tiny cabinet (the 'iceberg effect'). I've seen some really basic tiny buttons on Amazon that aren't specifically for arcade stuff, that look a bit smaller still, but it's saying they're 12v, so I don't know if they're usable?

My other thought was about whether to just use another PCB (like this one) to just wire two additional joypad style buttons in, but this feels a bit overkill for just two buttons.

[PL1]

This has actually just made me think of another question: Theoretically, if I wanted to add some additional mini buttons to the cabinet (always useful to have) like a little start and 'coin in' button in the area the coin chute sticker is, what would be the best option?

6x6x__mm or 6x3x__mm tactile buttons -- the blank indicates actuator length -- and perfboard/strip board/prototyping board are your best bet for shallow buttons.

This 6x6x7mm has an actuator that sticks up 3.5mm above the body of the button.

 

it's saying they're 12v, so I don't know if they're usable?

They're rated for 12v meaning that the contacts won't arc at 12v. 
- Don't try to use them with 120 VAC from a wall socket.

They will handle encoder 5v with no problem.


Scott

[BadMouth]

Just spitballing, but red plungers on black microswitches side by side kinda looks like a coin door if you could cut a perfect size square for them to pass through.

I don't have that color combo on hand.  Omron switches on sanwa pcb left, mini microswitches (probably too small) middle, standard arcade microswitch right.

You'd just push the plunger directly.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks for the info Scott, those look like they'd be the route to go down, it I do decide to go down the extra buttons route. Having said that though...

Just spitballing, but red plungers on black microswitches side by side kinda looks like a coin door if you could cut a perfect size square for them to pass through.

Oooooh, I'm liking your thinking there chief. A little bit of DIY guerilla arcade button usage - like it. Y'know, I've just remembered I've got a single solitary leftover full size arcade button from when I was putting my barcade together all those year ago... Might pop it open and see if the plunger's oriented the right way around that I could just use it like that.

[BadMouth]

If you have to pop it open, it uses keyboard type switches instead of classic microswitches.
Still might be of use, but won't be the same type switch.

[MrThunderwing]

Could I get away with just wiring those mini tactile buttons straight to the encoder, rather than using a perfboard? Would I need to solder/crimp a ground and input wire to each of those 4 connectors in the bottom or just to 2 of them?

[PL1]

Could I get away with just wiring those mini tactile buttons straight to the encoder, rather than using a perfboard?

The perfboard provides a way to backstop/mount the switch.  Without the perfboard, you'd try to press the tactile switch actuator and the button would just fall into the cab.   

You could use non-conductive hardboard or a 3d printed holder in place of perfboard.

Would I need to solder/crimp a ground and input wire to each of those 4 connectors in the bottom or just to 2 of them?

Solder the 5v common wire (remember it's not ground on the ZD) to one leg and the input wire to the farthest leg away from it.  i.e. pins 1 and 4 or pins 2 and 3. (click on the 2nd pic from my previous post for a better view of the schematic and pin numbers)
- This way you're guaranteed that common and input are not accidently tied together on one side of the switch. i.e. pins 1 and 2 or pins 3 and 4.   

    1---|---2
          |
           \       <== Pole of SPST switch.  Pressing the actuator connects 1+2 to 3+4.
          |
    3---|---4


Scott

[MrThunderwing]

OK, gotcha! Thanks again Scott, greatly appreciated 

[MrThunderwing]

Progress! Control panel PCB successfully connected up to the arcade encoder, as well as 2 LEDS for the marquee and some of the extra mini buttons. I can take no credit for most of this though, this was the work of my mate James who did all the soldering as we used the very helpful info provided by Scott as a guide and between us figured out what went where input and ground wire-wise. I provided some very helpful assistance by holding the odd wire or bit of solder in place.

[MrThunderwing]

Hmmmm, this would definitely make my cable management a bit easier... One ordered from.eBsy.


Edited:
Trying to find a "one cable that does all" seems to be a major ballache for this Samsung phone. The OTG cable works great for the arcade encoder, but if I plug a male-to-male USB cable in and plug it into the mains it doesn't seem to power it. I bought a little micro USB right angled connector to try and help the phone fit better into the mini arcade case, but when I plug the arcade encoder in, via the OTG, it doesn't power the encoder. Gnnnn. But if I use the phone's included micro USB charging cable in conjunction with the right angled micro USB connector, it does charge the phone. FFS.... There's a micro USB device that charges called a Lava SimulCharge USB 1-Port Adapter that looks like it'd solve this, and has a nice small form factor, but I cannot find one in stock anywhere.... Seems there's some other hubs with a charge cable function, but they're a bit big and have got more connectors than I need.

Oh well... The front of the arcade cabinet is now basically a plug n play arcade pad, so if I decide (in the long run) it might just be easier to go down the PI Zero 2 route with a 3 Inch screen, it's still an option. I'm still pressing forward with the phone plan - I'm thinking I'm just going to have to make it somehow that I can access the micro USB charging port underneath it to swap out the encoder cable for a charging one. I think this is where a small base underneath it might be in order, which also allows for some extra space for the charging cables to poke our of... it might be useful if I could stick the encoder down there too, as I t didn't realise it was going to have an LED on the actual board itself and I don't want any extraneous light in the mini cabinet itself, other than the marquee LEDS.

Oh, and the Ferrari logo transfers arrived from China. Whoop!

[MrThunderwing]

Lads, quick question. I had to cut a whopping gert hole in the back panel, back when I was first starting this,  to remove the AAA battery compartment the original hardware was using. I've still got the original battery cover. What would be the best option to fill this gap? Either using the battery cover as part of it and filling the gaps or something else to fill the whole hole. I was thinking maybe some fibreglass kit that you can fix car bumpers with?
Or is that going to be a bit like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut and there's actually some easy plastic putty filling type solution?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B074KHWKPV/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1634&creative=6738&creativeASIN=B074KHWKPV&linkCode=as2&tag=journeytomy0c-21&linkId=aad8e73f8b05e5d7e427da844535a078

[BadMouth]

I wouldn't spend money on a fiberglass repair kit.  It looks like ABS plastic.  If it is, you can weld in scrap ABS from the battery compartment using acetone.  Both by softening/melting together the edges with it and by making a thick slurry that can patch holes.  To make the slurry, cut it up into TINY pieces and let it soak in about an equal amount of acetone.  If you sand and polish afterwards, you can get it fairly smooth.  It takes some time to get a feel for it, but is a pretty neat technique to have in your arsenal.  I did this to hack the dust collection port on my planer to make it exit the other side.  Worth a try for the cost of a bottle of nail polish remover.  (Black parts are random scrap ABS from elsewhere)

[MrThunderwing]

Interesting, thanks BM. So, does the slurry just harden and cure or something over time once you remove it from the acetone?

[BadMouth]

Interesting, thanks BM. So, does the slurry just harden and cure or something over time once you remove it from the acetone?

Acetone melts it.  When the acetone evaporates out of it, it hardens again back into solid ABS.  It's kind of like applying heat to melt it and letting it cool to harden, but chemically.  It does take some technique.  To make a slurry or paste you've got to let the abs sit in acetone for a fairly long time depending on how big the chunks are (I make tiny crumbles)  To join big flat pieces, you can just soak the edges for less than a  minute and then push the melted edges together.  It will look messy, but can be sanded down.  You can brush it on with an acid brush but in my limited experience it needs to be wet down several times before the area softens up enough to join.

A couple youtube videos that came up in a quick search.  The baking soda and super glue trick also came up, which might also work.


Hadn't seen someone use straight slurry with window screen, but I might use that one in the future.

(He could have just joined the edges without using an extra piece for reinforcement)

[BadMouth]

To clarify...
What I would do is glue or acetone weld the battery cover that was removed into the corner of the opening you've made and then use flat pieces cut from the battery compartment to fill in as much as possible.  Then fill in smaller holes and low spots with slurry made from the rest of the battery compartment.  After is has hardened, you can sand it all smooth.  You could theoretically sand it with progressively finer sandpaper and then polish it.  Faster route would be glaze putty and spray paint after sanding.

[BadMouth]

Just had a thought... If you haven't made a mess yet (it will look horrible before it looks good), you could try to make a big rectangle separate from the cab before messing with the cab.  Then if it goes wrong, at least you haven't melted part of the cab.

[vandale]

You guys are going far and beyond what I expected. Well done!!!! Im impressed.

[MrThunderwing]

Thanks for all the info and the video links BM! 2 bottles of Acetone ordered from Amazon! I've got a load of leftover plastic sprue from a (still Outrun related) Monogram Ferrari Testarossa plastic model kit I put together awhile back, I purposely didn't get rid of it in case I could use is somehow for this project (it's even the right colour), is that going to be the same sort of easily melty type plastic do you reckon?

You guys are going far and beyond what I expected. Well done!!!! Im impressed.

Thanks dude. Yeah, I'm surprised myself I've actually ended up progressing as far with this as I have. It'll be nice if I can just stick the landing now and get it all packed up into something that's useable and aesthetically pleasing 

[MrThunderwing]

So the USB B to Micro USB cable arrived in the post and when I plug it in it doesn't appear to be providing any power to the encoder...  Uggghhh. Is the cable busted or is there some reason why it wouldn't power the encoder? Is it normal that some things seem to only charge but not operate USB plug in stuff and vice versa? (Edited: found the answer myself - Cables with micro USB can often be charge-only cables that miss the data lines. Wish there was some way to know which one is which, none of the places that sell them seem to differentiate) I've got a couple of old USB A to USB B cables in my box of 'old cables that might come in useful one day'. All these old cables work with the encoder and the OTG cable I bought, I'm wondering whether it might be easier to just cut one of them up and get rid of all the excess cable in the middle and make a DIY super short USB B to A cable by splicing it back together with some electrical tape.

Also, I'm in the process of making plastic slurry. It's quite oddly fascinating to watch all the plastic  just slowly dissolving into mush...

[buttersoft]

You're right about those cables. At least %50 of the micro-USB cables i run into are charging only, and kinda useless to hang onto.

You might be better off splicing cable that you know work, yes. Soldering would be neater, if your friend was willing to help again.

I'm keen for some pics of the plastic slurry results! Never tried that way myself. I have done the baking-soda-and-superglue method though

[MrThunderwing]

Well, after an overnight soak in the acetone, all the leftover red plastic sprue from the model Ferrari has turned into a pliable blob about the same consistency of the T1000 from Terminator 2 (or plasticine if you go in for more standard units of measurement). It doesn't seem like the sort of consistency I could brush on to something, but I think it might be useable like this if I put the (still solid) battery cover in the middle of the hole and I squidge this in place around it. I wonder if Acetone in the UK is sold at a less strong concentration than the US, which is maybe why it hasn't fully dissolved into the solution?

[MrThunderwing]

OK, so found the solution to the data/power cable issue - I bought a combined Charging/OTG hub from Amazon for £10. It's actually pretty slim. It's got a little Switch on the side to swap between USB and charging mode. So I've got a slim black box I can fit the encoder and Hub into (just about) and the excess cable, which will be the base. I'm going to cut a little slot in the bottom of the cabinet and the top of the base for the PCB wires to pass through and another for the Hub's micro USB to plug into the phone. I'm going to have to drill another little hole in the side of the cabinet to physically attach a little lever to press the phone's power on button (I'm not crazy on the idea of making a small hole in the side artwork, but the level of phone disassembly required to try and get to the on/off switch and wire it up to the cabinet's existing on/off Switch, and the potential to damage the screen in the process, seems on a whole other level of complexity, compared to wiring up the PCB). I'm going to cut another hole in the side of the base and position the hub next to it, so I should be able then to power on the phone, charge it and operate the control panel, without actually having to open the arcade cabinet to get to it. Once it's finished it'll sit on the base like so (I'm going to beautify the base a bit in the finished product, so it's not quite so obvious just a bit of leftover Amazon packaging). I'm going to use some small neodymium magnets hot glued in place on the base of the cabinet and the top of the base to hold them together, so they are still easily detachable if I need to get to the hub for any reason.

[MrThunderwing]

Well, BadMouth's melty plastic idea seems to have worked pretty well. It's still a bit squidge and pliable at the moment, but I'm hoping over the next 24 hours it'll fully solidify so I can give it a sand and get it looking nice and smooth again.

[BadMouth]

 

That's really good for your first time messing with it! 
I was afraid it was going to be the wrong type of plastic or turn into too much of a PITA.
Kinda glad that I didn't look at BYOAC today until you posted success.
It can look reaaallly bad early in the process sometimes. 

The spru probably would have disolved further if left longer or shredded first.  I prefer the consistency you got.

[MrThunderwing]

Some further progress today. I cut a hole in the area where the marquee was and replaced it with a bit of clear plastic (cut from a CD case) and then used a bit of plastic sprue (more leftover stuff from the model Ferrari kit) to create a mount for the LEDS and then hot glued them in place. I also cut the hole in the bottom of the cabinet for all the encoder wires and charging cable to pass through so they can sit in a separate base. I was also able to see how the phone would line up inside the case with everything in place and drill a tiny hole in the side to use another bit of plastic sprue as the 'on' button (physically pressing the on button on the phone) and I was able to see how it'd look going through the side art, with the stuff I was just using as mock ups. Some backwards progress as well unfortunately, the right directional input has stopped working, I think as I was manhandling the PCB through the hole I'd made in the base of the cabinet, the solder on that input got detached or something (it looks weird on the PCB), so going to be taking it back up to James' at the weekend (he reckons it might just be a bit of dodgy soldering on his part on that connection).

[baritonomarchetto]

It's time to learn how to solder man 

[BadMouth]

It's time to learn how to solder man 

+1

It looks like the trace has lifted off the board which sucks.  Might be salvageable, but if not the wire can be soldered elsewhere or to the switch itself.

If you decide to learn to solder, the most important advice I have is to get a flux pen and use it every time.

[MrThunderwing]

Yup, the Trace had lifted off. I managed to catch my mate last night and we were able to fix it by soldering the right input directly to the leaf switch. The trace on the 'reset' button had also lifted and that wasn't salvageable unfortunately. Fortunately, it's not really been an issue though, as we'd previous wired up a load of extra mini buttons. I've connected them up to the 'plinth' the cabinet is going to sit on, rather than trying to find space on the mini cab itself.

So, I'm actually nearly finished now! I cut all the requisite holes in the plinth last night for the mini buttons and the charging cable and switch for the OTG hub to poke out of. I covered it in black (slightly sparkly) sticky back plastic. Got all the cables squashed into the box, I've made an on/off button on the side, attached to the actual phone's power button with the teeniest smidge of hot glue. Once it's powered on I can get in game ok from the auto starting front-end and can power off the screen OK too. Got all the artwork in place (including the steering wheel Ferrari logo) and all the side buttons on the plinth work OK. I managed to secure the encoder in place in the box with a few little splodges of hot glue on the cardboard, which I let cool then was able to screw into. The encoder seems to not be playing up and has connected up each time I've powered it on. I've also got the new monitor bezel in place I created (out of a CD case) which I masked off and painted today. I'm just doing a bit of final work on the back cover where I cut the big hole in it to remove the battery compartment. The plastic slurry had a sort of weird honeycomb look to it when I sanded it, so I'm trying a small layer of wood putty over it with further sanding just to try and plug the holes (I'm not too bothered if it doesn't quite sort it, no one's going to be looking at the back of it)

[MrThunderwing]

Back panel

[MrThunderwing]

I put together a very small video showing it in action on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/MThunderwing/status/1638678410640736256?t=k 8WIqlJ4F5jmREZ486O0YA&s=19

[MrThunderwing]

OK, back panel on. I probably could've tried to get it looking a bit prettier, but, ehhhh... As I said before, no one's going to be looking at the back of it.

So, the mini cabinet is now 100% finished at last. Here's a couple of before and after photos with the spare one I purchased off Amazon right before I started.

[BadMouth]

Cab looks good.  Not crazy about the cardboard base, but you've spent enough on that I wouldn't sink any more into it. 
(I say as I order aluminum extrusions for 3D printers I don't need and will nickel and dime me to death before they are functional.)

[Fursphere]

(I say as I order aluminum extrusions for 3D printers I don't need and will nickel and dime me to death before they are functional.)

This post speaks to me!  Bought a Tevo Tornado (CR10 clone) few years ago, and spent enough to buy a second upgrading it to be a Prusa MK3s clone (Crearibo build if you're interested).    Then I bought a Prusa MK3s and haven't really used the Tornado since. 

[MrThunderwing]

Cab looks good.  Not crazy about the cardboard base, but you've spent enough on that I wouldn't sink any more into it. 
(I say as I order aluminum extrusions for 3D printers I don't need and will nickel and dime me to death before they are functional.)

Yeah, the cardboard base was a little bit half-arsed in all honesty, I just wanted to try and get the project finished up this week whilst I had a week off work and the creative energy to put into it. It does the job though and it isn't too egregious looking IMHO. From a functional point of view it's been pretty useful as well to have easy access to the OTG hub, as every once in blue moon it doesn't activate the encoder and I have to unplug and plug the encoder USB back in again, which kicks it back into life.

I literally just thought of a possibly more aesthetically pleasing solution this morning than the cardboard box though, which would've been to use one of those metal HDD enclosures you can buy to turn your the leftover HDD from your old PC into a plug and play device for you new PC. But that would involve more expenditure and work and extricating those mini buttons from the side of the box would be a major PITA now (although having said that I've still got some spare).

Using the Android phone route I did, there was just no way to squeeze everything into the mini cabinet. Although the encoder itself isn't all that big, it's stuff like the size of the USB cables sticking out the end that just take up that bit of extra room. I think it definitely would be possible to fit everything in the mini cabinet with a PI Zero 2 and mini screen, as I believe you can just wire all the inputs directly to the PI via the GPIO pins without the need for a seperate encoder, so if any PI savvy peeps out there want to give this a try, I'd love to see the results.

[MrThunderwing]

Video of the finished cabinet in action:


Ma-hoosive thanks to everyone in the thread who's given me advice (in particular PL1 and Bad Mouth for their advice on wiring PCBs, Encoders, teeny arcade buttons, OTG cables and melting plastic with acetone) and anyone else who's provided encouragement to go ahead and do this, especially as the original opening post was just about whether it'd be feasible or not. Cheers fellas! It's been greatly appreciated from start to finish.