Mini Project: Under-dash Optical wheel.

[Howard_Casto]

My personal life is kind of imploding atm, but this sort of thing is a good distraction and I have a spare hour or two so I thought I would post on one of my rare hardware projects. 

I thought that playing optical wheel games on the upcoming racing cab would be kind of nice and I know that the gear boxes that normally attach to an optical wheel are a bit bulky to squeeze in with an analog wheel setup so I've decided to design something that can be made cheaply and easily and fit under the dash of a standard analog wheel cab without much fuss. 

You guys had mentioned Tractor Supply and one just opened up in the area last fall so I thought I would check it out.  12 bucks later (minus the wheel of course) I had the pic below.  What you are looking at is a foot long 3/4-10 threaded rod, a pounds worth of nuts (yeah they sell em by the pound there) and two 3/4-10 bearings.  So I need to mount the bearings between some 2x4's which is easy enough, decide on an encoder wheel/opto combo and figure out how to make the wheel removable. 

Removing the wheel itself is easy, but you'd have a shaft sticking out, which I figure would shred your hands to bits when using the analog wheel. 

Now they sell a 3/4-10 coupler, so I could cut the part of the shaft that sticks out and do it that way, but you'd have to screw it on, which seems like a pain in the butt.  Maybe I could grind away the threads on part of the shaft, fill them in on one side of the coupler and use a quick release pin or something... I dunno.  Anyway, assuming I ever get the time, it's going along smoothly and I think It'll make a nice template for others in a similar situation.

If you have an suggestions in terms of hardware for that quick release let me know.

(Boy that nasty old orange carpet where I take all my pics is going to be famous by the time I'm done.)

[Howard_Casto]

I'm not sure how interested people are in this, it didn't get a response, but I worked on it a little today. 

Besides the obvious, what was holding me up was the fact that I couldn't locate a flange to fit the wheel that I could modify for a quick connect.  I just used my drill press and a combination of a hole saw and spade bit to make one out of wood.  It works pretty well!  I currently have a small set screw in the flange, when I tighten it slightly it goes into the hole I drilled in the shaft and holds the wheel on tight.  I'll eventually replace this with a thumb screw for convenience sake. 

The plan is to make the entire assembly the width of a 2x4 and the height of the wheel hub itself, so when the wheel is off it isn't in the way, it just hangs under your analog wheel.  If I get a chance I'll finish it up tomorrow  and take pics. (except for the encoder wheel... I've still got to find/make that) 

[Brian74]

Im interested 

[Slippyblade]

Im interested 

Me too!

[Malenko]

me three

[Generic Eric]

Missed this earlier.  Keep on trucking!

[Howard_Casto]

Good to know.  I'll try to get the thing roughed out tomorrow then.   

[Howard_Casto]

Ok so I worked a little more on it today.  I'll take pics later tonight. 

So I got most of it roughed out, but there are still some more quirks to take care of.  Basically the base is two very small 2x4 posts mounted to a 2x4 (this will eventually be replaced by a piece of 3/4 plywood once I'm done for a lower profile. 

Making the inset holes for the bearings on the 2x4 was a big pain in the butt.  I didn't want that massive a hole all the way through the 2x4 as it would severely weaken it, plus the 2x4 should help hold in the bearing, so what I did was use a hole saw to make about a 1/2 inch insert and then used the pilot whole made by the hole saw bit to use a smaller, 1 inch spade bit (the shaft is 3/4 so that gives a bit of wiggle room to compensate for my poor craftsmanship) to drill the rest of the way through.  Of course the small insert I made with the hole saw still needed to be picked out of the hole.  Luckily I'm a hillbilly and am genetically inclined to whittling, so I pulled out the utility knife and went to work. 

That all worked very well, but holding the shaft in place is becoming a minor problem.  The plan was to use two nuts tightened together inbetween the 2x4's but no matter how much I tightened them together they still tended to drift down the shaft.  So I scrapped that.  Instead I've used some pan head screws as set screws along the edge of the bearings to hold them tightly in place.  I should have taken the advice I gave Eric when he asked how to build a wheel.... I think a 3/4 pipe cut to length and held in place with a set screw will work much better than the nuts.  It'll give me more spare parts as well... I think once I cut the shaft to length I've got enough parts to make one more of these.   

Anyway, other than that minor issue the thing glides along quite well!  Now it isn't spinner quality, but I would say it's up there with the amount most arcade wheels spin.  The whole assembly is around 6 inches, front to back, and that's allowing extra room for the optics.  The actual mounting portion is only 4 inches long.  It's about 4 inches high but that'll go down to around 3 1/4 once I mount it to plywood instead.

I think for the optics I'll at least try a standard trackball opto and encoder.  It might be too low res, but it would certainly be compact, so we'll see. 

Anyway, pics later tonight. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok pics as promised. 

Keep in mind that I just cobbled this together today as a poc.  I would clean it up and make a nice cover once installed. 

[Howard_Casto]

Ok so I finished up the rough in today.  I cut the shaft and sure enough it was just about at the halfway point... I can make another if I want.    Btw, forget about getting through this stuff with a hack saw unless you are a glutton for punishment.  Find a saws-all!

For the nut problem I mentioned earlier I took a piece of 3/4 pvc (sched 40) cut cut me off approx. 1 inch of the stuff and made a sleeve.  I then drilled a very small set screw hole to hold it in place and adjusted the 2x4's the bearings are on so that they butt up tightly against the sleeve.  That part is pretty solid. 

The encoder attachment... well that I'm still figuring out.  Even with my drill press I couldn't manage to drill a hole centered in the rod.  I had planned on hot-gluing the encoder wheel to a nut but it turns out the nuts are so big that they would hit the encoder.  so for now it's just taped on the end.

It does work pretty well though as-is. I played a game of off-road and before the tape gave way it worked perfectly... I could even put my name in and such without effort. 

So once I get the encoder sorted I'm done save making it look pretty.  Again, hopefully I can post pics tonight. 

[Slippyblade]

Holy crap.  I love it when McGyverized things work!  Once this is complete I am totally building one.

[Howard_Casto]

That encoder wheel is a pain in the butt though. 

I'm thinking I'll remove the shaft tomorrow so I'll have enough length to thread a nut back on.  Then I can use the corners of the nut to draw lines and find the center point. 

I might have to grind the shaft down a little to remove the current hole, but I've got enough slack (I think). 

[Howard_Casto]

As promised pics.... they are a tad blurry though due to the odd angles.  The blob you see in the one pic is hot glue, which does a decent job of holding the encoder wheel in place.  I would like to take a vid but honestly I'm not sure how I would manage to play the game, hold the camera and get the wheel and monitor in the shot. 

[Howard_Casto]

I'm trying to get stuff ready for the 4th, so this is on hold until the weekend, but I should get it done then and I'll make a full writeup. 

Where are my AVR people at?  I'm looking for an example to read encoders, preferably for the teensy.  I've found a bunch of hid mouse examples but it's people faking other devices to show up as a mouse. 

[lolomc2]

Howard, I saw your post too late 

I made a spinner (to play arkanoid) by using an old mouse those last week

I used a 12 mm screw which is fitting inside another metalic part. This part is a kind of cylinder (difficult to explain without picture). Inside, there is a 12,1mm hole and outside, there is a thread so it was very easy to get the screw rotating on one axis. And also very easy to attach one on a plate.

Then, I cutted the 12mm screw on both side. One side, I drilled and tapped at 6 mm, in the middle the best I could, to fit another screw to attach the head of the spinner.
On the other side, I tried to localise, the best I could, the center of the screw and I drilled a 2,5 mm hole inside.
Then I used a copper brazing rod (thank you google translate  ) which is +/-2,3 mm and plunged it inside on a distance of 12-15 mm. Both are not glued but it is long enough to be sure that 99% of the movement is transmitted.

I did that because the optical wheel of the mouse has a hole in the middle which is 2 mm.

So, I used sand paper to reduce the copper diameter, only in the end part, where the optical wheel is inserted.

Finally I put a very long but very low pusched spring to keep the optical wheel in place as otherwise, it would maybe fall down.

Sorry, no pictures are available yet.

The funny thing is that I used, to be the head of my spinner, my old cap mechanism toilet. When I bought my house, I though that it had a look of a spinner head... And now, I used it to be a spinner 

[Howard_Casto]

I appreciate the reply, but I've made spinners by hand as well.  A spinner won't cut it for this application.  Wheels are heavy... they need heavy-duty bearings. 

The best thing to make a spinner out of is an old vcr... pull the head, put a knob on one end and an encoder on the other... done! 

[lolomc2]

Howard... So my explanation was bad   

The 10 mm screw and the "kind of cylinder" are all but fragile. Those are extremely robust, even for a wheel.
The only thing is that there is no stop (infinite rotation I mean)
The rest of the system is weak but there is no effort on it, so it is not a big deal.
 I'll try to post pictures this we if my kids give me enough time for it   

[Xiaou2]

Not bad Howard.

 A few things...

 Certain games like Superprint.. used a non-geared system like you have built,  because you would spin the wheel hard... letting it rotate several times before stopping it.    Its low-resolution approach,  is actually rare for a 360 degree racing game.. as almost all of the rest of them, use a Two-Gear setup for higher resolution... thus much Finer control.

 If you try to play Pole Position, Segas Turbo, TX-1, and pretty much any other 360 degree wheel game...  it will be lacking in good control ability.    While you may crank up mames settings to make the car react differently...  all that will do is to either make the car more Jumpy (skipping some degrees so that it can turn quicker with less wheel turn)... or using the opposite method.. to turn down the sensitivity.. means you would need to turn the wheel like 6 times as many rotations to get the same resolution.

 You can get a cheap set of Large tooth gears from stevenshobby.com

STEVENS MOTORS    SVM-MR7    Assorted Large Plastic Motor Gears (16pcs)    $15.95   (Doesnt look like the metal shafts are included here)
STEVENS MOTORS    SVM-MR8    Assorted Large Plastic Motor Gears & Metal Shafts (27pcs)    $24.95

 Id have to measure the original gears and count the teeth..   but regardless..   Ive found these to be far more effective in control builds.

 
 These gears do not have a large shaft collar,  so I tend to cut/drill the centers out, and make my own.. usually with wood.   I secure them to the larger gears with small thin screws that go through the gears face.. and into the wood collar.  Usually two screws is fine.  Adding a small bit of glue in the pre-drilled holes as well as the faces of the gear and collar.. is also advisable.

 Once you have the collar attached, you can then thread a set screw or two through that.   And or drill all the way through it, and use a bolt.

 Gears done really eat that much space up..  and they give you far more resolution.. to play these games the way they were meant to be played.

 For games that used Lower resolution.. you can crank mames settings down so that it basically ignores half of that data, and it will play fine.

 Just like you can downscale a larger picture fairly fine...  but trying to upscale a very low res image to a larger high res display... and it will look awful.    The scaler tries to put in missing data...   but your encoder wont / cant...  and even if it could... it wouldnt be accurate, nor the same.   Either you have the resolution to work with.. or you dont.


 There is Another you could try...

 Back when I was doing this stuff... they didnt have good optical mice.. and or they were really expensive.   If you get a good gaming mouse with a laser tracker..  that works on nearly any kind of surface...  you probably could position it over a shaft, and get a high resolution read.

 Many of the new mice also have the software option to reduce the DPI.. so that you can lower the resolution as well.   In some software, especially with Logitech,  you can assign the raise/lower  DPI to different buttons.


 As as for centering a drill hole..

 1)  Measure and mark the area with at least two intersecting lines.
 2)  Use a Center Punch - preferably a spring loaded one..  to create an accurate dimple.
 3)  Possibly pre-drill the dimple a little deeper,  with a small diameter bit.  Not too deep.. and be Careful, as thin bits can flex easily.
 4)  Possibly pre-drill that holes starting point, larger and larger in diameter,  using various diameter bit sizes.

 Make sure the work is clamped well, and the table on the drill press is squared to the drill bit at a perfect 90 degrees.   Use a typical carperters L-Square.. placed on the table..  and slide it next to the bit.  Make sure its not flexing the bit, if the bit is thin.  If there is any space between the bit and the edge of the square... it means the table is out of whack.. or the bit is bent or not centered in the chuck well.

 Improperly squared, even a little, can ruin anything that requires any depth and precision.  Ive sadly learned this the hard way.

 Many drill pressed do have adjustments that can adjust the table.  These get loose over time.. and need to be readjusted.   I have a radial drill press.. and there are actually a lot of things that can effect the end result.. and it took me quite some digging to find all of the places that could be adjusted and or tightened up.


 Hot glue,  and or almost any glue solution is never a lasting solution.   Epoxy putty.. is about as permanent as it gets..   but, then you cant remove.. if you ever need to do so.


 Edit:

 One more thing...    Most arcade wheels are designed so that children can hang from them.. and adults can lean and slam them in anger.
You have to realize.. that even a fairly fat shaft can be bent at a pivot point.. as there is a lot of leverage forces at play.   The longer the shaft sticks out away from the control panel / bearing block..  the more the leverage is amplified.. and so the easier it is for someone to accidentally bend the shaft.

 As such, most arcade wheels have a thick collar attached around the external part of the shaft, and are placed very close to the mount block.
Many of them didnt even use ball bearings.  Just heavy duty bearing inserts.  Ball bearings often get dirty, corroded / rusty, and create wear due to the race getting ate up over the years.   The heavy duty bearing grease can also cause issues with good free-spin qualities.

 Obviously, bearing wear isnt really much of an issue with home use.   Still, the assembly should be able to be taken apart... if need be.
Also, if that shaft has any play in it.. its threads will act like a hacksaw and start cutting into stuff... making even more play.. and eventual demise.   Ive found its better to use a non threaded shaft, and either use custom make grooves with E-clips.. set screws, etc.

 The only thing you might want tapped is the end for the wheel.  But even that could be a problem.. due to the spinning could cause it to get loose.   As such.. many wheels are fitted with a two part plate assembly.  The front part bolts through the wheel and into the rear part.. and the rear part is then set-screwed on the shaft.   Most of these have 3 bolt holes.  Some have 5.

 Finally, depending on the application... a hardened steel shaft may be required.  As much as some shafting feels strong.. its still pretty weak compared to the forces of someone trying to bend it, especially when using a leverage point.   Hardened steel however, is tempered to a much greater strength.. and is nearly impossible to bend.  Its also much more difficult to cut though.   Use of a fiberglass cut off wheel should do the trick.. but even then, will take some time.

 A local steel place will probably sell and cut to spec for you.

 They also sell very hard and thick walled pipe at Home Depot, which is black in color.   This is another good alternative to solid shafts.. as you then can route wires through for buttons and lighting..  in the typical wheel / controller applications.

 Guess I should also warn.. that the thick walled pipe, can be very difficult to drill holes in as well.  A drill-doctor is a good device to have in such a case.. because you can wear down a bit in seconds..  especially when used improperly.

 Drill with tap oil, slower speed, low pressure.  It can take a very long time to drill these holes.  Have to have patience.  Good idea to have a fan blowing over the bit and piece to help keep it cool.  And or take many pauses... and quench the bit into some cool / ice water.

  Bits too hot, will expand too much, and can cause them to wear even faster.   Too much pressure, can cause the sharp edges to dull in mere seconds.  As the bit needs far more time and effort to gradually scrape the material away.   When nothing is working..  the bit is probably shot.. and no matter how much pressure you place on it.. it wont down any further.


 Its actually far easier to drill thick walled / hardened steel   using smaller diameter bits first .. because they dont have as much material to try to cut through.   After drilling with a small bit.. you can then use slightly thicker bits.. re-drilling that hole larger and larger.   The process is often far faster and easier..  and less likely to eat as many bits up.  Again, keep things cool.. and well oiled.

[Xiaou2]

Almost forgot...

 Optical wheels / sensors are extremely sensitive to alignment issues.

 This means, that if your off a mere mm..  you will notice it in-game.   Part of your characters motions will probably slow down or stop at one point on the wheel as a result of the alignment causing a read confusion.. and or timing issue.   

 Remember, that timing and spacing are critical to how the sensors know whats happening.

 As such, you need to make sure not only that everything has precision alignment..  but also, that there is no slop, bend, or play.. in the device.  As if the shaft bends or moves a little.. the encoder will get thrown off.

 One spinner I made was off by quite a bit.  When I spun in windows at a specific rate.. you could see the mouse pointer change speeds going faster and the slower.. at various points along the line of travel.

 The may be another reason why gearing was used in wheels.    Larger tooth gears can have a little more play in them without too much trouble.  Once the power has gotten transferred to the 2nd gear.. its no longer bound to any issues of the shaft.   So as long as the frame isnt flexing, and mount isnt a problem.. there will be less possible alignment issues on the 2nd gear setup.

 Also, because the 2nd gear is smaller.. it matches up with the smaller sized encoder wheel discs... so less need for custom made wheels and or adapters, that may be off-center.

[Howard_Casto]

I appreciate the advice guys, but it looks like both of you have different goals than me. 

X2 wants to make the perfect optical wheel while lolomc2 wants to make a wheel from random things around the house, which works for him, but isn't something others can easily replicate. 

I'm just trying to make a sturdy wheel that will fit under an analog wheel, with 100% off the shelf parts that anyone with a few tools and a decent skill set can make cheaply. 

I'm going to re-drill the end to permanently attach the encoder wheel, I've already said as much.  I just wanted to test the thing before I invested more time into it. 

I will say this though, even with a slightly sloppy alignment there weren't any issues with the games.  It surprised me as well because as I mentioned I've made spinners before and on games with spinners any variation in the spin has made a big difference.  In these games, not so much.  I can only conclude that racing games just aren't as sensitive. 

This actually makes sense to me because if you look at a lot of the old 4 player wheel cabinets, you can see the wheels wobble as you spin them.  The hardware wasn't exactly precision engineered. 

I'll try more games once I'm done, but thus far most seem to work well.  There are a few oddball ones.  Roadblaster pitches a fit anytime you accelerate from a stop, but I think that has to do more with it's unique hardware than anything else. 

I would like to say that Pole Position controlled well, but I really can't tell.  I've always sucked at that game and it's been a good 20 years since I've played it on an actual cabinet.  I mean I got through qualifying and the first stage, which is better than I usually do.  Are the spins 1 to 1 with how they were in the arcade?  I don't have a clue, but I think for a universal solution that might be asking too much.  Encoder wheels can be swapped of course as you mention, that isn't a big deal, but at least from initial testing, mame's sensitivity settings seems to match up pretty well with the one that I'm using with a few oddball games being the exception.

It works great on offroad, badlands, and games like that, feels exactly as I remember and I have actually played offroad on a cab recently. 

Design-wise about the only thing I would change is to just use a solid shaft instead of a threaded one.  I had intended to use the nuts to hold things in place but that didn't pan out so it's pointless to have to deal with threads.  They make it hard to cut the shaft squarely as they throw you off.  I got this particular shaft and the bearings in the trailer section of Tractor Supply... they are parts normally used to make the axel assembly to a home made trailer, so while not the strongest thing in the world, they should be sturdy enough. 

[lolomc2]

Houa... Lot of text to read.

Just few pictures : the kind of cylinder and the screw before being cutted :


The cap mechanism toilet  and the top of cylinder and the top of screw


Under part :

[Xiaou2]

I appreciate the advice guys, but it looks like both of you have different goals than me.

X2 wants to make the perfect optical wheel

 Huh?   I already own several arcade optical wheels.    I was stating these things to be helpful.

I'm just trying to make a sturdy wheel that will fit under an analog wheel, with 100% off the shelf parts that anyone with a few tools and a decent skill set can make cheaply.

 Actually, Ive never found a set of bearings that large, and a shaft to match... and not everyone has a Tractor supply store in their area.. nor can easily find such large bearings.. and cheaply.   Its no more difficult to get the green gears Ive posted.  You place the order on the site... and Bam.. parts arrive.   There have been several people who Ive told the gears about, and they have used them successfully to make arcade controls.. on this very site.

I will say this though, even with a slightly sloppy alignment there weren't any issues with the games.  It surprised me as well because as I mentioned I've made spinners before and on games with spinners any variation in the spin has made a big difference.  In these games, not so much.  I can only conclude that racing games just aren't as sensitive.

This actually makes sense to me because if you look at a lot of the old 4 player wheel cabinets, you can see the wheels wobble as you spin them.  The hardware wasn't exactly precision engineered.

 Not quite so.  Games like Pole Position, Turbo, Tx-1, are actually very sensitive.   

  Wheel wobble isnt an indication of sensitivity.   As Ive said before... these wheels are geared.  Once the transmission goes from the main shaft into the 2nd shaft of the optical encoder...  there is no wobble on that shaft. 

 Any play is dealt with is in the gear teeth meshing.  As long as the teeth are large enough.. there can be a little wobble without the teeth losing contact.

 Furthermore... wobble does not indicate that the shaft is wobbling.  The actual wheel itself can get warped..  or the mounting plate warped,  or the wheel has gotten looses from the mounting plate.. and has grinded its mount holes to bit.. making the wheel off-center.

 Ive seen and dealt with all of the above.

 Also... if you want to see how accurate your wheel is.. spin it in a set speed.. and see how the mouse cursor travels on the screen.   If theres any variance of speed... there is a tracking issue.

 My guess, if everything pans out from that test..  is that due to the larger arcade style optical disc and senors..  theres is less sensitivity to small positioning errors.   With a mouse hack.. the wheel spokes are very small and need a lot more precision.


 Still, your low resolution encoder discs without gearing...  doesnt address the main problem.. of too low of a resolution for most of the Optical games.

I'll try more games once I'm done, but thus far most seem to work well.  There are a few oddball ones.  Roadblaster pitches a fit anytime you accelerate from a stop, but I think that has to do more with it's unique hardware than anything else.

 Odd hardware?    If you can play the game fine with a regular mouse.. it should play fine with your optical wheel.   There is no real difference.
I was never much of a fan of that game...  but if I were to guess... Id say you were using a digital key for gas.. rather than an analog pedal.  In many driving games... if you floor the gas 100%, the car will spin its tires and fly around a bit.. much like real sports car.  For reference, watch a few drag races.

I would like to say that Pole Position controlled well, but I really can't tell.  I've always sucked at that game and it's been a good 20 years since I've played it on an actual cabinet.  I mean I got through qualifying and the first stage, which is better than I usually do.  Are the spins 1 to 1 with how they were in the arcade?  I don't have a clue, but I think for a universal solution that might be asking too much.  Encoder wheels can be swapped of course as you mention, that isn't a big deal, but at least from initial testing, mame's sensitivity settings seems to match up pretty well with the one that I'm using with a few oddball games being the exception.

 The main key to doing well without crashing in Pole Position,   is learning to let off the gas on the turns.   If you hear a skid noise.. your losing tire grip, and if you let off the gas.. you will get your grip back.   On the corners, its especially important to let off the gas in prep..  especially when you reach the main traffic congestion.   

 Being that the corners can be extremely tight.. and are pretty much "blind"..  if you go in with heavy speed..  even if you gain control of the skid in that moment.. you will probably run smack into another car... that you couldnt see due to the blind nature of the games corners.  Hence, ease off the gas a good distance before the corner.   Once in the corner safely .. and you get to the point where you can see around the corner..  you can punch it without issue of hitting something.

 Stay clear of the puddles if possible.. as they reduce your speed and I think toss you over a little.  And be cautious of cars changing lanes.

 You will be best using an analog pedal to play these games.   These types of games are more skillful than many of the pot based racers.  In the later pot based racers.. you can almost always hold the gas pedal down the entire run.   In these games, you can not.

It works great on offroad, badlands, and games like that, feels exactly as I remember and I have actually played offroad on a cab recently.

 Offroad, Badlands, SuperSprint... are all non-geared games.   They are games where you spin the wheel and let it fly for many rotations..  which is why the sensitivity is so low...  and so it does not need gearing.

 Pole Position, Turbo, Tx-1, Road Blaster,   and far many more..  (pretty much any optical wheel game except the few above) are all gear driven
mechanisms.


 Additionally..  pretty much every analog pedal on an arcade machine is also geared.  I dont think Ive ever seen one without gears.

Design-wise about the only thing I would change is to just use a solid shaft instead of a threaded one.  I had intended to use the nuts to hold things in place but that didn't pan out so it's pointless to have to deal with threads.  They make it hard to cut the shaft squarely as they throw you off.  I got this particular shaft and the bearings in the trailer section of Tractor Supply... they are parts normally used to make the axel assembly to a home made trailer, so while not the strongest thing in the world, they should be sturdy enough. 

 I find it hard to believe that a threaded shaft is used as an axel.  It makes Zero sense.   The bearings.. maybe..  But not that shaft.  And especially not a non-hardened shaft.    A shaft on a trailer needs to endure several hundread pounds of weight.   If you placed that shaft between two bricks and stood in the middle..  and jumped down on it a few times.. it would bend like butter.

 Either it was mislabeled..  or you got the wrong information.

 At most, that threaded shaft could be used Vertically.  For something like a screw jack..  to raise the axel when changing a tire.   Its not meant to hold mass horizontally...   which is why with very little effort..  you could easily bend it by leaning on your mounted wheel setup.


 Im just trying to be helpful..  but if you believe that you know it all without looking up the information to verify the facts...  then theres nothing I, nor anyone else, can do.   You will just have to find out the hard way.