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Author Topic: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot  (Read 656 times)

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Spotlight Displays

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Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« on: March 09, 2017, 08:42:50 pm »
Hey guys, not sure what's going on. I have a Happ  Trackball that has worked fine for about 6 month. For some reason when playing World Class Bowling and Shuffleshot the game will play fine with the trackball and then at random times just stop working. The joystick will still throw the ball. I've also tried to see if the joystick would freeze up but it won't.

When I reset the game, the trackball will work again for a certain period of time and then stop working.

I have removed the rom and downloaded it again for WCB. When I reinstall it and run the Audit, then start the game it remembers the credits from the previous game. Is there a way to completely uninstall the game and then reinstall it? I'm thinking that this might be causing the problem to remain.

Do I need to remove the Shuffleshot game as well because they seem to be from the same company and possibly using the same files?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!

Thank you!!!


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« Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 11:38:07 am by Spotlight Displays »

Spotlight Displays

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Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2017, 08:47:56 pm »
Just to add; I haven't noticed it stop working with other games such as Centipede or Golden Tee. Thanks!


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Spotlight Displays

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Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2017, 10:01:17 pm »
The WCB version I had was 1.66 I upgraded to 2.0 and it still has the same problem.

It seems that it only happens if I scroll backwards and then forward like you would do with Golden Tee Golf. Wondering if it has something to do with the reverse and forward signal?

This is driving me NUTS so any help would be appreciated!

Thanks!


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Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2017, 06:39:20 am »
If this is something that has been answered before or is just too hard to really answer please let me know. I've searched for the answer and can't find anything.

I've noticed that sometimes after the trackball stops working I have to click the exit button multiple times to exit the game.

Also noticed that if I spin the trackball after it stops working it makes the background music stutter.

Thank you!
« Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 06:42:03 am by Spotlight Displays »

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2017, 11:39:34 am »
Made a mistake, its World Class Bowling. Nothing like talking to myself lol!


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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2017, 05:08:35 pm »
Is there an initiation or something to get help here?


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DarthMarino

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2017, 07:41:02 pm »
Do you have anything mapped to the Trackball Inc or Dec? Nothing should be mapped to these.  Only map your trackball to the two Analog Inputs. That's all I can think of. If it's temperamental, it's tough to narrow down what the issue is.

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2017, 08:26:38 pm »
Do you have anything mapped to the Trackball Inc or Dec? Nothing should be mapped to these.  Only map your trackball to the two Analog Inputs. That's all I can think of. If it's temperamental, it's tough to narrow down what the issue is.
I really appreciate the info DarthMarino! I will look into that! Thank you!


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PL1

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2017, 08:27:13 pm »
Is there an initiation or something to get help here?
No, nothing like that.   :lol

The software sub-forum just doesn't get that much traffic.

You mentioned that Centipede and Golden Tee don't seem to lock up, so it's probably not a simple fix.  :dunno

Mametesters.org lists several bugs/fixes for the "itech32.c" driver that covers both World Class Bowling and Shuffleshot.

If none of those bugs/fixes apply, someone might be able to help if they had more info such as:

- "Flavor"/version of MAME i.e. MAMEUIFX v0.152 or MAME v0.183

- ROM title/filename -- I think you mentioned World Class Bowling (v1.66)/"wcbowl" and World Class Bowling Deluxe (v2.00)/"wcbowldx" earlier in the thread, right?

- Front end (Hyperspin, MALA, Attract Mode, etc.)

- Other software like Joy2Key, MAMEhooker, LEDBlinky, etc. that is running in the background.

- Type of optical encoder your trackball is connected to (I-Pac? Mini-Pac? Opti-Wiz? Happ?)

- OS/motherboard/processor

Hope this helps.   ;D


Scott

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2017, 08:30:37 pm »
Is there an initiation or something to get help here?
No, nothing like that.   :lol

The software sub-forum just doesn't get that much traffic.

You mentioned that Centipede and Golden Tee don't seem to lock up, so it's probably not a simple fix.  :dunno

Mametesters.org lists several bugs/fixes for the "itech32.c" driver that covers both World Class Bowling and Shuffleshot.

If none of those bugs/fixes apply, someone might be able to help if they had more info such as:

- "Flavor"/version of MAME i.e. MAMEUIFX v0.152 or MAME v0.183

- ROM title/filename -- I think you mentioned World Class Bowling (v1.66)/"wcbowl" and World Class Bowling Deluxe (v2.00)/"wcbowldx" earlier in the thread, right?

- Front end (Hyperspin, MALA, Attract Mode, etc.)

- Other software like Joy2Key, MAMEhooker, LEDBlinky, etc. that is running in the background.

- Type of optical encoder your trackball is connected to (I-Pac? Mini-Pac? Opti-Wiz? Happ?)

- OS/motherboard/processor

Hope this helps.   ;D


Scott
Hey Scott I really appreciate it!!! I will mess around with it and see what I come up with and then update with the info you stated. Thanks again!!!



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Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2017, 09:38:00 pm »
Ok guys, there was stuff mapped to the INC and DEC. I removed them and have it listed as NONE now. I am doing all this through the tab key in game for player one general controls.

Do I need to go through each player setting and make sure there is nothing mapped to INC and DEC?

After clearing the INC and DEC for player one I restarted the game and it still freezes.

The game can go through 10 frames and then it will freeze 5 frames in on the next game. It's just all over the place. I actually played 5 games and it never happened. It seems that if I move the trackball erratically it will make it happen but it seems that the ball has to cross the line and go in full motion, then at the next frame it will be frozen. I seem to be able to move the ball left and right, back and forth and it won't happen! Only when it crosses the fowl line. 

I've changed the USB cables, and have tried different USB inputs.

I'm wondering if this is a hardware issue with voltage variables where the other games can handle it but WCB can't.

I am running Mameuifx64 .168

Trackball - Happs

Windows 7

Pinball X

Rom - WCBOWL 1.66 and WCBOWLFXDX 2.00

THANK YOU!!!!


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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2017, 12:09:14 am »
Ok guys, there was stuff mapped to the INC and DEC. I removed them and have it listed as NONE now. I am doing all this through the tab key in game for player one general controls.

Do I need to go through each player setting and make sure there is nothing mapped to INC and DEC?
Instead of changing settings in "Input (general)", you should change them in "Input (this game)" so it doesn't mess with other games where you might need them.

You can return a setting that you changed to default by pressing Enter, Esc (sets to none), Enter, Esc. (returns to default)

Clearing the "Inc" and "Dec" settings makes a difference with actual analog (potentiometer) controls because the MAME input system tries to use digital (microswitch) controls to simulate analog controls since few people have/use actual analog controls.

Clearing the "Inc" and "Dec" settings prevents MAME from applying the digital to analog simulations like auto-centering to the absolute position reported by the analog encoder.

I've never seen the "Inc" and "Dec" settings interfere with optical controls unless someone bumped the joystick -- then it just adds the joystick input to the optical input and moves the mouse cursor accordingly. (like you observed when you used a joystick in WCB)

I'm wondering if this is a hardware issue with voltage variables where the other games can handle it but WCB can't.
No.  Optical controls like spinners and trackballs are not actual analog controls.

Optical encoders translate quadrature waveform (logic high/low) transitions to relative changes to the mouse position -- each transition = 1 step right/left or up/down.

This quadrature waveform shows what you would see on the data lines (A and B) when you slowly turn the axis clockwise.



I am running Mameuifx64 .168
Works fine in MAMEUIFX 0.152.   :dunno

Trackball - Happs
Just to be clear, I'm not asking if the trackball is made by Happ, I'm asking if the optical encoder is made by Happ.

Happ trackball without optical (mouse) encoder, outputs quadrature waveforms via Molex to a separate encoder.



Happ trackball with optical (mouse) encoder (green board, barely visible on the far right -- full pic below), connects via PS/2 or USB.



IIRC some people using Happ brand encoders like this one have had problems -- you may want to search for related threads on them.




Scott

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2017, 07:34:32 am »
Wow Scott!!! Thank you for taking the time to break that down!!! I really appreciate that!!!

I do have the trackball with those exact green boards and USB connection. There isn't a wire harness like the one in the picture however; just the USB cable and power cable for the light.

So here is something I left out of my original post because I didn't want people to automatically assume that it was a hardware issue. I actually completely switched out my control panel with a new one to make it a six button instead of a three. Prior to this I've never noticed this happen. But when I switched the panel the new trackball was not scrolling as good and I had to really play with it to get it right. So I was really focusing on the trackball games which may have let me see the problem where before I just never played the trackball games enough to notice.

I've switched the two trackballs out multiple times and it happens on both of them. I've also switched the USB cables.

I will look into the issues people have had with these boards.

Thank you again everyone!!

And thank you Scott for explaining everything in such great detail!!!!


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Spotlight Displays

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2017, 11:44:13 am »
I've noticed that there is a wcb ini file in the Mame ini folder. There is maybe 3 other games that have an ini file and that's it. I cut and pasted the WCB ini file out of that folder and onto the desktop so I could put it back. I tried the game without the ini file and it still worked and it still froze.

I was also able to get the trackball to freeze behind the foul line in the game by moving it radically.


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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2017, 05:40:08 pm »
Well it's happening to centipede too!!!


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Spotlight Displays

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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2017, 08:57:11 pm »
Ok it's not the games. I was on the computer home screen and I started using the trackball to move the pointer. I moved it all over the screen and I heard the sound like when you plug a USB Device in. I kept moving the pointer and noticed it pause for a second and then heard the sound.

The cable is not disconnecting from the USB port.

The strange thing is if I swap the trackball out with the other one the same thing happens. Are bother trackballs bad? Or is it the drivers?

Thanks!!!


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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2017, 10:29:57 pm »
Fixed(I Think)!!!!

I went into device manager and found some unknown devices and deleted them. I also followed the below instructions I found. Not sure which fixed it unfortunately!

Something I don't like happening is one of the things I deleted that was showing up under unknown devices showed back up when I restarted the computer. It is named "Universal Serial Bus controllers" it says that there is no device driver for it. Everything seems to be working so not sure what that is.

Hopefully this can help others if they run into this problem!

Thank you very much everyone for your help!!!!!

If you're experiencing mouse lockups or failures, it may be because your computer is automatically turning off the power to a USB Root Hub.

Go to your Control Panel > System > Hardware tab > and click on the "Device Manager" button.
In the Device Manager window, find the item or items labeled "Universal Serial Bus controllers." Open it, and double-click the first item called "USB Root Hub."
In the USB Root Hub Properties dialog, click on the "Power Management" tab.
"Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power" is checked by default. Uncheck this box, and click "OK."


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Re: Trackball freezing on WCB and Shuffleshot
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2017, 05:08:26 pm »
Well I thought that I had it fixed but I didn't!

I now have it fixed for sure!

The trackball doesn't have the ground wires hooked up. The control board for buttons was right next to the trackball and touching the copper plating that is on the screws which collects static electricity buildup from spinning the trackball. It was discharging into the board.

I moved the board and everything works perfect and has been for a while now.

Hope this helps somebody down the road and thank you!!!


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