Wannabe vertical candy cab project (WVCC)

[arcadeswede]

Hi everyone!

This is an old project that was once finished, modified and then it died. Now I'm on it again and with some gained experince during the time away from the build, I'm looking forward to get it done this time. Since I moved away from my hometown in 2010 (and the cause why I didn't finished it) this cab has been at my brothers place. Now, me and my family have an apartment big enough for this cab to fit.

Here's some pictures if you want to see the build process of the cab from 2011: https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B5bps08cRR5lY3cxU0xlUW9YeVU&usp=sharing

So the point with this thread is to share the build process that I'm currently doing and to get feedback and opinions from you guys. I did a lot of changes 2015 with this cab so it feels like it's a new project. The cab is going to be JAMMA-compatible but will also have a mame computer connected to a J-PAC as a "standard". The goal is to kinda make it look like a candy cab and I've always liked shmups, so the Hantarex Polo Star 28" monitor that I have is going to be mounted vertically. A dedicated shmup cab!

Check out my ongoing list of shmups and feel free to recommend games I've missed: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OReBkvLkJ0JzYknpj0wx9ON2us-aKC9YvqQPDX729zk/edit?usp=sharing



To-do list:

• Lower the cab by cutting the bottom. DONE!
• Recut the sides of the CP smaller. DONE!
• Make a chair. DONE!
• Install the monitor (vertically). DONE!
• Format PC, install Windows XP/7, Install GroovyMame, CRT Emudrivers, Mala, Hide Windows. In progress
• Create a rig for the motherboard, PSU, HDD and graphics card and mount it inside the cab
• Fix and repaint bad spots
• Order/mount coin mech
• Order/install J-PAC
• Order new buttons and redo the wiring
• Redo controlpanel
• Order a piece of plexiglas to frame the monitor
• Spraypaint plexiglas, make a square for the monitor.
• Mount lights for marquee. DONE!
• Install speakers. DONE!

[emphatic]

Nice!  Are you a member of arkadtorget.se by any chance?

[arcadeswede]

Nice!  Are you a member of arkadtorget.se by any chance?

Actually, yes!
But I'm not very active there.

[matsadona]

This forum needs more AT Swedes 

[arcadeswede]

I managed to settle on using Windows XP 64bit for the MAME-PC. I'm thinking about using Win 7 since the new version of CRT Emudriver.  Maybe I change the OS later, this is just for testing the monitor in 15khz With CRT Emudriver by Calamity.


The day after I got everything working the graphics card in my PC died. I had to do some troubleshooting but a good friend of mine hooked me up with a another compatible graphics card so it was good to go in no time. I only had to pay $5 for the shipping



After that I did some tests, followed the guide "GroovyMame for Dummies" that I found and managed to get an awesome picture. I adjusted the picture with the pots on the back of the monitor and I'm pretty happy with the results.


Next step is to configure and create a layout for Mala and get videos working maybe.

[Malenko]

Lets just get the tiny negative out of the way , why 6 buttons (spaced that face apart) for a vertical cab?


Anyways, that monitor looks down right amazing and I love DoDonPachi. I like the look, it does look like a candy on steroids , very unique and very different. So happy to see a proportionate control panel too. Hva you decided on an art theme?

[arcadeswede]

Lets just get the tiny negative out of the way , why 6 buttons (spaced that face apart) for a vertical cab?

Thanks man!
You're right, the button layout is terrible but it's the old CP from way back when this cab was a stand up with a horizontal TV inside. I didn't really know what I was doing back then so the CP is getting remade. It even has buttons for save state and some other crap, embarrassing

I guess I need 3-4 buttons for vertical games? Or does a shmup games and such ever go above 3 buttons? Please comment on that.

Better put that in my to-do list. Thanks for the input!

I'm thinking about maybe put some kind of Storm Trooper/Star Wars art on it and my girlfriend is very optimistic about that (she loves SW) But we'll see, I kinda like it clean.

[Malenko]

I guess I need 3-4 buttons for vertical games? Or does a shmup games and such ever go above 3 buttons? Please comment on that.

Most 3, some 4; a few do use more than 4 but arent worth the extra buttons to me. I am making a vertical bartop and my first panel had 3 buttons, my second try at a panel has 4 (plus start and coin)
(the 2nd panel is just sitting against the screen to show both at the same time)

[arcadeswede]

Sweet bartop!  Looks familiar
I guess 4 action buttons is enough then. Then of course, start, coin and such.

[emphatic]

I would recommend a 6 button SEGA layout, but skip two buttons on the right in the bottom row. All your really need is 4 buttons unless you plan on playing the US version of Daioh. Check out the proper layouts here: http://slagcoin.com/joystick/layout.html

[BadMouth]

I would recommend a 6 button SEGA layout, but skip two buttons on the right in the bottom row.

+1

After building my cab and using it for a while, I found that for 4 button games I really prefer to use three on the top row and the first button in the second row with my thumb for the 4th button.  It's much more comfortable than trying to hit a 4th button in the same row with your pinky or moving a different finger over or down to cover multiple buttons. 
I have a Neo Geo themed cab, so it's designed with the 4 in a row layout....and now I don't use it that way. 

After building some trial panels, I settled on the Player 2 SEGA layout for both players (plus an extra 7th button in the top row for new geo games, which I no longer use)
I also have the buttons so close together that the nuts on the back touch.  An extra bonus of that is that they stay perfectly spaced.

[arcadeswede]

That website includes so much great information. I need to read it all sometime.

Yeah, I'm comfortable with 4 buttons to play with. I couldn't find the SEGA version but maybe I should go with the Astro City layout?

What do you guys think?

[emphatic]

I couldn't find the SEGA version but maybe I should go with the Astro City layout?

Sorry, that's what I meant. 

Protip: Print out the layouts you think are good and overlay your hand on top of the paper to "feel it out".

Here's a shot of my TAITO EGRET II 1 player panel (using a TAITO layout that is similar to ASTRO CITY):

[harveybirdman]

Just popping in to say DDP on that monitor looks absolutely tits.

[arcadeswede]

Sorry, that's what I meant. 

No, I'm the n00b here Astro City was made by SEGA. Blame me for being stupid

That layout SEGA layout looks like a winner! I will try your protip, that's a really good idea

Oh man, you got a Taito EGRET II?
Jealouuuuuuuus!

Just popping in to say DDP on that monitor looks absolutely tits.

Thanks!
It's a little too big maybe but it actually fits perfect vertically, I was lucky that I built the cab big enough back in 2011.

[emphatic]

Oh man, you got a Taito EGRET II?
Jealouuuuuuuus!

I have two. 

[arcadeswede]

I have two. 

That's not fair

[arcadeswede]

Started making my new layout in Mala. I like it simple and not too many things going on in my front end. I did a list and linked snapshots that shows up behind each title.



I need to turn down the opacity on the snaps so the text is easier to read and I'm also thinking about adding videos. I haven't figured out how to get other video formats to work except .avi-files though. I have installed DivX and the K-Lite Codec Pack but only AVI files work.

Also, it feels like my Malas resolution (320x240) is blurry. Small text becomes blurry and very hard to read but text in games with the same resolution is so much clearer. Is Mala really the best choice for a 320x240 resolution?

[harveybirdman]

  for getting that working in Mala, I tried years ago to get a similar effect, and gave up before it even looked remotely as good as yours!

The lack of ongoing support for Mala makes it a dubious choice these days, but I don't know the answer to your question.

[arcadeswede]

I've made this mistake before. I get to picky about the front end and layout. In the end, it doesn't really matter if you're not planning to introduce games to other people, then snaps and videos are great so they can see what the games are like.

Hmm, maybe I settle with this for now. It looks pretty good actually. I would like to get videos working though (other than AVI files).

To be continued...

[Malenko]

I like the front end as you have it now. Videos are a nice bit of icing, but I like the layout you have there. Screenshots taking up the entire background is genius. 

[BadMouth]

The last official Mala release (174) only supports avi.  Make sure you have the latest beta, as it supports mp4.

If you're already using the latest, then it is probably a codec issue.

[harveybirdman]

We need to work on your gameslist, you're a little Cave heavy   


Some suggestions that I see missing in the displayed portion of your list.


19XX
Aero Fighters Special
Armed Police Batrider
Bastsugun (Special Version)
Battle Bakraid
Brave Blade
Cybattler
Cyvern
Dimahoo
Fighting Hawk
Final Star Force
Fire Barrel
Fire Shark
Gun & Frontier
Hotdog Storm
Macross Plus

[emphatic]

Nice layout. I really dig the font. Would it be possible to just add a thin, black outline to it? 

Edit: It would be cool I guess to have the LOGO displayed at the top of the screen above the list, if you have a pack of them. Also, nevermind video support, too many people just sit there and browse games instead of actually enjoying them. Don't miss out on OutZone for your gamelist.

[arcadeswede]

The last official Mala release (174) only supports avi.  Make sure you have the latest beta, as it supports mp4.

That worked!
Finally got .mp4's to show up in Mala. Video coming soon.

[arcadeswede]

We need to work on your gameslist, you're a little Cave heavy   

Yeah I know  This list is just for testing although it's very Cave:ish  I have a list of games I will add but I'll focus on getting my front end done first.
Here's my current list: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yh6yeHS81lcCli4jnwzKxfZ9iwON5vMQLUhSCOWIp74/edit?usp=sharing

Suggested games added 

Nice layout. I really dig the font. Would it be possible to just add a thin, black outline to it? 

Edit: It would be cool I guess to have the LOGO displayed at the top of the screen above the list, if you have a pack of them. Also, nevermind video support, too many people just sit there and browse games instead of actually enjoying them. Don't miss out on OutZone for your gamelist.

That could work but also look very cartoonish. It will definitely make the text pop out from the background but I've added a black 40% transparent layer above the snaps so the text doesn't get confused with the background snaps that much.

I agree, but if a game doesn't have a titel logo I'll have to make something in photoshop and that could be very time consuming. It would look great though.

OutZone added   


Thanks to BadMouth I finally got videos working.
It's nice to have them but it's also a pain in the ham to add them all.

Here's my two current layouts that shows fullscreen and windowed videos. Which one do you prefer?

[matsadona]

Don't listen to the others - the only games you need is Tiger Heli and Twin Cobra

[harveybirdman]

If you're going to do the video, I like the windowed but since it must go on top in the Mala Layouts I'd shrink it to the top right so it doesn't interrupt your game list.

[harveybirdman]

Don't listen to the others - the only games you need is Tiger Heli and Twin Cobra

He's got Twin Cobra on his list, he knows what's up.

I thought I was the only person that even knew Silver Millennium existed.  You're still missing some good games, Rayforce and Raiden II for starters (assuming your mame version supports it)

[arcadeswede]

If you're going to do the video, I like the windowed but since it must go on top in the Mala Layouts I'd shrink it to the top right so it doesn't interrupt your game list.

Yeah, that could work!
I will try that next time but I finally decided to go with Windows 7 x64 since it's more "future proof". Then Mala config starts for real.

Suggested games added

[Malenko]

no Galaga? 

[emphatic]

no Galaga? 

I agree, but even better would be to add the Namco Classic Collection Vol.1 so Galaga Arrange is included. It's wild. 

I prefer just having the full screen screenshot in the background and no video preview, but that's just me.

[arcadeswede]

I prefer just having the full screen screenshot in the background and no video preview, but that's just me.

You know what, I agree. Yesterday I spent maybe two hours just trying to collect the games on my list. It will take forever to create videos for every game. The videos doesn't even fit perfect in my layout and like having just a list, I'm a list kinda guy, I like it clean 

It's also easier to find or create screenshots. You just hit F12 and BOOM, you're done. I'm thinking about placing the ship to the right then hit F12. That way the ship/character isn't behind the text and will probably look better in Mala.

[arcadeswede]

So, a little update!
Swapped out the HDD to a bigger 750GB HDD and installed Win 7 on it, along with super resolutions. Switching from different resolutions is much smoother now and games displays perfect.



I also recalibrated the monitor and found out that it was too dark. I adjusted the brightness, contrast and was able to see more details in dark areas. Now the snapshots in Mala looks even better! So I did some F12'in and grabbed some snapshots from the games in my list, added a black layer with 50% opacity on all the snaps and now Mala starting to look pretty good. I skipped videos, it's just too much work.

 
I'm pretty happy with the layout in Mala and it works great BUT now I have some kind of slowmotion/audio stutter problem? I think this is because of the super resolutions and I didn't experience this before. For example, DoDonPachi says: "Countdown begins, three, TWO, one, GO!". The words in CAPS are in slowmo so it's not constant slowmotion, it's like a wave, slowmotion comes and goes. I haven't checked if my CPU is maxed out yet and I read about using frame_delay (I have it disabled) can cause audio stuttering if you don't have a good enough graphics card. So I'm starting to think it the graphics card after all. I need to do some more troubleshooting.

If you guys have any ideas, please let me know!

EDIT: Added a link to my gamelist in the main post. Feel free to recommend some games I've missed.

[Malenko]

Do you have multi-threadding on?

I'll be using your list and the one from the All killer no filler list as a base ( http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,149578.0.html ) You should give some input over there too

[harveybirdman]

Any reason you're not compiling your own MAME?  You can turn off those nag screens ya know.

Looking really good man, I'm super jealous.  Sometimes I questions going original hardware only in the scope of my project.

[arcadeswede]

Do you have multi-threadding on?

I'll be using your list and the one from the All killer no filler list as a base ( http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,149578.0.html ) You should give some input over there too

Yes, multithreading is on.

Yeah, BadMouth PM'd me and linked me to it.
This project is my introduction to learn, play and understand shmups so my input may not be that valuable I'm afraid, since I don't have enough experience.

Any reason you're not compiling your own MAME?  You can turn off those nag screens ya know.

Looking really good man, I'm super jealous.  Sometimes I questions going original hardware only in the scope of my project.

I'm using GroovyMame and got everything I need. I just left it on to make sure mame/switchres picked the correct resolution. I'll disable it when the software part is finished
Your project looks awesome! I really like the PCB rack. Nice work!

[emphatic]

MALA layout looks great. It would be really nice if you would share the layout when you're done. BTW, what monitor is that? I've made a calibration guide for NANAO MS9 (the Rolls Royce of 15kHz monitors) here: http://www.emphatic.se/?p=710 but it's relevant if you have any arcade monitor really.

[arcadeswede]

Thanks!
Sure, that's the least I can do for all the help I've been getting from the BYOAC forums over the years.

I have a Hantarex Polo Star 28" monitor. I'm using the Generic 15Hz option in VMMaker and it looks really nice. I don't understand how to create custom modelines and all that so this will do and the picture is actually perfectly aligned.

Nice guide! I'll look into it.

EDIT: I forgot to mention! The audio slowmotion/stuttering is gone. I think the CPU was too hot yesterday because I've unplugged the chassie fans temporarily, but today when I tried somes games the sound problem was gone and CPU usage was around 40% WITH frame_delay enabled. Sweet! Need to get a simple watercooler for the CPU because that fan is noisy.

[Malenko]

Name suggestion:  The Candy Store

cause its all the candy you'll ever need!