Main Restorations Software Audio/Jukebox/MP3 Everything Else Buy/Sell/Trade
Project Announcements Monitor/Video GroovyMAME Merit/JVL Touchscreen Meet Up Retail Vendors
Driving & Racing Woodworking Software Support Forums Consoles Project Arcade Reviews
Automated Projects Artwork Frontend Support Forums Pinball Forum Discussion Old Boards
Raspberry Pi & Dev Board controls.dat Linux Miscellaneous Arcade Wiki Discussion Old Archives
Site News

Unread posts | New Replies | Recent posts | Rules | Chatroom | Wiki | File Repository | RSS | Submit news


  

Author Topic: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP  (Read 21480 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« on: August 03, 2014, 08:44:24 pm »
This forum is great because it is built on those ideas that just won't go away.  Those infatuations and flights of fancy that after some elbow grease and too much time and money finally, usually, become reality.  Man oh man, I got hit with a flight of fancy about a year ago and it just hasn't let go. 

Enough waxing poetic. 

Along with the help of IDS and EDS1275 I'm building an Ice Cold Beer homage I'm calling, "Space Base".  We've been working on it off and on for over a year, in near secrecy.  To be honest we thought we'd be done by now but life, thousands of collective miles between all of us, project hurdles to be overcome, and everything else tends to slow things down.  We aren't done, but a lot of the hard work is done and we'll be moving forward on this.  It is time to get it out into the light, get some feedback, and make this a true community project.  In the beginning I had ideations of selling this as a kit but now I'll just be happy to get a complete parts list, art download, cut plans, and program/music downloads out into the community so anybody can make their own. 

First off and most importantly:  The starting crew <cue boats-n-hoes montage>.

Chuckles - fabrication, basic mechanics, art (big thanks to Jake Nealis for the Space Gal art)
IDS - electronics, software and hardware
eds1275 - music, sound effects, voice acting (big thanks to his actress)
possibly you! - we're looking for good ideas, feedback, and whatever else

So how far are we?  Well, if I had to put a number on it I'd say we're at about 42.  Art is going good, music and sound effects are going great, software and hardware are going good, cab construction will be underway soon once I finalize a few things on the inner workings of the playfield.  The basics behind operation:  Mag switches in target holes and the return hole provide feedback on ball location.  Servos run the pulley system.  A small processing unit runs the LEDs, sounds, and monitors everything against game logic that we distilled from ICB.  But let's be honest, you're here to see stuff.  On to the pics!!!

 
This is the bezel, all art is done in a mix of solid and half tones for all foreground images and the background starfield is still a wip.  Well everything is a wip but this seems to be working out pretty well.


Now with the PF, note that there will be an inch gap to allow the bar movement between the two planes.  Why yes, space gal is a different color, which do you prefer?


CPO, which will be a wrap around. 


This is like PF v.II I think but it's starting to get there


Closer in all the ball return mech

http://vid479.photobucket.com/albums/rr155/vonjett/Space%20Base/MagSwitchTest_zps0e87d90c.mp4
Video showing the mag switches in action.


Mag switch activated


Mag switch proximity test.  Mag switches allow us to forego a complicated ball return system of chutes and just use in-hole monitoring.  More on all that later. 

I'll let eds1275 and IDS jump in when they're ready with info on their parts of the build but I'll tell you, the music and sfx are out of this world and IDS has come up with some great game modes and is doing remarkable things with segment displays and LEDs.  It's all pretty much amazeballs.  It's not going fast, but it's going.  Whatchya thing?

wp34

  • Trade Count: (+3)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4007
  • 8 Bit...16 Shy
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2014, 09:54:12 pm »
Just when you think you have seen it all.  What an original idea.  I love that this is a team effort as well.     :cheers:

thatpurplestuff

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 547
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2014, 10:36:46 pm »
Holy crap that is incredible!  Ever since I saw Ice Cold Beer years ago I've wondered if it would even be possible to build one at home.  I love the idea, I love the art, I just love it!

Would love it even more if you guys released info on how others can build one after you're done!

So once again, we find that evil of the past seeps into the present like salad dressing through cheap wax paper, mixing memory and desire.

yotsuya

  • Trade Count: (+21)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17847
  • 2014 UCA Winner, 2014, 2015, 2016 ZapCon Winner
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1420628.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2014, 11:45:19 pm »
Finally announced it, huh? Kudos!  :cheers:
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

ids

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 692
  • Fighter Captured
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2014, 12:59:24 am »
Finally announced it, huh? Kudos!  :cheers:

I suspect it may have been announced earlier if not for my slacking on the software side.  It was not for a lack of trying, however, I just got buried in the paying type of work, which has forced my to slow down on a number of priority projects such as this  :(.  This is also some challenging stuff; mapping a VERY large number of I/O pins onto a microcontroller, serious sound requirements, hi-score table, certain degree of configurability, whilst keeping costs reasonable, etc.   I'll post more info about my contributions when there is something post-worthy (code does not make for great pics)

I've got to say though, thx Le Chuck, cuz this is a really cool project and I'm thrilled to be a part in it.  And it seems we have the answer to life, the universe, and everything if:
we're at about 42

BobA

  • Trade Count: (+14)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5943
  • What Me Worry?
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2014, 03:02:41 am »
Great to see a brand new type of project.  Looks like alot of hard work and more to go.  Congrats on your inovation.  :cheers: :cheers:

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2014, 08:25:44 am »
Would love it even more if you guys released info on how others can build one after you're done!

Well that's kind of the idea lol.  To that end I do need one more contributor who is willing to do toolpaths for everything based on the final design, either that or everyone will have to put up with my horribly not to scale drawings and odd liner notes to get their own (Rick, Haru, you CNC guys, I'm looking at you). Once complete first post will be updated with all links, parts lists, and everything else you need to roll yer own.

I know IDS has been looking at custom board production being an option as well for the display and to manage the ever growing rats nest of wires this bad boy is turning out to be.

We kind of embrassed a degree of feature creep early on because if you're taking the time to a project like this it makes sense to do some updates while you're building from scratch.  Multicolored LEDs, alphanumeric displays, high quality audio, stuff like that has created a lot for IDS to work through all while trying to find a solution that can be replicated by the midranged to advanced BYOAC'r with a parts list AND keep costs reasonable.  To say it isn't easy is an understatement. 

@BobA, Yot, WP34 - Thanks guys, we'll keep plugging away and hopefully open up a new area to be explored. 

Attached at the base of this post is the current google doc we've been working on together.  There's a bit of inside baseball with some of it but it'll give those who want to follow along closely a road map for where we're going with game play and features.  IDS in red and I'm in blue for liner notes. 


Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2014, 10:12:05 am »
That is cool.

Is it the same hole pattern as Ice Cold Beer?  Or would you rather not say?

Super awesome!  Can't wait for a parts list.  As far as CNC'ing, this main backboard should be the only thing we need? 

Looking forward to a parts and price list.  Good show!

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2014, 10:38:24 am »
That is cool.

Is it the same hole pattern as Ice Cold Beer?  Or would you rather not say?

Super awesome!  Can't wait for a parts list.  As far as CNC'ing, this main backboard should be the only thing we need? 

Looking forward to a parts and price list.  Good show!

I don't think it's a perfect hole for hole copy but yes, it's based on the ICB pattern and is a pretty close match.  Not really worried about that similiarity tho since everything else is such a departure.  I varied the hole sizes as I think some models did - so that way not all out holes are just gapingly huge. 

The playfield I would like CNC'd because there is a lot of wire routing that needs to be done and once I do the final I'll probably never want to do another one again haha.  Ideally the whole build will get the cut plan treatement just to make things nice.  At a minimum tho I definetly will get the playfield and ball return box done.  From there you could stick the unit in about anything you want and still get a functional unit.   

Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2014, 11:54:08 am »
This looks cool, I'm excited for you guys.  Next up: Peggle!  Or how about pachinko?


pbj

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7613
  • Obey.
    • The Chris Burke Band
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2014, 12:08:45 pm »
I'm not real fond of the cheesecake aspect to the artwork and I think it detracts from the overall appeal, but to each his own.  Are you planning on having the playfield screened or doing decals?

Mag switches are a neat idea.

Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2014, 12:38:53 pm »
I could do without the space lady.  Not that I'm a prude, but I don't want to explain space boobs to my 8 and 9 year old daughters.   I'm sure that could be edited out of the graphics file.

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2014, 01:19:23 pm »
1) It's not like she's topless
B) Sure, I'll do a version without the space gal - no worries there.  If anybody has any cool space ship art that they drew or have rights to AND it goes with the theme I can see about adding it to give some variety. 

For those who like Space Gal, I'll be doing a side art panel as well with her as a center piece.  To note:  yes she is just some fun retro styled eye candy but she also fits into the back story of the game to wit; the pilot is trying to reach her and it is her voice that is guiding the pilot on his journey through the worm holes.  You see, her space station is running out of oxygen and you have to get them resupplied or she'll die. 

Once eds1275 pops up on here and uploads some of this awesome sounds it'll perhaps tie it together more thematically for everyone.  Or not.  Dunno.  Either way I'll do a gal-less version for the homebrewers who aren't feeling her. 

As to the surface treatment, PBJ, I'm planning right now on vinyl but I'll be having it all done through a local sign shop that I deal with (they do all of University of Auburn's commercial work) and they'll hopefully have some robust solutions for me.  If they can do a print and it won't cost me a boat payment I'll do that - but not for the prototype.  The prototype will be lucky to get a laminated graphic from kinkos.  ;)

If anybody has any other ideas for the art or other design elements keep'em coming.  I think the art is a good start but I know there is room for improvement. 

eds1275

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2036
  • Rock and Roll!
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2014, 02:23:36 pm »
I'm not saying anything.

j/k. Yeah we had a lot of ideas for the audio, from incoming radio transmissions to the captain of the ship talking to the player but in the end it was the female computer voice that we ended up on. She has a sultry way of saying things. The voice actor's name is Jennifer, and she is part of the local film group I am an administrator of. She helps out on a lot of my projects both audio only and film. Unfortunately next month she is moving to the southern part of the island we live on which is about 2 hours away.

For the music I was out of my comfort zone. Usually I do more rock, funk, bluesy stuff but the main track came together really fast. Like 2 days or something and then I ended up just cutting the ending off (it actually at one point had an ending) so that it loops seamlessly. I am really proud of the main gameplay tune. Unfortunately, writing the other stuff has been much more difficult because I am trying to match the quality and make it fit together. I am not 100% satisfied with the stuff I have, but I do have an attract mode sort of spacey noise. We had some serious restrictions on audio that have been ironed out, so at least it isn't low bit and sample rate. Writing the music and then chopping the quality down was really sad for me. I don't have anything with me to upload but I will slap together a compressed audio file and post it for anyone who wants to hear when I return home.

For those that care, I'm using pro tools 11, a roland ready strat with GK-3 midi pickup, a roland midi controller keyboard, and mostly samples from my software and soft synths. I programmed some more complicated drums but the basic beats really just fit better.

yotsuya

  • Trade Count: (+21)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17847
  • 2014 UCA Winner, 2014, 2015, 2016 ZapCon Winner
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1420628.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2014, 02:55:01 pm »
I think the "cheesecake" factor fits in perfectly (seen the sideart on Ice Cold Beer?). Good work!
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

eds1275

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2036
  • Rock and Roll!
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2014, 03:11:06 pm »
I think the woman art is tasteful and non-offensive, and the holes fit in with a holey-asteroid look.

pbj

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7613
  • Obey.
    • The Chris Burke Band
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2014, 04:17:14 pm »
So, that's a cool idea with the timer and trying to save the suffocating astronaut and all that, and it sounds like the voice calls will reflect things like that rather than, "don't get your balls in the wrong hole" and that kind of nonsense.  All a good thing.

But does the depiction of the sexy space woman really fit?

I think it'd be more along the lines of this:


Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2014, 04:21:08 pm »
:droid:

I was preparing for a space nuns in space them. But since you offered an edit without the space lady, I don't have to do any work ( 8)  like I was anyway ;) )

I am super excited to see a video with the different modes to it.  Seems like you guys went the extra mile.  From what I saw on youtube ICB was limitied.

I think the art is fine.  With the history of the site, I don't know why you didn't go for Ond's Raygun, that would have been a nice easter egg.

Again, :I don't want to want to explain space boobs to my daughters: 
Whilst its not the problem of anyone here, I politely registered my opinion and an option was made.  Whereas if I had been an ass about it, I would have probably been told to I could do without.
 
Louis CK bit about talking to your own kids **language warning***Its your kid

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2014, 06:21:22 pm »
Taking Space Gal out is a single button click as shes a smart object in the photoshop file (which is close to a gig in size as is) and requires no additional editing so it's not like it's an effort for me to do that.  If it was I'd just politely ask those that don't like her to take a long walk off a short space port ;)

Seriously tho, I like her and I like the vibe she adds but understand that others might not.  While I'm more than willing to post up a final set without her much more importantly I would hope that once this is done those that are building their own would feel free to do their own themes, a little art and some downloaded sounds and you'll be good to go.  Sure, it wont be as jaw droppingly awesome as Space Base with its professional sound track and voice overs but it may be.  Besides, I've got a back up theme I've toyed with that is very tongue in cheek risque like PBJ alluded to called "Pitchin' Hay" which is naturally a farmer's daughter theme.  Lots of room for raunch in that one but we will get Space Base all wrapped first. 

@PBJ, I see where you're coming from but I don't think I'll personally go dark with it and stay more on the playful side, but as mentioned, for those that want to follow suit there is room to branch out.  I still think that once you hear the music and the voice cuts that Space Gal will grow on you. 

--break--

I would appreciate some opinions as to color scheme for Space Gal and any of the other graphics.  I think I personnaly prefer the pink but maybe only like 51%.  I had a recommendation to make her a dark skinned woman and redraw the hair - kind of a Lana Kane in college look, but I haven't tried it out yet, a little too much work to make it look right.  I did try out several shades of green for the skin but it didn't feel right. 

Also, the unit itself, my original plan was to make it wall-mount and eliminate all that unneeded cab, or maybe go very thin.  With the way the ball return and switchs and lights work the whole thing will be maybe 4 inches thick from glass to back at its most slimmed down (not counting the CP), but I'm leaning back towards doing a full size cab for two reasons

1) It will look better
2) If I don't do the fullsize I wont have anywhere to stick sideart. 

Thoughts?

Slippyblade

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3137
  • And to the death god we say, "Not today!"
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2014, 06:44:59 pm »
As far as color goes, I've always been a big fan of the "sexy robot" look.  So I'd go with a silver/chrome look on her suit.

Well Fed Games

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1882
  • Delicious!
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2014, 09:10:12 pm »
Never thought ICB/ZP were that interesting, and I know now the theme had something to do with that. This looks great! Can't wait to hear the audio!
Completed projects: Pac bartop (Plug & Play), 30th Anniversary Pac cab (MAME), Point Blank (PS1), Centipede (arcade hardware- light restore), VS. Super Mario Bros (arcade hardware- light restore) Tetris Cocktail (SNES), Arcade Classics upright (60-in-1, then MAME), Multi-Raiden (arcade hardware). Pac Man vs.(Gamecube),

Working on: Pinball Re-theme, Homebrew arcade arena shooter

ids

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 692
  • Fighter Captured
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2014, 10:13:08 pm »
imho, art and audio are great, and i'm glad we came up with a solution that allows for no loss in quality of the audio.

for those interested in the guts:
  • Main logic running on a Freescale KL25Z, using mbed platform
  • Audio being handled by the cheapest solution available - a small cheap external board (a raspberry-pi)
  • Freescale and rpi connected via usb, and use a usb-serial setup to chat to each other
  • Display is a set of 16-segment displays, a row of 5, over a row of similar but with 2nd removed (so, 1 unit, blank, 3 units) - as per artwork above, top-right.  These are multiplexed - cycled in columns; one column is powered at a time, the KL25z sets the segments to display and cycles which column to be powered at a high frequency.  A series of 4 shift registers hold the state of the segments.
  • 10 RGB LED's hide behind each hole that can be used for scoring.  The KL25z simulates PWM by cycling the on-off state as needed.  These are multiplexed as well, to keep pin count down.
  • 10 switches - one for each score hole, tied to a 10/4 priority encoder to reduce pin count
  • Limit switches used to control the extent to which the bar can move - four switches tied to interrups for immediate response
  • Dip switches to control a few configurable items.
  • More config available via a config file stored on the SD card in the r-pi
  • High scores maintained on SD card
  • Servo motors for the bar tied to PWM units on the KL25z
  • "Tilt" sensed by KL25z built in accelerometer
  • High-score input will be like robotron.  Left stick selects letter, right stick accepts
  • etc

This thing requires a lot of I/O pins and is the most complicated microcontroller thing I've done to date to date.

Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2014, 11:23:03 pm »

I think the art is fine.  With the history of the site, I don't know why you didn't go for Ond's Raygun, that would have been a nice easter egg.




yotsuya

  • Trade Count: (+21)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17847
  • 2014 UCA Winner, 2014, 2015, 2016 ZapCon Winner
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1420628.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2014, 11:28:34 pm »
:droid:

Again, :I don't want to want to explain space boobs to my daughters:

The puberty years are going to be Hell for you, bro...
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

Slippyblade

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3137
  • And to the death god we say, "Not today!"
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2014, 11:36:39 pm »
:droid:

Again, :I don't want to want to explain space boobs to my daughters:

The puberty years are going to be Hell for you, bro...

+1  For great justice!

Xiaou2

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3957
  • NOM NOM NOM
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2014, 03:14:35 am »
Huge Props for the recreation.  Im quite interested in the magnetic sensors for sure.  Does the ball have to be magnetic for them to activate?
Cool stuff.

 Ive always liked the Elvira style themed fun/funny/sexy vocals...  but for those with younger kids, I can see it being an issue.  Still, not a fan of the girl art clip.  It doesnt match in the color scheme.   Very out-of-place.  Super saturated .. against dark, desaturated, plain, and somewhat boring backdrop.  Its well drawn.. and I like the half-tone work a lot... but its kind of lifeless in totality.    And while we all know that most of space IS Lifeless... thats never what the focus is when we are thinking about space.. or watching some movie about space.   We are thinking Aliens, Space Craft, Hi Tech, LaZ3r FiR3!  (and woman of course!)   Time Travel,   Black Holes,  Warp Gates,  Wormholes,  and some amazing Captain and Heroic battles...    Not merely docking your balls...err I mean, ship..

   Take a look at Asteroids Deluxe artwork.   Blacklight lit, a lot of zest and interesting things happening:



 ICB is a tough one for art, due to all of the holes.  It limits the possible range considerably..  as well as changes the impact of the art, if not done well in accordance with them.


 Long ago, Id came up with some seriously sick ideas for a game based on ICB..  as at that time,  I was actually considering modifying the original machine.   However, I just restored it, and sold it for a hefty sum.. to get a more closer in funds, to a much more desirable pinball machine...

 It goes well beyond your current cost & output parameters...   Still, Id love to get some made, and pop them on-location...


 Just something to note about Audio...  Have you thought about using an actual digital FM synth engine, such as the DX-7  ?   As the musical complexity and compositions you could create... would take almost no memory up.   And due to the nature of good FM Synth sound.. its pretty much timeless.   I find that FM synths like the Yamaha Dx7,  Yamaha DX7 IID... etc..   have sounds that are so vivid and clear...  that they are almost astounding.   Unlike a low quality sample rip...  which can get grating, sterile...  and sound like poop compared to a good FM Synth.    I think the magic is in the math.  Its like the sound is a mirror of life.  Theres a sort of infinite "Fractal" method of how it works, and how it sounds...  and its somewhat cosmic.  Alive. Perfect.

 Whats great is that with emulation, and or other similar methods... you can use such a synth... and even add other synths to the mix, and even create enhanced capabilities that were never possible.

 Most all the older games used Synths.   Marble Madness uses a Yamaha chip thats very close to the DX-7 if memory serves me correctly.   And as we all know.. that game has some incredible sound effects, and movie-style theme backing.   Thunderforce II has some incredible Synth work.  And check out "Target Earth"  for Sega Genesis...  A much lower quality synth, but wow.. what awesome composition and sound...


 A combination of some samples (or cd / mp3)  + synth, would probably be best.  Allowing for clear vocals... yet amazing high def synth sounds... that take up almost no space.. despite many large and complex compositions.

 Not that Im knocking Eds work.  Havnt heard his stuff yet. I am a big fan of electric guitar btw.   But just that due to the nature of certain themes... and limitations on audio, it can really add an amazing level of Pop, when using good synths.

 
 Now, I have to be real here... in saying that the original ICB was a bit flawed and limited.   Once you got the hang of it..  it wasnt as exciting as you had once thought.   I have some ideas that would probably fix this problem... and while theme does help... its still not enough.


 For anyone whom wants to make one on the cheap... you do not even really need any electronics.  Two hand crank wheels would do the trick... using a string / pulley style system.  (and or rubber belts, or direct gear drive)


 Anyways..  nice work guys.
 :cheers:

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2014, 07:43:41 am »
X - some of your comments are well taken and will be considered.  I think that the music eds1275 is composing/has composed will be more than sufficient as, again my opinion, it is quite remarkable and vibrant, but I appreciate feedback on other methods of implementation.  The playfield does present challenges in that it is swiss cheese.  I think my art could be improved on but I disagree on the incongruity.  The asteroids in your example are very nice asteroids.  Fluoroscent printing might well lend itself to this theme but is beyond my resources and inclination. 

I think your bringing up the fact that you had a great marketable idea for ICB conversion a long time ago that was "seriously sick" but not sharing it in a thread that is all about giving ideas to the community presents a poor impression.  Kind of a, "nice project, I was going to do something much cooler but nice try" vibe.  Again later with the "I have some ideas that would fix the problem" but no hint to what those ideas are.  Well thanks man, good to know.  Good for you then I guess.  ;)



 

BadMouth

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 8307
  • ...
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2014, 09:03:58 am »
While it's good to get some feedback for the sake of new ideas and avoiding mistakes,
IMO the best projects are the ones where a person or small group of people have a vision and faithfully execute it.
Projects that try to please everyone in the peanut gallery end up bleh.

Keep up the good work!

EDIT: I could totally see a Stargate themed version of this.
(the movie and tv series, not the arcade game)

DOUBLE EDIT: I'd also like to add that Eds1275 did an unreal job on my NeoGeo jingles.
They're better than anything SNK themselves would have had done.
I feel bad for not getting that cab done in a timely manner to show them off.  :-[
« Last Edit: August 05, 2014, 09:11:23 am by BadMouth »

SavannahLion

  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5986
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2014, 10:17:58 am »
At $6+ each for those field switches did you manage to find a cheaper source?

I really wanted to use them for my own but as many as I wanted, it would've blown my entire budget apart.

Le Chuck

  • I want a new quote!
  • Wiki Contributor
  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5440
  • Yots is an Arrogant Tallywacker
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2014, 10:30:24 am »
At $6+ each for those field switches did you manage to find a cheaper source?

I really wanted to use them for my own but as many as I wanted, it would've blown my entire budget apart.

That was a concern, I think the ones I'm using are $6.38 and I need 12 of them.  I have been searching for months for a less expensive retailer or viable sub.  What found is that the money they saved me in building a reliable working chute system for ball management made the juice worth the squeeze.  Your LED sensor solution is very elegant too and would be good for this application but I'm not familiar with it enough to know if it would work in the same manner.  I don't need one for every outhole, just score holes.  I just need one at the gate to shift states.  If a score hole wasn't tripped first then the software knows it was a dead ball. 

Still $70+ is a punch in the gut, especially considering how far IDS is able to stretch the same amount and get pretty much everything else working.   

While it's good to get some feedback for the sake of new ideas and avoiding mistakes,
IMO the best projects are the ones where a person or small group of people have a vision and faithfully execute it.
Projects that try to please everyone in the peanut gallery end up bleh.


Thanks man, we're going to see it through.  I love new ideas but we're not jumping on every band wagon that rolls by. 

yotsuya

  • Trade Count: (+21)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17847
  • 2014 UCA Winner, 2014, 2015, 2016 ZapCon Winner
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137636.msg1420628.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2014, 11:14:34 am »
Thanks man, we're going to see it through.  I love new ideas but we're not jumping on every band wagon that rolls by.

Good idea, LC. I love a lot of the ideas that get generated here, but I've also seen feature creep submarine many a project as well.  :cheers:
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

thatpurplestuff

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 547
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2014, 11:22:02 am »
You can mark me down as someone that thinks the artwork looks fantastic as-is... with a little matching color like pink or something on the controls (buttons, joysticks, whatever) it would tie everything together perfectly.  Very excited to watch this one play out!

So once again, we find that evil of the past seeps into the present like salad dressing through cheap wax paper, mixing memory and desire.

Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2014, 11:27:58 am »
with a little matching color like pink or something on the controls (buttons, joysticks, whatever) it would tie everything together perfectly.
+1

Thanks man, we're going to see it through. 

Thanks for sharing your project! 

Vigo

  • the Scourage of Carpathia
  • Trade Count: (+24)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5880
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #33 on: August 05, 2014, 11:31:46 am »
Keep the space babe, it calls back to classic coin-op. Is she gonna be backlit?


Quote from: Le Chuck
I would appreciate some opinions as to color scheme for Space Gal and any of the other graphics.  I think I personnaly prefer the pink but maybe only like 51%.  I had a recommendation to make her a dark skinned woman and redraw the hair - kind of a Lana Kane in college look, but I haven't tried it out yet, a little too much work to make it look right.  I did try out several shades of green for the skin but it didn't feel right. 

Maybe you wanna consider rather than a flat out green alien babe, just a tinge of an unnatural hue, like to make it ambiguous if she is human or not. I would even consider going as far as making your space babe evil. Glowing eyes, cosmic fire behind her.  I am thinking like something along the lines of Elektra.



Vigo

  • the Scourage of Carpathia
  • Trade Count: (+24)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5880
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #34 on: August 05, 2014, 11:39:12 am »
Eh, scratch my earlier comment about her being evil, I missed the part where saving the gal is kinda part of the plot of the game. She can still be an alien though.  ;)

eds1275

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2036
  • Rock and Roll!
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2014, 11:50:33 am »
Here are some audio files, sans DX-7, for your listening pleasure.

pbj

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7613
  • Obey.
    • The Chris Burke Band
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2014, 12:41:11 pm »
Here are some audio files, sans DX-7, for your listening pleasure.

Well, damn, those sound legit.  Nice work.

 :cheers:

Vigo

  • the Scourage of Carpathia
  • Trade Count: (+24)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5880
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #37 on: August 05, 2014, 12:55:00 pm »
Wow...those are absolutely incredible sounds!  :applaud:

PL1

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6774
  • 2013 UCA Awardee
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #38 on: August 05, 2014, 01:44:41 pm »
Great sounds, Eds1275.   :applaud:

At $6+ each for those field switches did you manage to find a cheaper source?

I really wanted to use them for my own but as many as I wanted, it would've blown my entire budget apart.

That was a concern, I think the ones I'm using are $6.38 and I need 12 of them.  I have been searching for months for a less expensive retailer or viable sub.  What found is that the money they saved me in building a reliable working chute system for ball management made the juice worth the squeeze.  Your LED sensor solution is very elegant too and would be good for this application but I'm not familiar with it enough to know if it would work in the same manner.  I don't need one for every outhole, just score holes.  I just need one at the gate to shift states.  If a score hole wasn't tripped first then the software knows it was a dead ball. 

Still $70+ is a punch in the gut, especially considering how far IDS is able to stretch the same amount and get pretty much everything else working.   

Thatpurplestuff's Skeeball build has me thinking about beam break circuits like this:



You should be able to wire 4 parallel sets of 3 LEDs in series as mentioned here to get the needed 12 sensors.

(Water-wheel = LED, you'll only need a small current-limiting resistor after the 3rd LED to drop 0.5v)


If you don't want to order the sensors from the company in India (here) that TPS did, Mouser carries the same LED and photodiode that he is using for less than $1.76 per sensor ($21.07 per build, plus the cost of the resistors) since you'd be ordering 10+ of them.

I'm also looking at this LED and photodiode combination that is only $0.53 per sensor ($6.36 per build  :o , plus the cost of the resistors) since you'd be ordering 10+ of them.

Haven't ordered any of these LED/photodiode combos yet so I'm not sure how well they work or the exact resistors to use, but Samej71 mentions the resistor he used in his setup for R2 here and you can easily use an online LED calculator to solve for resistor R1.   ;D

Hopefully this can bring your sensor price per build down to a more manageable level.  :cheers:

The mounting geometry that TPS shows here for his sensor + RGB rings should work for your setup, though you may want to move the RGB LED to the top of the hole for indirect lighting.




Scott
« Last Edit: August 05, 2014, 01:48:30 pm by PL1 »

ids

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 692
  • Fighter Captured
Re: Space Base - A homebrew ICB/ZP
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2014, 10:20:13 pm »
PL1 - I'm no electrical guy, so, questions - is it not the case that, in the water wheel scenario, should something go wrong, all LED's tied to the same resistor can go *poof*?  And is this not why it is often recommended to have one resistor per LED?

thx

  
 

Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31