Sanwa JLF Shaft vs JLW Shaft

[thelanranger]

Does anyone know if the shaft in these two joysticks is interchangable? I'm having a lot of trouble getting straight answers from anyone and I don't have a JLF anything to compare. It seems like the lower end of the JLF is identical (from the underside of the rest to the bottom where the snap ring goes). Is there any reason why I couldn't use one of these on a JLW body/Ultrastik body?

[BadMouth]

99% sure they are not interchangeable.  IIRC the JLW has a bigger diameter on parts.  Gimme a half hour & I'll dig out parts to verify.

[pbj]

Yeah, my recollection is that JLW has a thicker diameter shaft.  If BadMouth doesn't take measurements, I can.

[BadMouth]

Oops, forgot until browsing BYOAC hours later.  Yeah, they are way different.  JLW top, JLF bottom.  The only spec they have in common is the balltop threads.

[BadMouth]

Is there any reason why I couldn't use one of these on a JLW body/Ultrastik body?

What are you trying to accomplish?

If it's making balltops light up, I refuse to participate in any way.

[thelanranger]

Weird. It was seeming like the lower part was only like .2mm different. That looks like much more.

I was wondering if the Phreakmods "The Link" would fit into the Ultrastik 360 and no one has been able to give me a straight answer. I'm guessing that it does not. Maybe I could have some custom lowers made and use the tops. I had this hair brained scheme to make swappable tops for the Ultrastik that would let you use either a normal bat top/ball top and swap to a joystick top with a couple buttons so I didn't have to make a ridiculous frankenstein machine but I could still have top fire sticks.

[PL1]

I had this hair brained scheme to make swappable tops for the Ultrastik that would let you use either a normal bat top/ball top and swap to a joystick top with a couple buttons so I didn't have to make a ridiculous frankenstein machine but I could still have top fire sticks.

How about a mod like this one that Le Chuck did for his Darkade build?

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/Wireless_Hot-swappable_Trigger_Stick_Mod

Scott

[thelanranger]

Basically that but I wanted to use this: https://arcadeshock.com/collections/phreak-mods/products/phreak-mods-the-link
So, the bat top could be on one upper link, the multi button joystick with a little wireless controller could be in another link, and then I could also locate spinners closer to the joysticks because the link tops could just pop off to not be in the way of anything when you were playing spinner games.

[BadMouth]

The bottom section of the JLF is 6mm.  The JLW is 10mm.
If the bottoms were the same friggin' length you could get away sleeving the bottom of the phreak mod with 10mm OD, 6mm ID capillary tubing and a washer at the top.
https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Aluminum-Round-Length-Tubing/dp/B09C8RRNY9/ref=sr_1_4?crid=3T9ILAN3F5INL&keywords=10mm+x+6mm+id+metal+pipe&qid=1651688852&s=hi&sprefix=10mm+x+6mm+id+metal+pipe%2Ctools%2C110&sr=1-4

The bottom being short makes it more complicated.  I guess you could leave the sleeve long and cut grooves in the sides to hold the C clip.  eh, the chances of the 6mm ID tubing being too tight are probably good.  It might involve spinning the shaft in a drill chuck while holding sandpaper to it. 
.....I have a tendency toward spending too much time and money doing things just to see if they can be done.   

What you need is a machinist friend with a metal lathe.  Making the bottom half of the phreak mod shaft would be an easy task for them.
I used to have a machinist friend who made me a few custom joystick shafts and adapters.  RIP Mark. 


EDIT: The tubing I linked is aluminum.  Stainless steel would be better.  More of a PITA to work with, but better for wear against the microswitch levers.

[PL1]

Basically that but I wanted to use this: https://arcadeshock.com/collections/phreak-mods/products/phreak-mods-the-link

Two of the three most likely approaches use The Link.

1. Swap your JLW sticks for JLF, LS-32, LS-56, LS-58, LS-60, or LS-62 sticks and use two of The Link.

2. Follow Badmouth's advice and get someone to make the bottom part on a metal lathe and use the tops from two of The Link.

3. Mod your JLW so the balltop and wireless triggerstick are held in place using a magnet instead of The Link.


Scott

[thelanranger]

The bottom section of the JLF is 6mm.  The JLW is 10mm.
If the bottoms were the same friggin' length you could get away sleeving the bottom of the phreak mod with 10mm OD, 6mm ID capillary tubing and a washer at the top.
https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Aluminum-Round-Length-Tubing/dp/B09C8RRNY9/ref=sr_1_4?crid=3T9ILAN3F5INL&keywords=10mm+x+6mm+id+metal+pipe&qid=1651688852&s=hi&sprefix=10mm+x+6mm+id+metal+pipe%2Ctools%2C110&sr=1-4

The bottom being short makes it more complicated.  I guess you could leave the sleeve long and cut grooves in the sides to hold the C clip.  eh, the chances of the 6mm ID tubing being too tight are probably good.  It might involve spinning the shaft in a drill chuck while holding sandpaper to it. 
.....I have a tendency toward spending too much time and money doing things just to see if they can be done.   

What you need is a machinist friend with a metal lathe.  Making the bottom half of the phreak mod shaft would be an easy task for them.
I used to have a machinist friend who made me a few custom joystick shafts and adapters.  RIP Mark. 


EDIT: The tubing I linked is aluminum.  Stainless steel would be better.  More of a PITA to work with, but better for wear against the microswitch levers.

Your JLW shaft is 10mm in diameter? The bottom of all 6 of the JLW/Ultrastik 360 shafts that I have are 8.7mm in diameter. They're also the same length as the documentation for the JLF (which I forget but something like 30mm long +/- 3mm + 2mm for the little circle bit).
Someone else I had measure the upper diameter (but they couldn't take theirs apart) showed the top part of the JLW to be something like 8.5mm in diameter (which I found really odd because while this is not used for anything mechanical is quite close to the diameter of the JLW but not a "machinist tolerance error").
The length of the bottom is an issue though. Especially for the Ultrastik as it uses a magnet on the bottom. The diameter is almost a nonissue as long as it fits through the hole in the pivot point because the switches are not relevant to operation.

[thelanranger]

Hrm...and ACTUALLY...I know for a fact that the ball top threads are different. 
The Ultrastik and the JLW from Ultimarc have 10mm threads and the replacement stick has 6 and had one of those little brass doobers to let you screw on the 10 mm heads. 

[thelanranger]

These are the two that I have. Both are JLW shafts, the short one is the 'original' and the other is a replacement hollow, long shaft (20mm longer).

From the bottom of the rim to the end of the stick it is 35mm (this includes the little bit for the snap ring). The diameter if the lower is 8.97mm on both (The original, the 'hub' at the bottom is narrower for some reason at 8mm which is somewhat relevant to the ultrastik 360 as it has an inset magnet that has a hole that is 8mm inside and uses that.)

Upper shaft on the original is 11.87mm, upper shaft on the 'long' version is the same as the lower at 8.97mm (The ring itself is 12mm on the dot outside diameter).

10mm threads on the original, 6mm threads on the 'long' version.

Overall lengths are 82mm and 102mm respectively.

Seems like these don't

[BadMouth]

Your JLW shaft is 10mm in diameter? The bottom of all 6 of the JLW/Ultrastik 360 shafts that I have are 8.7mm in diameter. They're also the same length as the documentation for the JLF (which I forget but something like 30mm long +/- 3mm + 2mm for the little circle bit).
Someone else I had measure the upper diameter (but they couldn't take theirs apart) showed the top part of the JLW to be something like 8.5mm in diameter (which I found really odd because while this is not used for anything mechanical is quite close to the diameter of the JLW but not a "machinist tolerance error").
The length of the bottom is an issue though. Especially for the Ultrastik as it uses a magnet on the bottom. The diameter is almost a nonissue as long as it fits through the hole in the pivot point because the switches are not relevant to operation.

I probably got mixed up looking at available shafts and misunderstood what the sizes meant.
https://paradisearcadeshop.com/products/jlw-6mm-hollow-316l-shaft-long#/90dfeb2d-ace5-43fb-8ce4-2ffd4f288380/fullscreen/autofilters=true&page=1&query=jlw+shaft&query_name=match_and&rpp=20

I shouldn't comment when I don't have time to get it right.   

[BadMouth]

For future reference.  Bottom section is only measured to the groove, not to the end.

[thelanranger]

That is EXACTLY what I needed. 

It's so weird that all the dimensions are so random. I guess I'd just have to machine something custom to use a link cause it's 3mm fatter! It also seems like the Ultrastik 360 is using its own special shaft that mills down the little nub on the bottom from 9mm to 8mm so that the magnet fits over it (which I also find really odd) and has 10mm threads on the top.

Might steal your picture here and see if the guy from phreakmods wants to do a group buy or something for people who have ultrastiks/jlw's so they can get the lower end for a reasonable price. I'd love to get 4 of them but I'm not shelling out $200-300 just to get a couple lowers done. 

[thelanranger]

Oops, forgot until browsing BYOAC hours later.  Yeah, they are way different.  JLW top, JLF bottom.  The only spec they have in common is the balltop threads.

So...looking at this image, what happens if you put the plastic pivot from the JLF into the JLW and put the JLF shaft in the JLW? Is the diameter of the "sphere" the same?

Ex: Could you get a JLF pivot, shaft, spring, and spring mounts and put all that into a JLW body?

[BadMouth]

It also seems like the Ultrastik 360 is using its own special shaft that mills down the little nub on the bottom from 9mm to 8mm so that the magnet fits over it (which I also find really odd)

The diameter of the nub on the bottom of the JLW shaft is smaller, but I didn't think it was important and thought squeezing everything into the drawing would make it harder to understand.  Sometimes you just need to buy some parts and experiment.  It's part of the cost of doing custom.