Main > Main Forum
Leaf style Pushbuttons and their differences
DeLuSioNal29:
I only replaced the ones next to my 4 way. :-)
ChanceKJ:
--- Quote from: RandyT on June 18, 2014, 01:34:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on June 18, 2014, 06:51:33 am --- In Groovy's version, Bla bla bla bla.... Snoore....
--- End quote ---
That's because you don't have it adjusted correctly....
--- End quote ---
Oh SNAP!
ok, Ugh... yet another thread I enjoyed, then killed by X2.
Unsubscribed. :-\
Sky25es:
--- Quote from: ChanceKJ on June 18, 2014, 11:01:07 pm ---
--- Quote from: RandyT on June 18, 2014, 01:34:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on June 18, 2014, 06:51:33 am --- In Groovy's version, Bla bla bla bla.... Snoore....
--- End quote ---
That's because you don't have it adjusted correctly....
--- End quote ---
Oh SNAP!
ok, Ugh... yet another thread I enjoyed, then killed by X2.
Unsubscribed. :-\
--- End quote ---
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Xiaou2:
--- Quote ---How you could have taken any way other than what I typed is beyond me. I'll Chad it down for you....... For the Bad Dudes, I replaced 2 miscolored leafs with the proper colored leafs. You must have known this because you advocated embedding ninja stars and swords into the cabinet when you commented in the restore thread. For the 60 in 1 I took Happ comp buttons with cherry switches out, and in their place put in leafs from an actual Galaga cab.
--- End quote ---
I seriously don't know how you carry around so much darkness, bitterness, jealousy, anger and hate... and still manage to have not hung yourself. I wouldn't bet on you making it another 10yrs though...
As for your posts, I didn't look and read much. I saw a few pics, and posted a comment. Its not like you built a moving cockpit. It wasn't that interesting to me to pay much attention.
But Bravo for using real arcade leafs on an older game.
However... Its not like you are going to get much improvement on a beat-em-up. You could almost play those with your feet.. as theres very little skill or intensity involved. Will people notice? Many may not. Many are not educated in the feel of buttons.. nor how to properly use a Leaf button to best advantage. School them in the proper method.. and inform them to pay attention to how if feels when one buttons bottoms out.. where as you can float the other, without bottoming out. Its pretty clear, pretty quickly.
Btw - A far better test, is to build a small CP, and put one of each on it. Have various users play 2 or 3 games of: Haley's Comet, Galaga, Asteroids Deluxe. Those are some of the ones that pop into my mind as being highly fatiguing and rapid in reaction times.
--- Quote ---That's because you don't have it adjusted correctly. If you want more tension, adjust the top leaf (with the holder off the button, of course) then set your gap with the lower one. If that's not enough to replicate the higher resistance of the particular "old school" buttons you are used to, remove the spring and give it a little stretch.
--- End quote ---
For kicks, If I can find the button amongst my Chaos.. I will try to adjust it to the extremes. At the time, I didn't want to mangle it up. But as said, this isn't about the resistance alone. Its about having your fingers able to sink into the buttons a little.. and not accidentally make a connection occur. This is also to do with comfort.. much like a soft cushy couch, rather than a stiff wooden chair.
--- Quote --- "Old school" leaf buttons vary from being completely soft in actuation (Williams, etc.), even less than the CLASSX leaf setup when unadjusted, to very stiff (many after market arcade conversions). As the early variety are a two part setup, they are also more difficult to install, require shimming or routing of the panel's underside to get the distance between the actuator and switch "just right" and/or require different versions of the button for metal and wood panels.
--- End quote ---
Im very aware of Leaf technology. I have plenty of them, in various forms.. as well as have worked & played on many a leaf based machine/controller.
Stating all of this still does not change the far better feel and performance.
--- Quote ---What you also seem never to mention in your comparisons is that this long throw of the earlier varieties is almost entirely responsible for severe contact wear, and the need for much more frequent switch adjustments/cleaning/replacement. The longer the throw, the more deflection of the blades occurs, thereby stressing them more, and causing the contact points to slide against each other more aggressively.
--- End quote ---
I mentioned the upset at having to maintain them as an Arcade OP. Many of these controls lasted 10+ yrs without any problems. Probably with only mild cleaning. But like any tech, it will fail eventually. That's not this issue.
Happ controls makes a nearly Indestructible shifter. However, its Ugly as hell, has a really poor shape and feels very awkward in the hands. To make things worse... the mechanical feel and 'action', is FAR inferior to many other older Shifters that various companies have produced themselves... So... Do we want something that last 50 yrs.. but feels and plays poorly? Or something that needs some tweaks or replacements every so often... but is very comfy, and precise? I think most would chose the latter, when dealing with precision things like intense Arcade games.. And the Former, for something like a Blender or Washing machine.
--- Quote ---The CLASSX button was designed to provide the performance and adjustability of the "old school" leaf switch buttons, while mitigating the issues which caused them to become extinct. As the overly long throw of those buttons was the root cause of those issues, replicating it was not desirable, nor is it necessary to provide nearly identical performance.
--- End quote ---
There is no such thing as the Perfect universal button or controller. Everyone that makes such a device.. is delusional. And many of the people whom buy them... end up selling them later, and buying other controllers for each specific task / need.
The issue of throw, comfort, and rapidfire marathon games... are not covered well in your design.
Also, one COULD design a classic leaf replacement that utilizes the same kind of feel and throw... but with better durability. Yes, it will cost more... But classic fans, will pay the extra... rather than suffering with inferior feel and control.
Edit - I will add... That as a Microswitch replacement, these are probably a better solution, if they can be adjusted to finger-sitting resistance. But for Leaf games.. its not a good solution, IMO.
Malenko:
I think BreakThru would be a pretty good test game, 2 buttons, 1 using rapid fire the other for precision jumps.
EDIT: self imposed clean up duty