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patrickl:
Randy,

I was also trying to be polite about it when you went on to explain the details behind the CMYK conversion proces. Though, in reality who cares what's behind it. It's the result that interests us (or at least me). Your explanation just confuses things unnecessarily.

The end result is that if you make up your artwork in RGB it won't come out looking exactly the same in print. That's just what the gamut warnings are about in drawing programs.

You can think up all the circumstances that could prevent this, but in practice regular users won't do this. That's basically why I asked if this was the case and I indeed did leave out the technical mumbo jumbo so as to not overly confuse things.
patrickl:

--- Quote from: kevsteele on February 09, 2004, 11:32:04 am ---Patrickl,

The RGB to CYMK conversion problem is exactly what I think happened to the "washed out" print.

The ClassicArcadeGraphix site specifically recommends sending any custom graphics to them in Photoshop CYMK format. They can convert them from RGB format, but do warn of color changes.

I think you nailed it on the head.

Kevin

--- End quote ---
Kevin,

Yes that's what stuck in my mind too. They do warn about the CMYK conversion. I thought they said you should send in in RGB though, but that you should check for the CMYK result too. I forgot about it but yesterday I was working on some vecotrizing and then I remembered this thread and what happened to me the first time I downloaded a bit of Galaga artwork from Mametrix. At that time I had exactly the same of: "Damn this looks washed out". As it happens my drawing program had (wrongly) opened it in CMYK instead of RGB.
RandyT:

--- Quote from: patrickl on February 09, 2004, 12:02:30 pm ---Randy,

I was also trying to be polite about it when you went on to explain the details behind the CMYK conversion proces. Though, in reality who cares what's behind it. It's the result that interests us (or at least me). Your explanation just confuses things unnecessarily.

The end result is that if you make up your artwork in RGB it won't come out looking exactly the same in print. That's just what the gamut warnings are about in drawing programs.

You can think up all the circumstances that could prevent this, but in practice regular users won't do this. That's basically why I asked if this was the case and I indeed did leave out the technical mumbo jumbo so as to not overly confuse things.

--- End quote ---

*sigh*

Patrick, this is not technical "mumbo-jumbo".  It is important info that you should read if you wish to understand what is at play here.  The statement you just made about the warnings tells me that you didn't read what I wrote, or you still don't understand it.

Those warnings are based on the the CMYK profile you have active at the time, and the profile is based on the color gamut of the output device.  Change the profile, and the warnings in the drawing programs change.  There is no "one-size-fits-all" solution.

RandyT
patrickl:

--- Quote from: RandyT on February 09, 2004, 12:09:44 pm ---The statement you just made about the warnings tells me that you didn't read what I wrote
--- End quote ---
I do understand (I don't need your quotes from the "Printing for dummies" handbook to explain), but all I could see was a lot of quotes like "if you do it this way" and "if the printer works like that" or "if you use spot colors". Too many if's that didn't apply so then I skipped. Besides I tried to keep it to a simple question wich was about the case at hand and not about some theoretical situation that "could be". I understand you can create a situations were color conversions are not an issue, but I doubt the people posting here are using completely calibrated studios to do their work in.



Anyway, if anyone who made a print is still reading this thread then I hope they can still find it in their heart to answer. Especially since the print I saw pictures of uses a lot of pure blue which are sure to be hard to print on a normal CMYK printer.
RandyT:

--- Quote from: patrickl on February 09, 2004, 04:54:46 pm ---Besides I tried to keep it to a simple question wich was about the case at hand and not about some theoretical situation that "could be". I understand you can create a situations were color conversions are not an issue, but I doubt the people posting here are using completely calibrated studios to do their work in.

--- End quote ---

This is not "theory", this is actually how these things work.  At least it's what I've experienced first hand owning and using large format printers over the last 10 years.  But I guess it is possible that I've been doing it wrong all this time.

Ok, let me summarize for those who don't wish to learn anything about the process or difficulties one will encounter when trying to get a good reproduction of their work:

1: CMYK means nothing by itself.  Working in CMYK will NOT guarantee a better result.

2:  Ask the printshop which color standard their equipment is calibrated to.  If they don't know, find a different printshop.

3: Unless your monitor is of reasonably high quality and properly calibrated, you will never have a clue whether the print you received was done improperly.  Basic calibration does not require a controlled studio, just a little care and knowledge on your part.

4: Look at the picture of the 2 panel prints side by side, you'll see one is blue and the other is purple.  This is not a CMYK conversion issue.  But if you re-read my post, you''ll most likely be able to figure out some possible cause to the problem...

5: If this seems like too much for you to concern yourself with, just pay the $40 and cross your fingers.  Just try not to be too hard on the guy when you don't get what you expected. :)

RandyT

(BTW, where can I get a copy of this book you speak of?  :D)
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