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Author Topic: Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]  (Read 2318 times)

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barrymossel

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Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]
« on: December 21, 2017, 01:34:40 pm »
A while ago I started Project Morning Wood, but I wasn't quite satisfied. So I will make a planter for some tomato plants out of that wood.
But I still want to build an arcade cabinet. After some advice I "designed" a quite slim cabinet based on the Galaga cab. As I made a boombox a while ago that I painted orange I thought I would make the arcade cabinet that exact same color as I quite like it. Orange being the color of the Netherlands, I decided to call the cab: The Dutch. Of course anything is still up for debate, as this is still the planning phase.




I am thinking of getting the marquee lasercut from 3mm MDF. The white parts will get some white translucent acrylate (3mm) behind it. Behind the marquee I will add a RGB led strip, so I can make it light up. The rest of the cab will be 18mm MDF with white T-molding.
The Dell 2001FP 20 inch LCD will be behind some smoked plexi (first I wanted glass but I don't see the need for that for the bezel actually). I just ordered a Mini-SLG from Paradise (the craftymech one). And the whole will (for now) run of a RPi3. I might change that to a PC later if needed/wanted.

At the moment I have:
  • 2 Zero Delay encoders (work fine for now, might change in the future if needed)
  • Fake Happ and Sanwa buttons (unfortunately the white Happ's are more off-white)
  • Fake Sanwa sticks (thinking of changing one to an Ultimarc stick - don't know which yet)
  • white X-Arcade trackball
  • Double coin door
  • Mini-SLG
  • RPi3
  • Dell 2001FP

I know the quality of some of the stuff might be low, but if they don't do for my cause, I will change it eventually.

Any thoughts? Ideas?

For instance: what joystick should I buy for Player 1? I want it to be easily switched from 4 to 8 way and I want it to look (and feel) like the fake Sanwa's I have (so they will look and feel (quite) the same). I guess the J-Stik will do then, right?
« Last Edit: January 12, 2018, 02:18:35 pm by barrymossel »

Mike A

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2017, 01:41:58 pm »
Throw the joysticks and the encoders in the trash and buy some good controls. There is no point in building an arcade cabinet with bad controls unless you hate video games.

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2017, 01:48:31 pm »
Throw the joysticks and the encoders in the trash and buy some good controls. There is no point in building an arcade cabinet with bad controls unless you hate video games.
I get your point. And I will probably toss the fake Sanwa's in the bin (at least P1). Why the encoders though? They feel ok to me, actually zero (noticeable by me) delay. Sure, they might fail after a while because of poor QA, but I can change them then. Or are there other reasons why these are crap?

Mike A

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2017, 01:59:49 pm »
They show up as a game pad. A keyboard encoder is usually preferable, but not always.

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2017, 02:15:46 pm »
But what is the difference? Where could I read more about that? I thought gaming with a gamepad was considered fine?

Mike A

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2017, 04:51:05 pm »
There is a lot of reading you can do about these encoders right here in the forums.

leapinlew

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2017, 06:46:43 pm »
I've used both...

I use the zero delay encoders when building a single player machine, and a ipac when using multiple players. I have no reason not to use the zero delay, I'm just afraid it'll flip controls on me if it re-finds my hardware or something. I'd give it a shot and see how it goes. I've been generally happy with the zero delay. Much happier than a x-arcade controller.

The upside to using some of the keyboard encoders is you can have shifted keys. For example, pressing player 1 and joystick down = pause for me. This allows me to have a pause option without a extra button on the control panel.

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2017, 02:51:43 am »
I've used both...

I use the zero delay encoders when building a single player machine, and a ipac when using multiple players. I have no reason not to use the zero delay, I'm just afraid it'll flip controls on me if it re-finds my hardware or something. I'd give it a shot and see how it goes. I've been generally happy with the zero delay. Much happier than a x-arcade controller.

The upside to using some of the keyboard encoders is you can have shifted keys. For example, pressing player 1 and joystick down = pause for me. This allows me to have a pause option without a extra button on the control panel.
Thanks, that's helpful. I guess I will go with these for the time being. That shifted keys though sounds like a standard option in EmulationStation/RetroPie: hotkeys?

Titchgamer

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2017, 03:01:30 am »
Throw the joysticks and the encoders in the trash and buy some good controls. There is no point in building an arcade cabinet with bad controls unless you hate video games.

This ^

The controls are the most important part of your build.
They will literally make or brake the games you play with them.

As for the which stick question its been asked many times on here but cant really point you in a singular direction without knowing what type of fake sanwas you currently have.

Cool concept name though.

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2017, 03:46:49 am »
Throw the joysticks and the encoders in the trash and buy some good controls. There is no point in building an arcade cabinet with bad controls unless you hate video games.

This ^

The controls are the most important part of your build.
They will literally make or brake the games you play with them.

As for the which stick question its been asked many times on here but cant really point you in a singular direction without knowing what type of fake sanwas you currently have.

Cool concept name though.
I have those cheap China sticks from those eBay packages. Something like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Arcade-DIY-Kit-Parts-USB-Encoder-Controller-PC-Joystick-With-20-Push-Button/372071783274
They do their job. And as I don't have any comparison I don't necessarily think they suck. Still I would like (at least one - as P2 will be probably drunk when gaming anyway) a good stick. Looked into the Servo-stik and J-stik as I want it to be easily switched from 4 to 8 way. The Mag-stik also sounds nice but then I would have to buy two as that one will be quite different than the fake Sanwa. And again, as I have no comparison I don't know if I would dig a short throw over a longer throw.

The concept name has become the final name actually as I ordered the marquee last night. :)

leapinlew

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2017, 07:58:10 pm »
Throw the joysticks and the encoders in the trash and buy some good controls. There is no point in building an arcade cabinet with bad controls unless you hate video games.

 ::)

Why are these junk? Or why are other sticks better? What's a "good" control? For me, a good control is one that I personally like the feel of. I don't like Nintendo joysticks, so I don't use them. For my 4 way games, my preference is a 4 way Wico leaf joystick. It's what I am used to. For my 8 way, I like Happ Super bat top microswitch sticks. I used the Ultra Magstick+ and the throw was too short, I didn't care for it.

The problem with manual 4/8 way sticks I've owned was that my guests didn't seem to care if it was 4 way or 8 way or got confused. For me, having multiple arcade games was the answer. You may have no issue with a manual solution, or you may want to look into an automated solution. Another option are the 360 sticks with digital maps. You got lots of options. I'd encourage purchasing a few more sticks to see what you like. You could probably get some good deals on used sticks here, or sell any stick you buy to recoup much of the money.

Mike A

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2017, 09:06:11 pm »
Well for starters the garbage sticks from China feel cheap. I do have limited experience with them. My arcade machines don't have them, but I have played quite a few bartops with the knock off joysticks. They just don't feel right. I am old and I hate the clicking of microswitches in general. I also hate playing arcade games on an LCD. Some of my opinions are colored by the fact that I grew up playing these games in their original incarnations. I have opinions. So do other people. I think the knock offs are garbage and Lew disagrees. I am certainly not the arbiter of correct MAME cab design. In the end it is your machine, and you will do what you want with it. If you are happy with it then it doesn't matter at all what I think.

Good luck with your build. I look forward to seeing sawdust fly.

pbj

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2017, 09:27:23 pm »
Any new joystick you install in 2017 will feel better than anything you played in the wild in 1992.

Mike A

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2017, 10:08:58 pm »
I don't see people rushing to replace their Wicos with Zippys.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2017, 10:22:46 pm by Mike A »

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2018, 08:06:15 am »
As I thought the Chinese buttons weren't white enough (really off-white) I decided to order these IL Concave buttons. And as I would like to experiment with something like leaf switches I ordered the Rollie leaf switches for push buttons.
Also received the white t-molding and some clamps (for the control panel) and adjustable feet.
Next week the laser cut 3mm MDF "marquee" will probably arrive. And the white (special LED) plexiglass also arrived two weeks ago. Didn't test it yet, but also ordered a 49% transmission grey plexiglass sample and did test that. Decided that I will definitely go for tinted. I like the colors a bit better without the tint I guess. But the fact that the whole monitor will be invisible when turned of totally makes up for that tiny loss of colors. Probably will go for tempered glass then, as I believe that won't scratch that fast.

Now I should get me some MDF and start building. Only problem is that I don't have a big work shop so I guess I need to wait for some better weather...

leapinlew

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2018, 07:43:45 pm »
Those are my favorite buttons. I've only ever played concave. Convex is very different feeling to me.

yotsuya

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2018, 10:08:04 pm »
Good choice on the buttons, Barry. Convex buttons sux.
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [planning phase]
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2018, 02:13:01 pm »
The marquee arrived from the laser cutter, as well as the white LED plexi. Looks quite nice imo.



« Last Edit: January 12, 2018, 03:42:56 pm by barrymossel »

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2018, 04:16:03 pm »
As I don't have room for multiple cabs and I want this one to be multi-functional I would like to include:
  • 2x 8 way sticks with 6 buttons for fighting games
  • 4 way stick for some classics
  • Trackball for stuff like Golden Tee and some ScummVM emulation (used as a mouse)

As I really don't want a Frankenpanel and rather have it quite simple, preferably everything in white, I think I have a couple of options:

  • IL competition sticks in white, separate dedicated 4 way and the trackball - will be kinda crowded I guess
  • Switchable 4/8 way sticks and a trackball - unfortunately can't find any easily switched white 4/8 ways
  • Loose the trackball - but I have purchased that already
  • Forget about the 4 way at all and play the classics with an 8 way - didn't like the feel of for instance Pacman with the cheap China 8 way sticks I own right now
  • Compromise on the color of the 4/8 way switchables - for instance https://www.arcadeshop.de/ILSA-Joysticks-T-Stik-orange_535.html, but don't think this will look nice
  • Make two control panels, one with the 8 ways and buttons and one with the trackball and 4 way

I am leaning towards the last option (don't know how I will do it, but time enough to plan), but what do you guys think? Or do you have other suggestions?

Btw, the control panel will be approx. 65 x 22 cm (~25.6 x 8.7 inch)
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 04:23:49 pm by barrymossel »

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2018, 03:00:56 pm »
Ok, I finally decided on getting two Servo-Stiks with white ball tops, as there won't be room for a dedicated 4-way (and the trackball) and the IL/Happ Competitions apparently won't do for 4-way games. Switching between two control panels isn't quite what I would like to do in the end. I guess this will be the best all around solution for my cabinet.

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2018, 03:52:47 am »
Wow, the ServoStiks arrived and what the difference between those two and the China knock-offs is huge. This is what quality feels like. I am one happy chap!
Unfortunately no screws/bolts to attach the servo were shipped. Don't see why they wouldn't do that (NVM)...
« Last Edit: January 27, 2018, 04:10:16 am by barrymossel »

barrymossel

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Re: Project: The Dutch [gathering phase]
« Reply #21 on: July 01, 2018, 04:30:59 am »

  
 

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