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FAQ input and feedback request
PL1:
@404 - I understand that, but look at the last sticky in Main.
It points people to various starting points for information.
I'm not suggesting we reinvent the wheel, just refurbish the one we've already got.
The sad part is that the linked FAQ thread had a number of broken and replacement links, including the previous Google cache link that was reported broken for almost a year with no reply before I noticed and dug up a replacement. :soapbox:
--- Quote from: PL1 on December 31, 2012, 08:29:10 pm ---
--- Quote from: docrings on January 04, 2012, 11:25:00 pm ---http://www.xmarks.com/site/www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~darrelld/newbie.html
...Darn... fini... done... gone.... dead.
Who is the moderator on this site???? ???
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Here's a link to the Internet Wayback Machine archive of the FAQ.
This should be good for a long time, but we really should consider updating and hosting the FAQ on-site -- once the wiki logins are fixed. ::) [/broken record mode]
Scott
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--- Quote from: Nephasth on June 19, 2013, 09:22:56 pm ---Where does this wire go?
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:bat I'll tell you where you can put it and what ratchet crimper jaws you should use to secure it there. :P >:D
Scott
PL1:
Thanks for your input, Thefox.
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---I cant help but think that one of the inherent problems with writing an FAQ is that it is written by the guys who really know their stuff, have been into it for years, and forget that your average noob is approaching it from way outside it all somewhere.
So an answer like "MAME32, MAMEUI, or MAMEUIFX - Graphic User Interface (GUI) versions of MAME" may make perfect sense to someone who already knows about that stuff, but is a confusing list of wierd letters and numbers to a newbie looking to get his first MAME setup, and is in danger of just making the subject even more confusing than it already is.
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Right now I'm using some "inside baseball" shorthand on some of these as a placeholder before expanding the text, adding some screen-shots, and whipping it into final shape.
Once it is on the wiki, it will be easy for anyone with a clearer/better way to express the ideas to improve the FAQ.
That's also why I'm asking for everyone's input.
By the time we get the FAQ whipped into decent shape, it should be as easy to follow as my help threads. ;D
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---Ron White may have said "You can't fix stupid". But that's a pretty stupid thing to say sometimes, cos everyone starts out "stupid" to some extent.
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Minor revision: Everyone starts out ignorant to some extent -- and that's OK.
Ignorance can be fixed by the individual learning what they didn't know before.
That's why we all keep reading and learning. :cheers:
My point with the Ron White quote was that no matter how much you try to idiot-proof something, someone will always build a bigger, better idiot. :laugh2:
For now, we'll work on the ignorant-proofing the FAQ until the law of diminishing returns kicks in or it exceeds the size of the Encyclopedia Galactica.
Eventually, we'll get the FAQ where it should be, but right now, it's just the beginnings of a skeleton that we need to flesh out.
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---As a relative newbie myself, the impression i got was that MAME seems overtly and perhaps unnecessarily complicated, and that there is a club of geeky guys out there who "get it" but don't want to let me in by sharing it in a way I could easily understand.
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It's not that anyone is trying to deliberately shut anyone out -- other than maybe one guy . . . but you're not him. >:D
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---I don't quite understand the annoyance factor of being asked the same question by noobs - I would have thought that helping people out is part of what forums are about, and I would be happy (and proud) to be able to help someone out with a seemingly dumb question.
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I think it's a bit rude when someone posts a question without even trying a search, but it's usually not worth making an issue out of it.
I'm not annoyed by the repetitious questions, just seeking a more organized and efficient way to convey the material.
Case in point.
23 of my posts mention MagnaSave.
21 of those posts mention how to tie MagnaSave and Upper Flipper inputs together for Visual Pinball because no pinball tables use both.
Some of the posts took a really long time to write, it also took a while to find a post that had several related wiring + diode diagrams, and a few of the newer posts left out some details included in earlier posts.
This is the kind of thing that is perfect for the wiki -- once it is written up and consolidated there, future replies on the subject can point to the wiki.
From there, it's much easier to proceed since they'll have a solid foundation for any further questions.
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---But since it does appear to be an annoyance, I think the way to avoid the same question cropping up would be to ensure there is an FAQ where the answers really take people by the hand and guide them through stuff, using "stupid" as the starting point.
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Change "stupid" to "ignorant" and we're pretty much on the same page.
Scott
PL1:
Who else has something they think belongs in the revised FAQ?
What is needed:
- Topics
- Questions (plus answers if you have them)
- Pics (as needed)
- Links to related wiki entries
- Links to related threads
- Corrections to any errors you see in the rough draft
Scott
BadMouth:
--- Quote from: thefox on June 20, 2013, 02:05:58 am ---I don't quite understand the annoyance factor of being asked the same question by noobs - I would have thought that helping people out is part of what forums are about, and I would be happy (and proud) to be able to help someone out with a seemingly dumb question. But since it does appear to be an annoyance, I think the way to avoid the same question cropping up would be to ensure there is an FAQ where the answers really take people by the hand and guide them through stuff, using "stupid" as the starting point.
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It's really nothing against the noob. It's a process where someone who has been around a long time and doesn't bother answering the questions anymore is replaced by someone else who hasn't been on the scene as long and is still excited to share their knowledge (which most likely was passed to them by the old timer). A lot of the people who posted regularly when I first joined now only post in threads that are extremely unique and not a rehash of conversations already had many times before.
--- Quote ---As a relative newbie myself, the impression i got was that MAME seems overtly and perhaps unnecessarily complicated, and that there is a club of geeky guys out there who "get it" but don't want to let me in by sharing it in a way I could easily understand.
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You are not the only one who has come away with that perspective. That is why I think it is important to explain the known stumbling blocks upfront in a way that they will understand at their current level.
Unfortunately, just as they start to wrap their head around there being different revision numbers for MAME and the roms, they are usually directed to clrmamepro and auditing roms which is pretty heavy stuff for someone who only has MAME halfway working at this point. It would be much easier for them to find a shady rom site that states what version the roms are and then download the official MAME build for that version (or preferably a torrent of the complete current set). Then after they have things working and know their way around MAME settings, they can move on to ROM management.
PL1:
Update on the FAQ.
While we continue to wait (. . . and wait, and wait . . . >:D) for the BYOAC Wiki logins to be repaired, Spoot has set up an alternate PinWiki. :applaud: :notworthy: :applaud: :notworthy:
With his permission, I created a New BYOAC FAQ page.
Please check it out and throw in your $.02.
I also imported the text from the Wiring and SW Yoke Rebuild pages as well in case Le Chuck or Nephasth wanted to continue work on them.
Scott