WG 9202 + IPAC gen 1 + GroovyArcade Newb.. Please help

[ekinskofer]

Hey guys,

Received a cabinet with a WG 9202 (9200). The main pc died and it previously was just been launching games by launching mame from xp. It's now running i5 4th gen, 8G ram and a gen 1 (I think) IPAC and Optipac. I got a bunch of cards on ebay for a good deal, they are:

ATI HD 2400XT  DVI  Displayport
ATI HD 7450    DVI  Displayport
ATI X550    VGA

I have bought a DVI to VGA connector on ebay as recommnended, however, I can't seem to get that going. I also have an old LCD monitor that I'm using to test with.

I'm following a youtube video as well as a couple tutorials and I'm struggling with a couple itmes.

1. Monitor selection.

I first tried the 7450 with the DVI to VGA connector. When plugged into the WGCRT into the DVI to start the process up, I first hear a bunch of clicks (WG trying to figure out resolution?) and then "out of range". When I plug into the LCD.. I see the GA menu and select the first option. DVI-1 15khz. When I plug it back into the WGCRT it still says out of range.

Is this because I haven't patched the video card with Atom-15? Is this needed with my monitor? Atom-15 download appears to be offline.
http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/viewtopic.php?id=64

I tired the 2400xt with similar results.



x550 has a VGA and I plugged directly into that.. I was able to get the menu to start and to launch the front end from the live cd/usb. However. I don't have any controls.. more on that in a sec. The menu option was jittery though with a high pitch ween coming from the WGCRT.

Please let me know your thoughts on what approach I should take here.. and which card I should use?

2. IPAC/Optipac.

Once I launched the front end, I'm not able to control the menu or control the sample games.. How do I configure GroovyArcade keybindings? How do I configure the Optipac? I checked the ultimarc website for older IPAC's however, I couldn't find much.. is there a keybinding map out there that someone knows?

Thanks guys, I'll start with these newb questions and continue with additional new questions soon! Looking forward to getting this going!

thanks,
E

[lilshawn]

I believe the Wells Gardner D9200 VGA connector will only accept 640x480 resolution.

if you wish to feed standard res or medium res frequencies (15k/25k) into the monitor you have to use the alternate input "pin header" connector near the VGA port.

in any case, it won't take an 800x600 (which it looks like to me what you are trying to feed it.) signal. i think  some very very VERY late run 9200's would accept 800x600... and it was only really as a test before they changed the model to the 9400

attach an LCD....set your resolution to 640x480 60hz.... confirm this is what it is on the LCD (usually in the onscreen display settings somewhere it has it's current resolution displayed.)... then swap over to the d9200

make sure it's 60hz. not 75hz... not 59hz.. 60.

[Arroyo]

Specs say it is a tri-sync and can handle CGA, EGA, and VGA:

https://www.wellsgardner.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/D9200_27_33.pdf

I don’t have experience with GroovyArcade, just GroovyMame, but I’d think most of the concepts should be the same.  Either way you appear to be sending a signal that’s of either too high or too low of a resolution (course too low would be hard to imagine).

I’d try VGA 640x480p and see if you can get a desktop, then go from there.  Are you running the cable through anything else or directly from the computer to the monitor?

As lilshawn said the spec sheet (see above link) says the D-Sub (VGA connector) is to be used for VGA resolutions.  The 0.156 center header is for CGA/EGA resolutions.

[Substring]

Regarding ATOM-15 : it's only needed if you want to reach BIOS. ATOM-15 adds some 15kHz modes to the BIOS of your GFX card. I don't think it would help on the very first boot menu (which is sadly always 31kHz iirc). The LCD should just be necessary to choose your output connector, its horizontal frequency.

The next step is to set the right monitor in the groovyarcade menu. Then everything should work fine from a display point of view.

An IPAC should be configured with MAME key bindings. Can't tell for the optipac.

[ekinskofer]

Thanks for the response guys!

I previously had this hooked up to a computer running xp and I believe the resolution was 640x480 not 800x600, I will confirm this tonight by popping in that old HDD. Before I continue, perhaps I shoudl take a step back also... Is GroovyArcade the best distro/installation for the computer/crt/ipac or shoudl I be looking to GroovyMame + crt_emudriver?

If GroovyArcade is the best way to go and based on my LCD test.. I can determine if I need to move/swap the vga cabpe to the pin header connector. Correct? My objective is to emulate or achieve as acurate as possible scanlines that I grew up with, this is the correct way?

Is there are benefit to keeping the existing VGA configuration? i.e. supports newer games, i.e. 90's? I'm a 90's child and would like to emulate those as much as possilbe including CAVE and other schmups.

Thanks so much for tolerating my rediculous questions.   

cheers.
E

[lilshawn]

Specs say it is a tri-sync and can handle CGA, EGA, and VGA:

https://www.wellsgardner.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/D9200_27_33.pdf

I don’t have experience with GroovyArcade, just GroovyMame, but I’d think most of the concepts should be the same.  Either way you appear to be sending a signal that’s of either too high or too low of a resolution (course too low would be hard to imagine).

I’d try VGA 640x480p and see if you can get a desktop, then go from there.  Are you running the cable through anything else or directly from the computer to the monitor?

As lilshawn said the spec sheet (see above link) says the D-Sub (VGA connector) is to be used for VGA resolutions.  The 0.156 center header is for CGA/EGA resolutions.

that sheet you linked says:

Input connector: CGA/EGA: 0.156 center header, VGA: 15 pin D-sub high density male

i mean it's completely within the realm of possibility it doesn't care what input you use as long as it's within it's range. I just recall there being an issue with inputs.

[fuchi_jeg]

I have a d9400 and could not get sync through a dvi-i to vga cable. Knocked my head against the wall until I realized that one of the extra pins was preventing sync. I pulled the offending pin (I believe it was pin 9) and it synced as soon as I attached the cable. Others have had luck by simply changing cables. That might be worth a shot.

[ekinskofer]

Thanks for the tip. I certainly don't want to screw up my monitor. Is there a thread in here that describes that to some detail? What cable would I change this to? You're talking about the vga cable coming from the monitor, correct? not the DVI to VGA? I'll have a scan through the forums here to see if I can turn something up..

many thanks. 

[Arroyo]

Is GroovyArcade the best distro/installation for the computer/crt/ipac or shoudl I be looking to GroovyMame + crt_emudriver?

If you are running Windows then yeah you should be using GroovyMame + crt_emulation drivers.

There’s a great tutorial on geedorah which is down at the moment, but I know Calamity is working on getting it back up soon.

[Calamity]

You should use the 7450 if possible. Our site is down atm, there's a guide in there. The issue most likely was that you plugged the montitor but didn't enable edid emulation. Windows by default sets 1024x768 and that's out of range for you.

If you want to go the GroovyArcade way, just booting from the live cd and selecting the DVI-I-1 15 kHz boot option should work for you. You may need an LCD monitor to make the boot menu readable, then once you're over the correct option, before clicking enter, switch the cable to the crt, then click enter and after some seconds the boot logo should be at 15 kHz.

[fuchi_jeg]

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,161274.msg1698751.html#msg1698751
This is my thread detailing the fix. 

[ekinskofer]

Hey guys,

Thanks for the responses. I was able to get groovyarcade up and running and installed last night running on my x550. I intially plugged in my lcd and then noticed that there are other menu options past the first screen. I selected VGA-1 31KHZ and then swapped it over to my wgd202, looked great after this, no flickering and perfectly usable. So right now the monitor is plugged directly into that x550.

You should use the 7450 if possible

Agreed, this is the best of the cards I nabbed for cheap on ebay. I'll continue to play around with this later, though I don't want to be removing pins from my cable unless necessary.

@Fuchi_jeg. when you said in your post:

I pulled pin 9 out of the vga cable.  either side will work.

Are you meaning on the cable, i.e. the part that connects to the monitor and the male end that goes into the video card? Is there a simple process for removing the pin? or is a new cable a better solution? Googling...

Ok thanks guys and to everyone that worked on GroovyArcade, it's a pretty solid solution and I love that it runs on Linux!

[fuchi_jeg]

I pulled the pin out of the cable. Reach in with a pair of pliers and yank it out. My (totally uneducated) guess is that the pin is sending some type of voltage into the monitor board that effects the sync. The first time I did it with a vga cable using a dvi to vga adapter so I didn't ruin my dvi to vga cable. If it doesn't work you are only out a vga cable, which every nerd  has a box full of. Once that worked I did the same with the dvi-vga cable I'm using permanently.

[fuchi_jeg]

From my research this is an issue with using the dvi output on the GPU.  I had no trouble using GPUs or integrated graphics with VGA out.

[Substring]

What about the IPAC?

[ekinskofer]

Hey guys,

I managed to get everything installed and the rims/art/snaps/etc loaded.. it looks great. The problem is I can’t get any input from my ipac. It’s plugged into the ps/2 port and the ipac is showing a green light.. but when I try to map keys, nothing from the ipac/ps2 port is registered. Am I missing a setting somewhere? I’ll try loading another live CD and confirm this is hardware related.

Any thoughts?

Cheers
E

[lilshawn]

is your ground hooked up? all your switch grounds should be all daisy chained together and terminating in the ipac GND terminal.

load up notepad and see if pressing buttons shows ANY characters.

[ekinskofer]

Highly possible. I think that it's time to pull this control board appart and rewire it with some nice easy to follow runs. Last time I was playing it my pal was complaing of stick 2 always pulling left which might mean a short somehwere.

It's a bit of a mess.. I haven't really messed with this since I inherited it.


I'm going to look in the forums for some nice wiring layouts to get some inspiration.

cheers.
E

[lilshawn]

an quick and dirty check is to place a ohmmeter lead on the unoccupied tab on a button switch and place the other probe on the shell of the PS2 connector (which should also be grounded.) if you have continuity, your ground is good... if it reads open... your wire might be broken someplace.

since nothing works, i suspect the ground has been pulled out of the IPAC itself. you may have a stray wire hanging out in there someplace.

[fuchi_jeg]

What was your solution for your monitor sync issue? Just curious.  I had some issues with my ipac not registering even though the geen light was on.  The USB connection isn't very secure and can lose connection if the cable is strained. Once it loses connection, even for a second, it won't work again unless you uninstall, or restart the CPU. It used to happen when I opened the control panel until I hot glued the USB connector in place. No problem since.  I know yours is a ps2 connection, but worth a try.

[ekinskofer]

Well I spent another hour last night trying to follow all the wires and see if they were groudned. I couldn't find a loose connection. I'll try again tonight. I'll pull out the multimeter and start testing continuity on the cable. The thing is though is that this was working fine up until I started using the new machine. I might grab a pS/2 to USB converter as well to rule out the PS/2 port being faulty. I might also boot up a livecd with notepad to rule out the GA install.. I know this isn't the case, however, I might do this. The IPAC light is green, so I have a feeling it's the cable or the input on the new PC..

Regarding the monitor sync issue. I used the x550 card with a native VGA out and that worked. See previous post:

I selected VGA-1 31KHZ and then swapped it over to my wgd202, looked great after this, no flickering and perfectly usable. So right now the monitor is plugged directly into that x550.

I want to get the IPAC working and then I'll go back to trying to get the 7450 to sync. Thanks guys! 

[ekinskofer]

Hey guys,

Reporting success here.. for the most part. I think the main problem I had was that I had my wireless USB keyboard/mouse plugged in and I think this overrides the ps/2 connection. I grabbed an old USB to ps/2 connector and put it in the USB keyboard Pass through on the ipac and voila it worked.

The problem I’m battling now is still some syncing issues with this monitor. It seems only some games are working with this monitor and switchres. Mk1 and mk2 were working however when dropping into the game, the monitor is producing an audible whine that was extremely unpleasant. The WG9200/9202 appear to be one of the most feared/hated monitors in the arcade community, so it’s probably related to the monitor. When in the attract mode menu, there were no problems other than a slight buzzing sound. Anyways, if any of you have any thoughts or links on how to deal with this that would be awesome. In the meantime, I’ll keep digging and update this thread if I find anything. I really hope I don’t have to do a cap replacement or flyback replacement as I’m not comfortable with this.

Thanks again for all the help.. I’m enjoying groovyarcade so far!