Arcade1up Clearance Sale

[pbj]

So sue them or STFU about it.

 

What's the fun in that?

[ark_ader]

No, it doesn't imply that all versions are covered by that license, that's the CURRENT license, for CURRENT versions, it can't from a legal perspective (and doesn't) override the individual license that is included with each distribution.  The 1997-2018 is just how long the project has existed.

I disagree. The webpage I linked to doesn't say that the license only applies to the current* version of MAME. So, by implication, it applies to all versions of MAME.

If what you're saying is correct, then the licensing information on the official MAME website is, at best, very misleading. However, that's hardly the fault of Arcade1up.

* which would still be ambiguous anyway, as the 'current' version is changing all the time.

You can disagree, but that isn't how the law works.

Always check the license that's provided with the software.  At worst you could say the text is 'incorrect' but really, it's 100% industry standard to list details for whatever the current offering is.  While these things do change over time. the expectation is always that you'll be using the current version, so the information provided primarily relates to that as it's most relevant in 99% of cases.  The main pages on pretty much every website you'll find have details that relate to the current versions only. 

Older versions are offered for archival purposes.  You're still bound by the licenses included with whatever you download.  This is the type of thing anybody releasing a product should be aware of, and should have a legal team ratify.

You didn't contact every contributor.  Several of my chums contributed to Mame and they were not contacted.  It is hard to invoke any right of use when you were reverse engineering and breaking copy protections.  You did get permission from the copyright holders to do that right?   

We know you didn't.  So it is fair use, from the MAME perspective that any LICENSED entity is able to use your software for commercial uses.  It goes with the territory.

Heck I can fork mame change it, name it differently and sell it, and the mamedevs could not do crap about it. I like to see you guys sue Arcade1up.  That will put the cat among the pigeons.  Considering how Nintendoh has been operating, who is to say that mame is next on their list?  Statute of limitations is 5 years for copyright infringement.  That gets extended on every code revision that mame/mess generates.

What is the penalty for infringing copyrights?  Up to three years in a federal prison and $250,000 for each occurrence.    

Who owns mame again? 

[Haze]

No, it doesn't imply that all versions are covered by that license, that's the CURRENT license, for CURRENT versions, it can't from a legal perspective (and doesn't) override the individual license that is included with each distribution.  The 1997-2018 is just how long the project has existed.

I disagree. The webpage I linked to doesn't say that the license only applies to the current* version of MAME. So, by implication, it applies to all versions of MAME.

If what you're saying is correct, then the licensing information on the official MAME website is, at best, very misleading. However, that's hardly the fault of Arcade1up.

* which would still be ambiguous anyway, as the 'current' version is changing all the time.

You can disagree, but that isn't how the law works.

Always check the license that's provided with the software.  At worst you could say the text is 'incorrect' but really, it's 100% industry standard to list details for whatever the current offering is.  While these things do change over time. the expectation is always that you'll be using the current version, so the information provided primarily relates to that as it's most relevant in 99% of cases.  The main pages on pretty much every website you'll find have details that relate to the current versions only. 

Older versions are offered for archival purposes.  You're still bound by the licenses included with whatever you download.  This is the type of thing anybody releasing a product should be aware of, and should have a legal team ratify.

You didn't contact every contributor.  Several of my chums contributed to Mame and they were not contacted.

If there is code of theirs in the project and they weren't contacted then we need to know.  We put *every* contributor on a list, crossed them off one-by-one as we got permission, and added the copyright holder information to the source.  Anybody who didn't respond had their code removed.  I'm calling bull on your claim.

  It is hard to invoke any right of use when you were reverse engineering and breaking copy protections.  You did get permission from the copyright holders to do that right?   

Again, that isn't how the law works.  We could easily sue for the same amount Nintendo just won from the ROM sites if we wanted.  MAME itself is software we wrote and we are the copyright holder on, what it does is irrelevant to this discussion.  I can play MP3s of pirated music on Windows Media Player, should Microsoft be sued?

We know you didn't.  So it is fair use, from the MAME perspective that any LICENSED entity is able to use your software for commercial uses.  It goes with the territory.

Again, not how the law works.  Does somebody selling a game that runs on Windows have full permission to just bundle an entire copy of Windows on the disk because their software needs it.  Of course not.

Heck I can fork mame change it, name it differently and sell it, and the mamedevs could not do crap about it. I like to see you guys sue Arcade1up.  That will put the cat among the pigeons.  Considering how Nintendoh has been operating, who is to say that mame is next on their list?  Statute of limitations is 5 years for copyright infringement.  That gets extended on every code revision that mame/mess generates.

What is the penalty for infringing copyrights?  Up to three years in a federal prison and $250,000 for each occurrence.    

Who owns mame again? 

yep... you're back to your usual trolling, get ---fouled up beyond all recognition---.

[Haze]

This kind of thing is exactly why I consider the arcade scene to be mostly toxic fwiw, and am glad MAME has extended outside of it.  At least in cases like Sony with the Playstation Classic, however poor the product was due to bad hardware choices, they made sure to use an emulator they COULD legally license (they didn't simply ignore the license terms on one they couldn't license on the grounds that they're Sony and it emulates their console, because despite what some people believe, that isn't how the law works)

The irony is of course, the community slammed Sony for using a GPL licensed emulator in that case, even if they were doing everything by the book (that's exactly why GPL exists) while instead here, in cases where the manufacturers are ignoring the licenses they're getting praise for it.

I'd love to see a proper 100% legitimate product with licensed ROMs built with MAME, we went through an entire process or relicensing our own code so that could happen, but even with that, the people making this type of thing seem to think they have a god given right to ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- on the people who have spent 20 years developing the emulator just so they can cheap out on some hardware costs / porting costs or whatever.

The way some of the community then defends them for this is shocking.  No matter what *we* do to try and help, and believe me, this relicensing was a massive undertaking specifically to benefit cases like this, that we were in no way obliged to do, we're always painted as in the wrong, told we have no rights, blah blah blah.  People wonder why the team distances itself more and more from arcade stuff?  At least the future of the project is bright.

I'm sure eventually these manufacturers will start using the versions that they can license, but probably more by chance than because they have any integrity.

Most of the time (not specific to this case, but for a good number in the past) even when the question is asked about licensing of MAME the companies selling this type of thing will either lie, or delete / block the user asking the question from the social media platform it was asked on (especially if the lie is pointed out) so yeah, it just seems like an entirely toxic scene.

[Malenko]

I said what I said to keep this thread somewhat on track and not another is mame legal thread.

Either defend your EULA against the people using it, or the point is moot. Complaining about it here and on Reddit doesn't change anything. I'm sorry if you find this "toxic" , I see it more as common sense.

[keilmillerjr]

Could don’t have just released a PlayStation similar to the original, but include a switchable on/off optical disc emulator that includes encrypted discs where the ode could decrypt on the fly? Then users could enjoy using all their old discs, possibly buy new/used ones, content built in, and be able to hook it up to a crt with composite video?

Or we could just keep the used originals. Shiat, at least I can play them on any tv. Discs can be bought plentiful and cheap at any used video game shop.

[opt2not]

Personally I’d rather talk about the mame legalities than these POS cabinets. 

[ark_ader]

No, it doesn't imply that all versions are covered by that license, that's the CURRENT license, for CURRENT versions, it can't from a legal perspective (and doesn't) override the individual license that is included with each distribution.  The 1997-2018 is just how long the project has existed.

I disagree. The webpage I linked to doesn't say that the license only applies to the current* version of MAME. So, by implication, it applies to all versions of MAME.

If what you're saying is correct, then the licensing information on the official MAME website is, at best, very misleading. However, that's hardly the fault of Arcade1up.

* which would still be ambiguous anyway, as the 'current' version is changing all the time.

You can disagree, but that isn't how the law works.

Always check the license that's provided with the software.  At worst you could say the text is 'incorrect' but really, it's 100% industry standard to list details for whatever the current offering is.  While these things do change over time. the expectation is always that you'll be using the current version, so the information provided primarily relates to that as it's most relevant in 99% of cases.  The main pages on pretty much every website you'll find have details that relate to the current versions only. 

Older versions are offered for archival purposes.  You're still bound by the licenses included with whatever you download.  This is the type of thing anybody releasing a product should be aware of, and should have a legal team ratify.

You didn't contact every contributor.  Several of my chums contributed to Mame and they were not contacted.

If there is code of theirs in the project and they weren't contacted then we need to know.  We put *every* contributor on a list, crossed them off one-by-one as we got permission, and added the copyright holder information to the source.  Anybody who didn't respond had their code removed.  I'm calling bull on your claim.

  It is hard to invoke any right of use when you were reverse engineering and breaking copy protections.  You did get permission from the copyright holders to do that right?   

Again, that isn't how the law works.  We could easily sue for the same amount Nintendo just won from the ROM sites if we wanted.  MAME itself is software we wrote and we are the copyright holder on, what it does is irrelevant to this discussion.  I can play MP3s of pirated music on Windows Media Player, should Microsoft be sued?

We know you didn't.  So it is fair use, from the MAME perspective that any LICENSED entity is able to use your software for commercial uses.  It goes with the territory.

Again, not how the law works.  Does somebody selling a game that runs on Windows have full permission to just bundle an entire copy of Windows on the disk because their software needs it.  Of course not.

Heck I can fork mame change it, name it differently and sell it, and the mamedevs could not do crap about it. I like to see you guys sue Arcade1up.  That will put the cat among the pigeons.  Considering how Nintendoh has been operating, who is to say that mame is next on their list?  Statute of limitations is 5 years for copyright infringement.  That gets extended on every code revision that mame/mess generates.

What is the penalty for infringing copyrights?  Up to three years in a federal prison and $250,000 for each occurrence.    

Who owns mame again? 

yep... you're back to your usual trolling, get ---fouled up beyond all recognition---.

I read Haze's post and had time to have a good time to reflect on his reply.  I also did some research and decided to respond to his post with as much humility and respect as I could muster on Sunday morning (before coffee), as his comments are "from the hip". 

We first must understand where Haze is coming from.  If it wasn't for Haze MAME would not be where it is now.  I will even go so far to rename MAME as HAZE instead.  The majority of the mamedevs are in no way even close to Haze, in regards to technical competency.  He will not admit it, but they guy is a genius.  Aaron is in his shadow.  We owe a lot to Haze.  When we fire up MAME and play some nostalgia, we owe our gratitude to Haze.  He did all the heavy lifting better than what Aaron did, in many ways.  What did he get in return? Disrespect from the very same team he led and removed as project coordinator.  If anyone deserves a medal from the gaming community, it would be him.   Mame is his baby and I appreciate him for is continued work on the project. 

These replies are my own based on data available on the internet, and when I say YOU it means MAME (apologies in advance) and I am drinking my hazelnut coffee now:

If there is code of theirs in the project and they weren't contacted then we need to know.  We put *every* contributor on a list, crossed them off one-by-one as we got permission, and added the copyright holder information to the source.  Anybody who didn't respond had their code removed.  I'm calling bull on your claim.

No you didn't, call it as you see fit.  FYI:  They don't really care, but it would be nice to see the effort and the recognition.

Again, that isn't how the law works.  We could easily sue for the same amount Nintendo just won from the ROM sites if we wanted.  MAME itself is software we wrote and we are the copyright holder on, what it does is irrelevant to this discussion.  I can play MP3s of pirated music on Windows Media Player, should Microsoft be sued?

You could if you wanted to open a shipping container full of worms.  You don't own the software to drive a Nintendo ROM.  Nintendo does.  You could argue MAME as an library archive or sorts, luckily somewhat covered under the DMCA at a stretch.  You can make your own MP3 player as it is in the public domain, but you cannot use that argument. The project bought mainboards off ebay and then dumped the roms, then sold the boards on to buy more.  Mamedevs got personal contributions to buy more boards off ebay to dump them.  When you sold the dumped boards you did not own the roms MAME dumped, and that oddly, somehow, got leaked to the internet.    So should MAME be sued for being able to play pirated roms?  No. MAME owns all the boards it bought and stored them in a repository, right?  Well you would need to if you wanted to not get sued by a copyright holder, such as Nintendoh.

Also if a ROM (available on a rom site) was somehow linked to a board that was bought by MAME, then sold on, and some legal issue came up.. 

Again, not how the law works.  Does somebody selling a game that runs on Windows have full permission to just bundle an entire copy of Windows on the disk because their software needs it.  Of course not.

No the software company or entity submits their software (driver) to M$, they vet it and it gets added or rejected.  MAME already took the driver from the software company or entity and added it to their software without permission.  So we can simply say mainboards, ROMS, PROMS, HDD and cdroms, floppy discs are media provided by a software company or entity.  Doesn't look good, does it?   

yep... you're back to your usual trolling, get ---fouled up beyond all recognition---.

When you look at it, from the point of a good intention.  Regardless if it is to preserve the arcade history, or to be a resource where original hardware owners can seek help repairing their arcade machine, some responsibility is needed to justify the actions of a project.  Especially when the comment "playing the games is a good side effect" is made, then the focus shifts from archive to media player.  I would say that was a good intention.  "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions".

The only single focus of the project is to document, and create software to test and provide more documentation of technical hardware.  The logistics to house such a collection of mainboards is huge, and there is the issue of private owners dumping ROMS for the project, and seeking help and assistance from the makers of these boards, the list goes on and on.

In its heyday Arcade manufacturers were keen to keep their software from being copied and sold on bootleg boards, due to the cost of the IP (Intellectual Property) to create such a game.  Classic case was Donkey Kong.  It was a huge hit, and it sold thousands of cabinets.  We also saw Crazy Kong, and as kids played it just the same and added quarters for the operators.  Nintendoh didn't see any of that revenue.  Roll on today, Crazy Kong is on MAME.  Great we can play it again, minus the quarter.  That would be OK, but we can play all of Nintendoh games now too, like Punchout! and their Vs editions without any monetary consideration to Nintendoh.  If you (Ikegami Tsushinki) wrote Donkey Kong and lived on the royalties from the use of that IP.  Would you not be a little bit upset for all that lost revenue?  Maybe not.

Why would I buy a $299 game console to play Donkey Kong, when I can play it free on a donated PC?  If I wanted to play Nintendoh's classics I would have to pay $99 for the NES, or $199 for the SNES, or $199 for the N64 or $199 for a Wii or $299 for a Wii U, etc.  Same would be for ports.  None of that mame play (revenue) goes back to Nintendoh.  Bundling Donkey Kong with MAME is being done more than once since the last 15 years or so. Anyone hazard a guess on how much money that was intended for Nintendoh if those ROMS and it's player was never created?  Maybe $100.  How much is Donkey Kong IP worth today?  10 Billion.  Wow.

I wonder how much Sonic is worth?

I could go on, but it is not toxic to discuss this subject or its ramifications.  It is not toxic to display MAME as a medium to play lost arcade games, and bundle it up with roms, to be sold as X in 1 solutions sold on Amazon and eBay.  Who cares right?  Is MAME suing Amazon or some Chinese outfit?  Nope.  It must be beguiling to have your work being used for profit by so many.  That is some interesting Karma.

As for trolling.  Have you checked your calendar Haze?  Isn't it time to troll the mamedevs, and spectacularly voice your impression of impending doom, to the masses on your website?  Are you leaving the project this year? Don't you always?  You like my posts Haze, and I am sure you have me on some RSS feed as you like the attention.  You are a superstar Haze, milk it for all its worth! 



Now if you want some good PR - get cracking on that Laseractive Emulator!

[leapinlew]

Would like to branch off the Mame shenanigans and get this thread back on track. I am interested in how the A1UP's have utilized Mame, but don't want this thread to be taken out because of it.

I checked and all my local walmarts are soldiering on at the $299 price point.

[ark_ader]

Would like to branch off the Mame shenanigans and get this thread back on track. I am interested in how the A1UP's have utilized Mame, but don't want this thread to be taken out because of it.

I checked and all my local walmarts are soldiering on at the $299 price point.

You have to wait until January sales.  I see the cabinets being sold for $199.  I got mine as they were all sold up in a matter of hours.  I still like mine (even though I shagged up the CP) and got it working with the Pi Mod.  I do not think there is the same interest in buying high priced novelty goods.  The sting of 2009 is still felt, and I would not want to buy a high priced item, only to see the store close due to bankruptcy.

The controls is what is getting the bad reviews.  Could Arcade1Up just spent 25c for better hardware?

I see interest in the individuals wanting an arcade in their apartment without getting a 300lb arcade cabinet up 3 flights of stairs.  Especially in New York or Chicago.

They need to add that riser for free too.  That was a rip for $35.00.

[opt2not]

We first must understand where Haze is coming from.  If it wasn't for Haze MAME would not be where it is now.  I will even go so far to rename MAME as HAZE instead.  The majority of the mamedevs are in no way even close to Haze, in regards to technical competency.  He will not admit it, but they guy is a genius.  Aaron is in his shadow.  We owe a lot to Haze.  When we fire up MAME and play some nostalgia, we owe our gratitude to Haze.  He did all the heavy lifting better than what Aaron did, in many ways.  What did he get in return? Disrespect from the very same team he led and removed as project coordinator.  If anyone deserves a medal from the gaming community, it would be him.   Mame is his baby and I appreciate him for is continued work on the project. 

I ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- you not, I had to look at who was posting this 3 times while reading this paragraph. Ark praising Haze??

[Mr. Peabody]

ark pats on the head, or dumps all over them. Here he did both.

If ark or his pals haven't looked into the code to see theirs removed, they can say nothing.

MAME is not even in assembly, so no frijoles.


@Zebidee: -tips hat-

[ark_ader]

We first must understand where Haze is coming from.  If it wasn't for Haze MAME would not be where it is now.  I will even go so far to rename MAME as HAZE instead.  The majority of the mamedevs are in no way even close to Haze, in regards to technical competency.  He will not admit it, but they guy is a genius.  Aaron is in his shadow.  We owe a lot to Haze.  When we fire up MAME and play some nostalgia, we owe our gratitude to Haze.  He did all the heavy lifting better than what Aaron did, in many ways.  What did he get in return? Disrespect from the very same team he led and removed as project coordinator.  If anyone deserves a medal from the gaming community, it would be him.   Mame is his baby and I appreciate him for is continued work on the project. 

I ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- you not, I had to look at who was posting this 3 times while reading this paragraph. Ark praising Haze??

Totally serious.  It doesn't mean I agree of his politics or behaviors, but the only other person who fits that programming excellence and contribution is David Alan Spicer. 

Other heavy lifters in the world of arcade emulation is David Foley and part-timer Aaron Giles of Lucas Arts Fame.

If ark or his pals haven't looked into the code to see theirs removed, they can say nothing.

Haze said Mamedevs contacted everyone.  IF you knew anything about software development, you would comment accordingly and correctly.   

[Osirus23]

The MAME license was changed in later versions to be permissive to this sort of thing. Was there some super special sauce in the old versions that was taken out that mamedev doesn't want covered by the newer, more permissive license? If not, why would they give a ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- now? The license was changed to allow this sort of use, technically the old version is still bound by the old license, but given the later change I have a hard time seeing anyone getting buttmad over it now, unless they are just looking for an excuse to stir up ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

[ark_ader]

The MAME license was changed in later versions to be permissive to this sort of thing. Was there some super special sauce in the old versions that was taken out that mamedev doesn't want covered by the newer, more permissive license? If not, why would they give a ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- now? The license was changed to allow this sort of use, technically the old version is still bound by the old license, but given the later change I have a hard time seeing anyone getting buttmad over it now, unless they are just looking for an excuse to stir up ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

I would agree but I fear it is pride of authorship that is in play or annual resentment.  Flip a coin.

[jonathan.rowe.75]

These comments were great until it turned into Facebook armchair fodder.

At $150 or less I’d pick up Pac-Man, Galaga, and Street Fighter cabinets for the sole purpose of having a mini arcade in the mancave.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[yotsuya]

At $150 or less I’d pick up Pac-Man, Galaga, and Street Fighter cabinets for the sole purpose of having a mini arcade in the mancave.

This here is exactly why these cabinets exist.

[Mr. Peabody]

Haze said Mamedevs contacted everyone.  IF you knew anything about software development, you would comment accordingly and correctly.   

You ignore what you don't care for, then act like you didn't.

[opt2not]

These comments were great until it turned into Facebook armchair fodder.

Thank you for your insights and welcome to the forum. Stick around and join the conversations, you’ll notice the Internet has familiar themes throughout, not specific to certain social media sites.

[jonathan.rowe.75]

At $150 or less I’d pick up Pac-Man, Galaga, and Street Fighter cabinets for the sole purpose of having a mini arcade in the mancave.

This here is exactly why these cabinets exist.

Wow! Your reply was inspiring and insignificant at the same time!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[yotsuya]

At $150 or less I’d pick up Pac-Man, Galaga, and Street Fighter cabinets for the sole purpose of having a mini arcade in the mancave.

This here is exactly why these cabinets exist.

Wow! Your reply was inspiring and insignificant at the same time!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I just call them like I see them.

Related note:

[smass]

I keep hoping someone figures out a way to flash a few more games onto them....

https://www.reddit.com/r/Arcade1Up/comments/a02870/hack_original_board_not_just_replace_w_pietc/

Nice.  Adding usb port successfully means the board is pretty close to being hacked.

[Ignus Fast]

I'm just not sure that board is worth hacking.  As low powered as it is, it's almost always going to be worth the $50 - $75 to add a Pi and a well-chosen selection of games.  IMO, of course.

EDIT:  I guess one major advantage would be the ability to make changes to the emulator and install improved ROMs...

[smass]

I'm just not sure that board is worth hacking.  As low powered as it is, it's almost always going to be worth the $50 - $75 to add a Pi and a well-chosen selection of games.  IMO, of course.

EDIT:  I guess one major advantage would be the ability to make changes to the emulator and install improved ROMs...

For my own machine I would agree (but use a free donated computer, not a pi).  It would however be nice if you could get the original board to run a short list of 20 or so games.  Then I could hack them for friends who just want to play a few more games on their machines. 

[ark_ader]

Adding a PC is the best thing for these cabs.  You need the extra weight to make the cabs more stable.  A Dell Dimension 3000 fits in there like a glove, and it is plenty enough for any game like NFL Blitz.  You can also use the cab as a plex server.  I added a shoe rack for all the 2.5 HDDs (8 in total) and external 3.5 HDDs.  Plenty of space for ventilation.  No more movement with joy action on Pacman Championship.

[smass]

Adding a PC is the best thing for these cabs.  You need the extra weight to make the cabs more stable.  A Dell Dimension 3000 fits in there like a glove, and it is plenty enough for any game like NFL Blitz.  You can also use the cab as a plex server.  I added a shoe rack for all the 2.5 HDDs (8 in total) and external 3.5 HDDs.  Plenty of space for ventilation.  No more movement with joy action on Pacman Championship.

I was nodding my head until you got to the shoe rack comment.  I suppose you could add a cinder block or two to stabilize it...  lulz     

[leapinlew]

Adding a PC is the best thing for these cabs.  You need the extra weight to make the cabs more stable.  A Dell Dimension 3000 fits in there like a glove, and it is plenty enough for any game like NFL Blitz.  You can also use the cab as a plex server.  I added a shoe rack for all the 2.5 HDDs (8 in total) and external 3.5 HDDs.  Plenty of space for ventilation.  No more movement with joy action on Pacman Championship.

I was nodding my head until you got to the shoe rack comment.  I suppose you could add a cinder block or two to stabilize it...  lulz     

I like the idea of a steady state box. I don't want to worry about unexpected power downs corrupting the image or slower bootup times. On my last Defender build, I used an inferior Williams multi-board vs using a pi or computer just for that reason. I do love my retropie, but for the arcades I've been using multi-boards when possible.

[Zebra]

The arcade1up stuff (at least the Atari 12-in-1) is bootleg MAME anyway

https://www.reddit.com/r/MAME/comments/a35edo/hacking_the_arcade1up_34scale_mini_arcade_cabinets/

It's MAME 0.139u1 (well a modified build based on that) which is originally from 2010, so falls under the old license, which is strictly no commercial use.

So these things aren't even legal.

If they'd used 0.172 or above they'd be in the clear, as we painstakingly contacted every contributor and relicensed everything for that point onwards.  This was done, in part, so manufacturers like this COULD use MAME as a legal option, but even with that on the table they've gone the lazy / cheap route and produced a product that legally they can't even sell by picking a build before from before the work we put in to change the license.  So yeah, even when we've done the majority of the work for people like this, at our own expense, they still ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- on us.

If they're not bothering to properly license MAME (terms are clear, team is very easy to contact, basic requirement is simple - 0.172 or above for a commercial product + provide source on request) it does make you wonder if the rest was properly licensed too.

I'm not sure if the law is clear on software that is given away free. It might be against the mame rules but not necessarily illegal.

If mame was a commercial software, the owners might be able to sue the arcade 1 up guys for damages (I.e. loss of revenue) but they can't really claim any damages on a product they give away free.

[Ginsu Victim]

The arcade1up stuff (at least the Atari 12-in-1) is bootleg MAME anyway

https://www.reddit.com/r/MAME/comments/a35edo/hacking_the_arcade1up_34scale_mini_arcade_cabinets/

It's MAME 0.139u1 (well a modified build based on that) which is originally from 2010, so falls under the old license, which is strictly no commercial use.

So these things aren't even legal.

If they'd used 0.172 or above they'd be in the clear, as we painstakingly contacted every contributor and relicensed everything for that point onwards.  This was done, in part, so manufacturers like this COULD use MAME as a legal option, but even with that on the table they've gone the lazy / cheap route and produced a product that legally they can't even sell by picking a build before from before the work we put in to change the license.  So yeah, even when we've done the majority of the work for people like this, at our own expense, they still ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- on us.

If they're not bothering to properly license MAME (terms are clear, team is very easy to contact, basic requirement is simple - 0.172 or above for a commercial product + provide source on request) it does make you wonder if the rest was properly licensed too.

I'm not sure if the law is clear on software that is given away free. It might be against the mame rules but not necessarily illegal.

If mame was a commercial software, the owners might be able to sue the arcade 1 up guys for damages (I.e. loss of revenue) but they can't really claim any damages on a product they give away free.

Just because it was given away free doesn't mean someone else can sell it.

[JDFan]

Just because it was given away free doesn't mean someone else can sell it.

But Civil suits are filed based on Damages -- and if there is no financial loss involved they can not sue to recover a loss they did not incur - so what exactly would they sue for ?

[ark_ader]

Apparently some Arcade1Up units have more games..

[JDFan]

One of the 5 local stores finally decided to Clearance some of theirs -- Bought a Pacman and a Galaga at $150 each - and then returned the Pacman to the store I bought one at on Black Friday and got $250 back - so wound up paying $50 extra to get the second cab.

[Howard_Casto]

The control panel graphics are especially fragile on these, perhaps even more so than people have been complaining.  They put up a pacman in our local store shortly after black Friday.  The cp graphics are almost completely gone at this point and keep in mind this is a very small, out of the way store, so it hasn't gotten a lot of traffic. I would clear coat those things before even testing them.

[wp34]

The control panel graphics are especially fragile on these, perhaps even more so than people have been complaining.  They put up a pacman in our local store shortly after black Friday.  The cp graphics are almost completely gone at this point and keep in mind this is a very small, out of the way store, so it hasn't gotten a lot of traffic. I would clear coat those things before even testing them.

Even the machines setup in Walmarts that are not even playable are losing their graphics.  Some clear coat or plexi would seem to be in order.

[JDFan]

The control panel graphics are especially fragile on these, perhaps even more so than people have been complaining.  They put up a pacman in our local store shortly after black Friday.  The cp graphics are almost completely gone at this point and keep in mind this is a very small, out of the way store, so it hasn't gotten a lot of traffic. I would clear coat those things before even testing them.

Yeah from what I've seen they hold up OK until they get that first spot of wear and then that seems to break the bond between the ink and the vinyl and it starts to peel off really quickly after that. I've already ordered the control deck protectors for both ( they have a form posted on their site to order them for free just need to post a pic of your receipt and shipping info and they currently say you should get it within 30 days) and they have started shipping them with a new artwork overlay also but I'll still be putting a clear coat on both before using them.

[smass]

I am on the arcade1up facebook group.  A guy on there went all out and modded his cabinet replacing everything including the art package.  He modded it to a smash brothers theme.  Spent a total of $400 on top of the $199 purchase cost.  Now thats crazy.  He basically paid $200 for a cabinet shell and an LCD and then replaced and upgraded everything else. 

I modded my Galaga and added a computer running mame, but that cost me less than $60.  Which on top of the $149 I paid, I can live with.  Some folks just go overboard, but you be the judge:

[chrisdfw]

I guess its not much different from spending 200 at an auction for a cabinet with working monitor and gutting and putting a pc and with mame in it.

They are a nice size if you dont have room for a full size game.  Also, if you have no wood working skills or equipment but can do the rest then this is a good option.

Heck...I hate the wood cutting and construction part so if they get cheap enough I might do that.

I dont like the built in screen though.  It is bad to look at from the sides and not high enough resolution to emulate fake scan lines and the look of a raster pixel.

[JDFan]

I dont like the built in screen though.  It is bad to look at from the sides and not high enough resolution to emulate fake scan lines and the look of a raster pixel.

17" LCDs can be picked up for less than the $20 you'd spend on getting a LCD controller board for the included LCD and can be used as a drop in replacement if you remove the panel from the case ( ie. Dell, Hp, etc.)

[smass]

I dont like the built in screen though.  It is bad to look at from the sides and not high enough resolution to emulate fake scan lines and the look of a raster pixel.

17" LCDs can be picked up for less than the $20 you'd spend on getting a LCD controller board for the included LCD and can be used as a drop in replacement if you remove the panel from the case ( ie. Dell, Hp, etc.)

I am going to attempt this soon.  How easily is the original lcd removed from the bezel?  I haven't been able to find any videos showing the removal and replacement of the LCD screen. 

[leapinlew]

Some folks just go overboard, but you be the judge:

Of course people can go overboard compared to what I would do. That's with everything though: classic cars to A/V equipment! People can be passionate about their hobbies and when it's not about being an investment, it can be totally justifiable.

In this particular instance, reskinning the cabinet and installing different brains into a system isn't something that would hurt my head too much.