Can someone please put to rest the 16:9 vs 4:3 vertical vs horizontal blah blah

[YouknowStuIlltellya]

Ok, not looking for any acronyms, or feed rates or refresh rate this or whatever.   Ten word answers would be awesome.  I am not technical.

And I'm not blowing 3 or 400 on a crt monitor.

I have researched this til I'm blue. 

How on earth can some users claim that a 20.1 inch 4:3 is better for a mame upright cab than a 27 inch 16:9?

The dimensions are in favor of the 27 16:9. So what am I missing? They are both lcd.  But the 27 inch 16:9 is wider and higher than a 20.1 4:3 (dell ulta right).  Is there something I'm missing?  Please idiot proof (me not you) your answer. 

[YouknowStuIlltellya]

Failed to mention that I'm largely going to be playing the classics.

[Nephasth]

CRT or GTFO!

[opt2not]

Playing the classics on LCD 

[JDFan]

Playing mostly classics or almost all classics ?

27" 16:9  would means you would get approx. 1" larger height than the 20.1" monitor (13.2" vs 12.1") and 7.4" extra width (23.5" vs 16.1" ) than a 20.1" 4:3 monitor. SO yes you would get a slightly larger image on the 27" vs the 20.1" but you would also wind up with black bars of approx 3-3.5" on each the left and right side on most games that goes unused since most pre 2005 games are designed for a 4:3 ratio ( more newer games are made for 16:9 since TVs went widescreen after 2005) Unless you do the unthinkable and have Mame stretch the image horizontally to fit the screen ( which makes the games look horrible - So don't do it !)


The Break even spot for screen size on a 16:9 screen to match a 20.1" 4:3 monitor is approx 25" - so you'd get a larger image in 4:3 on a 20.1" monitor than you would a 23 or 24" 16:9 monitor but at 27" you do actually start to get an increase in game size.

So why do many prefer the 20.1 4:3 - mainly because you get a larger game screen than a 24" 16:9 and you also use all of the screen rather than having black bars on the sides that just sit unused - Plus you do not need to make your cab wider to fit the wide screen monitor making the cab dimensions more like a normal arcade machine. Versus a 27" you pretty much get almost the same size game screen with no black bars and ability to keep the cab about 6 -8 inches narrower.

IF you plan to use some newer games (ie. fighting games, side scrollers) made after 2005 - then the width will get some use during those games so if you don't mind the extra width of the cab then that's always an option - Just be sure to set Mame up to keep games in their correct aspect ratio and not stretch them when it scale if going that direction.

Another thing to keep in mind is the optimum viewing distance for a 20" 4:3 monitor is 3 - 7 ft where for a 27" 16:9 screen optimal viewing distance is 4 - 10 ft. so standing only a few feet from the screen the 20.1" 4:3 is a bit closer to optimal viewing distance. ( also according to the site linked below.)


Dimensions mentioned were taken from this site -- https://www.silisoftware.com/tools/screen_aspect_ratio_calculator

[opt2not]

That’s way over ten words. 

[leapinlew]

Bottom line: your preference is all that matters.

I play some of my classics on a LCD. I use a 19" CRT in my dedicated vertical classics, but I have a 27" widescreen that I use for my horizontal classics. I don't like the black bars, so I use tinted plexi. I'd probably consider using some filters or a scan line generator if they would make the difference and give you that classic look and feel.

[Howard_Casto]

I used to be team crt all the way... until I got old.  Throwing in a 12oz lcd instead of man handling a 50lb crt…. yes please.  My setup is similar to lew's…. got a 19 incher in my pacman and my gorf, but my mame cab has a 27 inch 16:10 lcd, which makes it a little less wasteful in terms of unused screen for the 4:3 games. 

What I'm saying is size matters.  If it's a cab with a 19 inch display that display should probably be a crt, but if it's a big-assed monitor then a lcd might make more sense. 

[Titchgamer]

Playing mostly classics or almost all classics ?

27" 16:9  would means you would get approx. 1" larger height than the 20.1" monitor (13.2" vs 12.1") and 7.4" extra width (23.5" vs 16.1" ) than a 20.1" 4:3 monitor. SO yes you would get a slightly larger image on the 27" vs the 20.1" but you would also wind up with black bars of approx 3-3.5" on each the left and right side on most games that goes unused since most pre 2005 games are designed for a 4:3 ratio ( more newer games are made for 16:9 since TVs went widescreen after 2005) Unless you do the unthinkable and have Mame stretch the image horizontally to fit the screen ( which makes the games look horrible - So don't do it !)


The Break even spot for screen size on a 16:9 screen to match a 20.1" 4:3 monitor is approx 25" - so you'd get a larger image in 4:3 on a 20.1" monitor than you would a 23 or 24" 16:9 monitor but at 27" you do actually start to get an increase in game size.

So why do many prefer the 20.1 4:3 - mainly because you get a larger game screen than a 24" 16:9 and you also use all of the screen rather than having black bars on the sides that just sit unused - Plus you do not need to make your cab wider to fit the wide screen monitor making the cab dimensions more like a normal arcade machine. Versus a 27" you pretty much get almost the same size game screen with no black bars and ability to keep the cab about 6 -8 inches narrower.

IF you plan to use some newer games (ie. fighting games, side scrollers) made after 2005 - then the width will get some use during those games so if you don't mind the extra width of the cab then that's always an option - Just be sure to set Mame up to keep games in their correct aspect ratio and not stretch them when it scale if going that direction.

Another thing to keep in mind is the optimum viewing distance for a 20" 4:3 monitor is 3 - 7 ft where for a 27" 16:9 screen optimal viewing distance is 4 - 10 ft. so standing only a few feet from the screen the 20.1" 4:3 is a bit closer to optimal viewing distance. ( also according to the site linked below.)


Dimensions mentioned were taken from this site -- https://www.silisoftware.com/tools/screen_aspect_ratio_calculator

This 100%

Plus wide screen monitors dont look right in stand up cabs, They make them to wide imo.

[Malenko]

no black bars , wide cabs look weird.



7 words!

[leapinlew]

Maybe I got my dimensions wrong and I’m using a 24, but I’m using a standard golden tee cab. I don’t think those look weird.

[leapinlew]

When I built my last cabinet, I was able to buy 2 Golden Tee cabinets for the price of one, so I built one to sell. This is the cabinet I sold, but I used the same monitor in it as I did mine. You can see it doesn't fill out the space as nicely as the original Golden Tee monitor, but it does a good job. The Pandoras Box select game menu is utilizing the entire widescreen. If you select a game that is 4:3, it would put some black bars on the side, which aren't easy to see behind the tinted plexi. I'll see if I can find a pic. You can decide if losing that kind of space is a deal breaker for you


You can see the cabinet itself doesn't look weird, but you can't utilize the entire space of an existing monitor.

[YouknowStuIlltellya]

Many thanks to each of you and confirms what I suspected.  I just kept reading that 19 or 20 inch lcd 4:3 was the way to go over  27 16x9 if  not going crt but the reasoning seemed flawed in each case.  Or so it seemed. I have no problem w black bars on the sides and expected that.  And it's more versatile as someone above stated.

My cab is now going to 26.5 wide including the 3/4 side mdf which gives me just enough width for. 27 lcd. Does not look weird at all.

Acronym time. My byoac is close to complete. I'm going to hook up mame running on windows os 10 with a front end gui and  roms, chds, bios, and .dat files via a USB from a pcb but run an slg between the cpu which is powered by an i7 w 8gig ram and 3ghz processor and a 27 in lcd that has 75 kHz rr and 3ms with an hdmi to vga converter because in addition to the classics Id like to play gtf.

[Malenko]

Acronym time. My byoac is close to complete. I'm going to hook up mame running on windows os 10 with a front end gui and  roms, chds, bios, and .dat files via a USB from a pcb but run an slg between the cpu which is powered by an i7 w 8gig ram and 3ghz processor and a 27 in lcd that has 75 kHz rr and 3ms with an hdmi to vga converter because in addition to the classics Id like to play gtf.

Well you're trying too hard on the acronym game.

 A front end is a GUI so that is redundant. USB from a  Printed Circuit Board?That doesn't make sense.  The SLG goes between the GPU and the display not the CPU and the display. You're using CPU in place of PC and that doesn't make sense.

i7 what ? what gen? How many cores, how many threads? K series or locked?  8GB of what kind of RAM? DDR3 DDR4? What spec? Why are you saying the 3GHz processor is separate from the i7?
3ms what? Grey to Grey or On Off On?
Video converters introduce lag, just FYI
No one abbreviates Golden Tee Fore to GTF

[javeryh]

A lot of classic games are 3:4 so they look ridiculous on a 16:9 monitor... not to mention all of the rest that are 4:3 also look ridiculous but slightly less so.  There are no 16:9 classic games so why would you consider a 16:9 monitor?

[Nephasth]

Oh, cathode-ray tube
Those liquid crystal displays
Will never compare

[KenToad]

X-Men 6 player looks good on a widescreen.

[Laythe]

Wide cabinets look bad.  26.5 isn't too wide though.

If you gotta go 16:9, I say sling it portrait and hide the ends.

Oops, that was over ten words. 

Sorry.

[Gilrock]

When I was setting up my MAME cab last year it got frustrating trying to find bezel artwork.  It seemed like 16:9 was being adopted as the new bezel art standard.  I had a custom 1080x1080 setup so I was having to create my own bezels for my favorite games.  I guess most of those guys creating artwork are playing on desktop PCs instead of cabinets.

[JDFan]

When I was setting up my MAME cab last year it got frustrating trying to find bezel artwork.  It seemed like 16:9 was being adopted as the new bezel art standard.  I had a custom 1080x1080 setup so I was having to create my own bezels for my favorite games.  I guess most of those guys creating artwork are playing on desktop PCs instead of cabinets.

That and with a 4:3 monitor most people using them do not use bezel artwork since the games usually fill most of the space - if you are using the aspect ratio the game was designed to play on you don't use an onscreen bezel that just makes your game screen smaller so really no reason to make a full set of bezels that will never be used - the bezels are mostly used to cover up the black bars of unused space.

[Gilrock]

When I was setting up my MAME cab last year it got frustrating trying to find bezel artwork.  It seemed like 16:9 was being adopted as the new bezel art standard.  I had a custom 1080x1080 setup so I was having to create my own bezels for my favorite games.  I guess most of those guys creating artwork are playing on desktop PCs instead of cabinets.

That and with a 4:3 monitor most people using them do not use bezel artwork since the games usually fill most of the space - if you are using the aspect ratio the game was designed to play on you don't use an onscreen bezel that just makes your game screen smaller so really no reason to make a full set of bezels that will never be used - the bezels are mostly used to cover up the black bars of unused space.

Well on my cab I need the bezel so the game shrinks down close to the original size.  So I have bezels I've created that are exclusive to my setup like this one.

[JDFan]

Well on my cab I need the bezel so the game shrinks down close to the original size.  So I have bezels I've created that are exclusive to my setup like this one.

OR you could use a 1920x1440 resolution (1440x1920 for vertical games) to mostly fill the screen and then just make a bezel covering the 240 pixel black border on top and bottom(left/right sides on vertical games) or move the screen to the bottom/top of the screen and use a single 480 pixel bezel along the top/bottom rather than have it on both sides withthe screen in the center.)

[Mike A]

25 inch no burn CRT 200 bucks.

https://chicago.craigslist.org/nch/vgm/d/glenview-25-inch-wells-gardner-arcade/6890079595.html

Another one. Listed as excellent shape. 150 bucks

https://chicago.craigslist.org/nch/vgm/d/glenview-wells-garner-arcade-monitor/6887083470.html

If you give me your general location I can try to find one that is local to you.

This solves all of your problems.

[Gilrock]

Sure I'll just go back and rebuild the whole cabinet to move the screen or I'll make the game bigger by having no size bezel.  2 dumb ideas.

[KenToad]

I have a 40 inch 16:9 LCD TV in front of my pedestal. Not a fan of bezels most of the time and the black bars don't bother me. The black bars didn't bother me when I used to get letterboxed movies instead of pan and scan back in the late VHS early DVD years, either. I am bothered that some folks ignore aspect ratio altogether and just stretch everything to fill up all the screen. To me, that is distracting. I don't even notice black bars at the sides of the screen.

CRT's are fine, but no longer in production. And good quality 4:3 aspect ratio devices generally just aren't worth it for the expense of the sizes you would need to match similar dimensions in a widescreen format. People spend ridiculous amounts of money for 4:3 monitors so tiny that, even back in the heyday of CRT's, hardly anyone would have preferred over larger sets, no matter the sharpness of the picture. I will admit that deals can be found, but they come with a decent amount of hassle, maybe repair, not to mention figuring out how you're going to hook up modern tech to your outdated hardware.

I guess it all depends on what you want to spend (time and money) and the preferences of who will be playing.

[Mr. Peabody]

25 inch no burn CRT 200 bucks.

https://chicago.craigslist.org/nch/vgm/d/glenview-25-inch-wells-gardner-arcade/6890079595.html

Another one. Listed as excellent shape. 150 bucks

https://chicago.craigslist.org/nch/vgm/d/glenview-wells-garner-arcade-monitor/6887083470.html

Good deals.

[Yenome]

i've tried to find a calculator to find the 4:3 size of a 16:9 tv mounted vertical. I have seen people who use software to split the screen into two and use the top part of the screen for marque and the other half for a 4:3 screen or the 3:4 vert. I am thinking of going this way my self. its either that or im just building a pedestal with a 50" screen and generic bezel art to cover the black bars. was thinking of using a rotating tv mount to be able to rotate the screen for vert games.

Edit: seems ive had the site all along never payed attention to the check box lol
https://tvcalculator.com/

[schmerzkaufen]

A 24" 16:10 monitor produces a 4:3 picture bigger than a 20" 4:3 if that matters. There's still black pillars but thinner.
(the 1200p resolution is also good for emulator's scalines and crt shaders)

Note though 16:10 rarely offer aspect ratio correction for 16:9 contents, so they're often no good for external sources such as modern consoles.

[bperkins01]

I went with 32" 16:9 monitor so that 19" vertical games were the correct size.  Obviously 19" horizontal ones are..
http://www.displaywars.com/

I used this site when I was trying to figure this all out.

Leaves plenty of room for bezels which are pretty nice when you are using many different games.

[Mr. Peabody]

Nice wiring, and refreshingly simple panel and overlay. Love all the rounded corners, including the panel top. I prefer the sticks and buttons lower on the panel, though, and would move the spinner a little left, outer the way of trackball thrusting.