Ideas on mounting large crts?

[Edgecrusher]

I have a 32" SONY I just finished RGB modding to use for an arcade cabinet. I imagine this is not what most people use since the thing weighs around 170lbs, but the image quality is important and I'm planning to use it for a 4 player cab.

ATM I have it mounted in 1-1/2" angle iron frame I fabbed to keep it from getting damaged while it was being modded and with the thought I could put it in the cab this way. This tube is so hard to handle because of it's weight and tendency to want to flip onto the screen. The metal frame tilts it back a bit and balances it's center of gravity better.


I need the cabinet to be able to make it through a doorway. Also, I want it down on the first level of my house so it'll have to go down stairs. I was thinking of building the cab in stages to be easier to get to where it needs to be. So maybe plywood boxes, basically, that stack to form the center of the cabinet and then two sides to give it the side profile of an arcade cabinet. The control panel can be a separate box on the front.

The framed crt could set in the middle "box" section. Realistically, only the bottom would need to be a box and strong enough to support the CRT and everything above that doesn't matter so much. Just the marquee light and a speaker above the TV.

I think the conventional way of assembling a cab probably won't be enough to hold a 170lb CRT not to mention getting it in there without busting a nut in the process.

If anyone has any suggestions or experiences I'd be interested in them.

[Zebidee]

Conventional method for mounting the CRT in a cab will work fine. I've done it with 27" Sony PVMs which must weigh at least as much as your 32" (because of all the extra electronics and shielding) and yes, the Trinitron tubes weigh more than normal tubes because they use an aperture grill instead of the (lighter) shadow mask.

To mount the CRT "conventionally", all you need are four pieces of decent offcuts from a strong wood like 3/4" plywood, which incidentally is what I prefer to make cabs out of, so there is always plenty lying around. The four wood offcuts only need to be maybe up to 3-4 inches wide and a bit longer than the side of your monitor

The first two wood pieces are just for blocking. They just need one straight edge and are screwed into the side of the monitor bay at the angle you want the screen to be.

The other two wood pieces will bracket the CRT, and the weight will rest on top of the blocking pieces. To let the brackets snuggle up to the CRT corner pegs, cut part of the wood straight at roughly 45 degrees (like shown below). This will give you some wiggle-room, as the angle will always come to the corner pegs optimally. You can then just slide the two pieces to the tube so that they always fit perfectly.

This design has another advantage - if you cut the 45 degree angle part long enough, say up to two inches, it is easy to swap out the tube for another one of similar size. You just slide the wood brackets up and down to find the right spots for the CRT pegs and drill a new hole



The CRT in pics above is resting very happily there, even though it is not bolted down!

Use T-nuts like these to secure the tube:




I have posted those same pics elsewhere, sorry to people that have seen it before :notworthy   You'll all be glad to know that I am finally progressing that cab further.

You can use this same mounting method with commercial metal arcade monitor frames because they will have mounting flanges on the outer edge. I like that you did your own steel frame, you must have some welding skills    However I'm not sure you can use the frame to mount your TV in the way shown above, without some modification.

EDIT: Is that TV *really* 170 pounds? I would have guessed it to be no more than about 120.
EDIT2: I just looked up the user manual and OMG you are right, thus massive beast is listed as weighing 79kg or 175lbs!! That really is a monster.

[Edgecrusher]

Hello again Zeb!

I'd really prefer to do it your way, but honestly, I don't think I could maneuver the tube into place without breaking something. Granted making it in a metal frame makes it big and cumbersome, but I can grab ahold of the frame and stay away from the delicate neck.

My frame has a pivot and if I drill new holes in the side straps, which are made from 1/4" aluminum bus-bars from some recycled switch gear, I can angle it however much I need granted the neck doesn't hit the frame in the back. If I go much further than it is my PCB  won't fit nicely under there and I'll have to get fancy.

I'm still up in the air as to how far I want to tilt the tube back. I'll probably make the base I was talking about and set it up there to get an idea of how it will look. If I was doing a vertical shooter I'd definitely have it more plumb, but I feel like a lot of horizontal fighters look better at an angle.??

[Edgecrusher]

And yes, I weld. I love welding. I have done just about everything farbrication wise to some degree. I'm 47 and I just started getting into woodworking the last couple years.

Making arcades mixes just about every thing I love to do! Electrical, computers, metal fabrication, and wood working. I'm not even a gamer. lol I'm pretty much doing this for my family, but mainly because I'm a maker. In a year I'll be off doing something different, I'm sure.

[Malenko]

I mounted a 36" vertically in a KI2 cab using the factory mounting hardware for the 25" CRT, the square thingies from Midway.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,97260.msg1025567.html

[bobbyb13]

I have added an orthogonal strongback of plywood on the backside of the brace that Zebidee shows for tubes 24" and larger and it has added the sense of security of a metal frame.
If you can weld and drill and metal though then have at it!

I wish I could pull up the post Malenko linked.

Have you considered a pedestal/showcase style machine though?

Always seemed to me that a screen that size you really need to be standing farther back from then simply the length of ones arms (as in a more typical cabinet build.)

Between that and the fact that you wind up with two more managable size units (that can be joined in some fashion for stability's sake once it is installed- or not) it appears to be easier to deal with overall.

I have a 36" Trinitron that will become a pedestal tube if I live long enough.

[Edgecrusher]

I mounted a 36" vertically in a KI2 cab using the factory mounting hardware for the 25" CRT, the square thingies from Midway.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,97260.msg1025567.html

Your build is thought provoking. Makes me consider a vertical with my 32 Samsung.


Doing a separate console and screen only looks good with flat screens IMO. Not to mention takes up more space which is something I would try to avoid. I'd like to have at least one horizontal and one vertical cab when I' all done and both built with the best parts I can gather up.

I swear every week it seems I go looking for parts and they get twice as expensive and there's less available than before. I'm sick and tired of it. I'd give anything to go back in time two years.

It's looking like this next cab is gonna be a horizontal screen and I'm not sure when or if I will ever get to a vertical for my shmups with way things are so expensive and I have to do with parts that aren't exactly what I want. I mean what's the point in building something for your enjoyment if it's not what you want??! So I this is gonna be a crazy over-complicated cabinet.

I already have a couple spinners so I'll incorporate one to use when I use it vertically. I don't know about a trackball. I can't make my mind up on a good one to buy. It seems they are either cheap chinese junk or crazy expensive. I picked up two sanwa joysticks to try. I want to see just how much better they are than the kit ones I got off Amazon for the cocktail I made. The Amazon ones seem to be kinda slow but I really like their buttons and so does the wife who's the big gamer. If only they sold a big kit of buttons. lol

[Edgecrusher]

sorry got a little off the woodworking topic..

[Edgecrusher]

That seed is rooting...

I'm starting to picture a 2 player - super huge vert cab...
I think in the back of my mind I see these 4 player cabs that run the big flat screens and I think "now that makes sense". They can be made so much thinner and not be this monstrous thing taking up a whole room. So that's what I think I'll do. My frame I made for this tube was a waste of time, kinda. But I think I will have much more fun with a large shmups cab especially since I pretty much have all the controls already.

thanks guys

[Zebidee]

I swear every week it seems I go looking for parts and they get twice as expensive and there's less available than before. I'm sick and tired of it. I'd give anything to go back in time two years.

That's because a lot of stuff actually is getting more expensive. As COVID hit and people had to stay at home, demand for DIY and hobbyist supplies went through the roof. Supply chains disrupted because workers can't get to factories. People want to spend more time at home (house prices), and play with their toys (tech prices). Add to that a drought in Taiwan and some other things and you get a global computer chip shortage.

I think most people are trying to forget the last two years, not live them again

About a year ago I saw people putting up Christmas/New Year cards/decorations that read "---fudgesicle--- You 2020". at the time I laughed out loud, what makes them think 2021 is going to be any better? Sure enough, now those same people are using whiteout and Sharpies to update their cards.

[nitrogen_widget]

man, i'd leave it cased and use a ratchet strap to hold it in place on a shelf.
i believe the insides of a TV should stay on the inside though.

[bobbyb13]

Have you tried to stand at arms length from that tube for 5 minutes at a time?

Bigger is not always better.

Something like a Gauntlet or Simpsons cabinet could still be comfy to play with a screen that size I imagine.

You'll see that original cabinets wound up as they did for good reason once you have built a few.

The screen angle, control panel layout and marquee on those two cabinets are a great lesson in form following function to take up the least space and still be fun to play.

And vertical games certainly wouldn't look squished on a horizontal 32" running mame!

[Edgecrusher]

Yes. I think I've settled on using the pattern for the TMNT/Xmen/Simpsons cab which I was looking at when I was planning on a 4 player. However, I will be mounting the tv vertical instead which should allow me to make it less girthy. I will only be using a two player CP. That pattern lends to easy changes the way the CP sits in a square notch in the front. You could easily make it removable there-by lending to CP changes.
I still want a tempest shaped cab though.

[Zebidee]

32" Vertical mount will be great for those visually glorious shmups like some Cave games, Donpachi, BAtsugen, 1944, Raiden, Aero fighters, et al.

However, size isn't everything.

It won't work well for classic-era verticals because it is just too darn big. 21" or lower is good for these.

Big screens can be a disadvantage for playing fast-paced shmups n such generally because it is a larger area for your eyes to scan. So, having a tight screen size helps improve your responsiveness, less lag in the meatware.

I have a 26" Loewe in my vertical cab and it is plenty for the glorious shmups. However, I used to have a vertical cab with a 20" and a single 8-way joystick, I really miss that for classic verticals (long since sold to someone who was very happy).

Horizontal games obviously won't look so good. Mounting a huge CRT vertically doesn't have the same advantages as mounting a similar-sized LCD flat-panel vertically. With a CRT it won't just affect the screen size, you can only have a maximum number of vertical lines (obviously your horizontal if rotated). It'll also make the scan lines go the wrong way.

Check it out for yourself, rotate the TV (if you can lift it!) and try playing some vertical and horizontal games. You'll have to fiddle a few settings and .ini files as well to get the best out of it.

[Edgecrusher]

Hmm. So much to consider.
I will start to build in the next couple weeks hopefully. I'll have some time after X-mas when the in-laws head home to do some cuttin. I really wish that thing wasn't so big but hey, it was $20! I brought it out to my workshop to get it out of the way during the holidays. It's cold out there, but hopefully I'll get a chance to do some testing like you say and figure out what's best for me.

Have a good weekend!

[bobbyb13]

I know you are trying to minimize the real estate it takes up but to make it wide enoigh to accomodate the screen either way will net you the best result in the long run!

Ask me how I know...
 

And of course everything Zebidee says is absolutley true.
 

[Zebidee]

Hmm. So much to consider.
I will start to build in the next couple weeks hopefully. I'll have some time after X-mas when the in-laws head home to do some cuttin. I really wish that thing wasn't so big but hey, it was $20! I brought it out to my workshop to get it out of the way during the holidays. It's cold out there, but hopefully I'll get a chance to do some testing like you say and figure out what's best for me.

Have a good weekend!

I don't want to be all doom and gloom but I've been researching your Sony KV-32XBR200 and connecting some dots and it is not all good. It comes with a disclaimer that some of what I say may be wrong or not necessarily true for your TV, it is a piecing together of honest research, experience and stuff I've heard from others.

Good news is I think these TVs support 480p and 1080i, which is great if you have a Wii (does 480p) or you want to see your favourite movies on a CRT but also in HD (1080i). However you might need to input the HD video signal via component/YPbPr. Some people call these their "Holy Grail" sets.

The bad news is I think they may automatically and crudely scale/double 240p resolutions up to 480p, causing screen artifacts, blocky pixels and no scan lines.

I'm not sure what effect this would have on resolutions like 256p+, for games like Mortal Kombat and R-Type, which won't easily scale to 480p.

There may be some digital processing lag.

A little story, I used to own a Sony Bravia 32" HD flat/widescreen CRT that did this (I bought it *new* in 2005, but by 2007 it had been stolen!). It was a thing of beauty and great weight. Anyways, this was in the dark ages before CRT_emudriver was even a twinkle in Calamity's eye, so I used an ArcadeVGA card and a homemade VGA-SCART cable to feed a 15khz signal into the TV, ran a few games. It looked OK, but not great, so I didn't persist with using it for gaming. I didn't really understand at the time, but it was all the scaling/doubling/no scanlines issues I described above.

So sorry to be pessimistic, but I thought you should be aware before cuttin'. This Sony XBR would be great in the living room. Would also be great to get another 25-32" standard CRT TV for the arcade.

[Edgecrusher]

Well if it makes any difference, it's a KV32FV300. So not a bravia. It's a popular model line for RGB and has it's own thread in Shmups. It'll be fine for what I do with it.

On that note, I ran across a 27" of the same breed in a neighboring city. The unfortunate thing is it's in a basement. I thought about picking it up because it was 27" instead of 32" and I already figured out the RGB mod for it. But I don't think it's "smaller" enough to justify the haul up the guys stairs. lol 19 or 22" definitely

[bobbyb13]

It's worth it.
A hell of a lot lighter than a 32
Go get that 27" !

[Zebidee]

Well if it makes any difference, it's a KV32FV300. So not a bravia. It's a popular model line for RGB and has it's own thread in Shmups. It'll be fine for what I do with it.

On that note, I ran across a 27" of the same breed in a neighboring city. The unfortunate thing is it's in a basement. I thought about picking it up because it was 27" instead of 32" and I already figured out the RGB mod for it. But I don't think it's "smaller" enough to justify the haul up the guys stairs. lol 19 or 22" definitely

Well, that is weird. I was sure you said earlier it was an KV-32XBR200 in your other thread? But now I look it isn't there, though the post was edited. I certainly didn't just make the model number up in my head

Moving on - yes I've heard good things about the FV300 and 310 TVs for RGB modding/gaming too. Very suitable, except that it also weighs 172 lbs.

[bobbyb13]

Yeah, another good argument for a 27" !

That size I can easily carry by myself still.

[nipsmg]

Yep, I had a 27FV300 that i RGB modded and sold.  -- and I regret it.. I should have kept it.

[Edgecrusher]

Well chute.
Maybe I should.

...the tvs are piling up lol

Just wish i could find a 20. A 20 and then im done. Maybe.

I've been eyeing some radical virt pinball builds. They dont require crts, but I've wanted a pin for ages and I don't think ill find a mech pin I can afford... theres just not enough time in my days, fellas

[bobbyb13]

The screen thing is a slippery slope.

If you keep waiting for a particular size you'll end up like me- with so many tubes taking up space that you lost count.

I think it may be better to build something appropriate for the screens one finds and wait for your holy grail size tube.
It will show up eventually.

Every good scratch built cabinet is built around the screen and control panel desired anyway so it kinda make sense.

[Edgecrusher]

Yeah, I asked the guy for a model # and it turns out it was a 32 like I already have. Seems like 32's are extremely common. I think I'll use my 32 and get rid of the other three I had picked up and just keep an eye out for that 20" for a shmups cab someday. No sense in settling. I think this 32 is going to make a great horizontal setup.

[Zebidee]

You will need a good mechanic-friend, because you'll need an engine hoist to get that 32" TV into a cab

[bobbyb13]

You will need a good mechanic-friend, because you'll need an engine hoist to get that 32" TV into a cab

 

Yup.
I have a 32" and I don't move that beast by myself.

Hernia or dropped testicle is what that looks like to me.

There's a glut of 27s left on Oahu at this point it seems.
That size is my favorite for a MAME cabinet.

I hope for 19s and 20s to show up for anything else.

You ARE doing a MAME build, correct?

[Mike A]

Way too big for an arcade cab.

It will cause numerous problems.

[Malenko]

You will need a good mechanic-friend, because you'll need an engine hoist to get that 32" TV into a cab

I laid the cab on its side, put the TV in place then stood the cab up.

[Zebidee]

I laid the cab on its side, put the TV in place then stood the cab up.

That’s a relief! Good idea too. How much did yours weigh? Easier than my other idea which was hire a few hundred slaves, make a giant sand ramp and use well-rounded logs covered in fish fat

[Edgecrusher]

You will need a good mechanic-friend, because you'll need an engine hoist to get that 32" TV into a cab

I'm that guy with about any tool you can imagine including a hoist. I have a couple bro-in-laws coming for xmas this weekend. I think I'll build a temporary platform in the room I plan to keep it and between the three of us we should be able to lift 200lb up there. Then, later, when the cabinet is built I can just push it off and onto the cabinet if I plan it well enough.

[Edgecrusher]

You will need a good mechanic-friend, because you'll need an engine hoist to get that 32" TV into a cab

I laid the cab on its side, put the TV in place then stood the cab up.

I considered this too.

[Edgecrusher]

Yes.
This will be a Mame style cab. I have Big Box which I really like which will have Groovymame running behind it with Atom and CRT Emudriver to this 32" Sony that's been RGB'ed to a 1G AMD HD8570 GPU in a tower running Win10 with 8G of ram. It'll be set up to mainly run fighting arcade games. I'll start it off as a two player and see how I like it and if I choose to I'll make it a 4 player. I have a couple Sanwa JLF's for it and a mix of Sanwa and Siemitsu buttons to try. I've never had these so it'll be neat to see the difference from the EGStarts cheapo set I bought on Amazon for my cocktail table for the wife. I'm waiting on a Thunderstick LED trackball and I already have a Thunderstick spinner and the interface board for both. I really wish I could find a decent two slot coin door to use, but I may just skip past that and have coin button on the CP. Coin doors are super cool if they work and they look authentic. Anything less makes everything look cheap. I'll probably put the ball between the two joysticks and have a separate higher level on the CP with just the spinner and a couple of buttons. Six buttons for each stick. I might run some shmups on it too only thing being I will have 8 way sticks and some of my shmups run 4ways I believe. In the future, especially if I go 4 player, I'd like to get a Ultra stik so I can program the stick to be whatever type I want for that particular game. But for right now I got enough to figure out.

[Edgecrusher]

While I got some people's attention:

I was wondering, Is there any particular formula for spacing the controls from the user? You know, like having a little material on the edge so you can lean against the cabinet while you pay? I've been making mental notes on how people are arranging their CP's and it seems some leave quite a lot of real estate in front of the stick and buttons.

[Zebidee]

Sorry for poking fun  I am truly looking forward to seeing your massive cab in action! 

I think coin doors are over-rated. However, if you poll members here, I may be in the minority.

Coin doors are great in a cab with an original-classic look. However, for a home cab that is designed for playing comfort with mates at home, I prefer to use that real-estate for a small recessed mini-control panel for mounting a few special buttons (e.g. credit, pause, "admin" (press button to change mapping for main buttons), volume control, USB and audio ports). I use coin doors in cabs too, clearly the best option if you want to place a cab in a public place, just saying there are alternatives.

Control panel dimensions and distances... well that is always a fun question, having just gone through it again myself. I recently went through a bunch of control panel layouts looking for the right thing. Looking at a bunch of layouts I noticed that some had the joystick approx 59mm away from the nearest buttons, but some were up to 95mm away from the nearest buttons. However, I also have a control panel blank from an original/commercial cab of approximately the right size, and the joys were 75mm distance from the buttons. This felt right for the CP size so I chose 75mm and adapted the layout.

You can see a bunch of joystick/button pattern layouts at the slagcoin site here:
https://www.slagcoin.com/joystick/layout.html

You can then print the layouts to size and use that as your drilling template.

For the buttons I used a slanted layout from the Slagcoin site, with button heights offset to match the natural shape of most people's hands/fingers. This layout uses a little less space than most too.

As noted above, I moved the joystick in to be 75mm away from the buttons, rather than the 95mm on the Slagcoin layout (measure from centres rather than edges). The cab will mostly be used by smaller people (like kids... or my wife) so this tighter arrangement works well but still gives plenty of room.

I attached a photo from a few days ago, just before I started drilling the big holes. You can see the paper tape and pencil lines I used to help precisely position the holes. Control Panel is a total of only 535mm wide but the layout leaves two smaller-sized players with plenty of room.

[Edgecrusher]

That was a very good read
thanks added it to my collection

[RandyT]

I am the proud owner of a 36" Mitsubishi multi-scan (2 of them, actually).  These massive tubes are so heavy, I wouldn't even consider mounting them in the traditional fashion.  With the cases which surround them, they take two very strong people to even lift them onto a table.

My suggestion for dealing with anything of weight is to build a strong support structure first, and then build the enclosure/cabinet around it.  Or, if possible and prudent, make the CRT unit self-contained and use proper framework to create a shelf as part of the cabinet framework, capable of supporting the weight.  Then slide it onto the shelf and call it a day.  This also has the benefit of making it somewhat modular, in case it ever needs to be moved.  I've even done this with an 80lb steel-cased 27", and it works fine in a standard-sized cabinet.

Just a thought.

[Malenko]

TIL I'm probably the strongest person on BYOAC.

[RandyT]

TIL I'm probably the strongest person on BYOAC.

I'll call you next time I need to move that industrial-grade monster I have.  It clocks in at over 300lbs and I'm pretty certain it will humble you a tad 

[Zebidee]

I follow some Facebook CRT groups, and always have a little giggle to myself when Gen-Z nancy-boys complain loudly how heavy a 27" CRT is, needing two people to lift etc. Get some exercise yah wimps!