The thing about custom artwork (FAQ & rant)

[mike boss]

Really interesting thread with some great info.
I was compelled to read this after just completing my Wonderboy Bartop project.
This was a "paid  to learn" type situation for me. And I will not tell you what I agreed to do it for.
It was not however worth it....I did apologize to the seller and a new price (very small increase) was negotiated.
HOURS and HOURS went into this, and the amount of revisions ! WHOA!

In the end when I sent the artwork to the customer they had 5 different versions of the sideart.

I think it the revisions that sting us. People like what they see, but then they want to see if they would like "this orange, that a square, shadow here." ARGHHHH ! Pain !

Yet by the same token I did a Mala layout (and to be fair I use the art widely existing online) and the consumer loves it @ 1st take.......pays, and we're done.

My experience was good..... but my hat is off to you guys.
I've been asked to do another project and I may have to decline.

Part due to I do not wish to put out an inferior product.
Part due to the time it will take me, it is simply not worth it.

What are some of the main things you all consider when pricing a job ?

[eds1275]

As I stated above, I do audio, but last year I made a cabinet for someone. I spent so much time on the art that it ended up not being worth it for me in the end, and I cared about it so much I didn't want to give it up.

[Malenko]

That looks smurfing awesome.


When I do pricing, I tell the people "it will cost X if I take about Y number of hours"  Big changes mean more time and I always say up front that what they want changed will increase the cost. Almost everyone understands. I've had people completely change the scope after I thought I was near a final version and I've refunded money to not deal with them anymore.

[mike boss]

I don't know if it is just me, or this is a slippery slope ?
I'd like to think every time I set out to do something for a customer I nail it first take.
But that would be anything but the truth.

And my desire to ensure each and every individual is happy often times has me working on stuff when it isn't worth it.

I think on a go forward when I present my original concept (which I always do) I'll take the input/feedback at that time.

If someone is asking to see it this way, now that way, now that way again, then asking for all versions included it has to come at a cost. I think most people do realize time is money.

Where I need to be fair is my lack of ability, and not having someone pay extra because I am slow.
But I think I'm fair with that and price things accordingly.

[opt2not]

Prefacing expectations.  I state right at the beginning of any commission that I allow only 3 revisions, once at every "pass" that I provide.
Anything extra will cost extra, and that cost is high.  This is to temper the nitpickers, or wishy-washers, because honestly the money we take in is not worth the hours and hours of revisions. It can really get out of hand.
Yes, I do want people to be happy with the work I provide them, but I have no time nor patience for small adjustments that can creep up time and time again. 
This is only a slippery slope if you let it be. Personally I don't allow my customers to run-on with minuscule changes and I let them know that frankly right from the get-go.

It's a hard rule that I try very hard to stick to, but I'll only break it when it has to do with placement or measurement changes.

This is why I tell people that when they give me exact measurements at the beginning, and the revisions feedback must be well-thought-out. Take your time to think about what you want changed and at each pass try to give me as much feedback as possible.  I realize this is hard for most people who are not creative-types, since they have a harder time envision what they want.  But that's the rub eh? When you are hiring an artist for a commission, it's up to the artists interpretation to deliver what you think you want. This is very similar to how tattoo artists work...you go in, give them an idea of what you want, they show you examples, or give you a rough sketch...you sign off on it and it's direct to the inking.

As for the starting point, my customers must provide me with as much information as they can before I price out how much it costs. I have a "standard workload" that I let them know about.  Creating 40+ characters collage doesn't not fit within a that standard workload.
Anything above the standard and I scale the amount of time and money it'll cost drastically. This keeps people from going crazy, and if it turns people away from hiring me, then it's no skin off my back. Like I said, the money and time to do these commissions are not worth that kind of effort. I do this for a little money in my pocket to fund my hobbies, so the wife doesn't go ape----steaming pile of meadow muffin---, as well as a service to the community 'cause I like seeing nice art'ed-up cabinets being made.  If it comes to a point where I feel its not worth it, I might as well just make art for myself and say screw-it, people can stick to that fugly blue lighting stock art.

[pbj]

Hmm... so how's about $5 for a drawing of grizzled Sonic the Hedgehog nursing a whiskey in a dive bar and pondering his direction in life?

Twist - Sonic is a metaphor for pinballjim.

[sellsellsell2000]

 

[mike boss]

My brothers are electricians....and at some point or another everyone is looking for an electrician.
And everyone wants a deal. And I remember one time my brother told me, "Stop telling people I'm an electrician!" I asked him why. He said everyone wants something for nothing and acts like this doesn't feed my family.

So I remember when I was getting married I went to my buddy, he had a full service wedding company. My school of thought was put the money in his pocket. But I remember in my dealings with him I went to him for trust, confidence, and I wanted a deal. But I did not lose site of the fact that this is how he feeds his family.

When I see that cartoon about the 10 minutes I laugh. Because it is very true. I've found doing small stuff like Mala layouts people don't sweat it when they get the finished product in an hour. But with more expensive stuff they tend to freak.

[mcseforsale]

So, I have a question.  I'm working on an arcade for my neighbor and I'm out of my depth in artwork.  How much would it cost to have the side artwork done with a simple HUGE Jack Daniels bottle up the side on each side and a CP top that looks like a worn bartop with coasters featuring their last name as drink brands? 

I'm going to try it (in Photoshop 5.1), but if I get into trouble and I start hitting deadlines, I'd gladly pay someone else's money to get it done quickly. 

So, for all the discussion regarding artwork, to the (very) layman...what's it really worth?

LeChuck bailed me out on the Fistful of Quarters build in a mercy-killing...he probably got tired of watching me flop on the dock...

AJ

[SNAAKE]

Hmm... so how's about $5 for a drawing of grizzled Sonic the Hedgehog nursing a whiskey in a dive bar and pondering his direction in life?

Twist - Sonic is a metaphor for pinballjim.

I did get a request like that. pacman and bunch of other characters in a tiki bar..make them wear skirt and dance or something too..maybe smoke weed 

[opt2not]

So, I have a question.  I'm working on an arcade for my neighbor and I'm out of my depth in artwork.  How much would it cost to have the side artwork done with a simple HUGE Jack Daniels bottle up the side on each side and a CP top that looks like a worn bartop with coasters featuring their last name as drink brands? 

I'm going to try it (in Photoshop 5.1), but if I get into trouble and I start hitting deadlines, I'd gladly pay someone else's money to get it done quickly. 

So, for all the discussion regarding artwork, to the (very) layman...what's it really worth?

LeChuck bailed me out on the Fistful of Quarters build in a mercy-killing...he probably got tired of watching me flop on the dock...

AJ

mcseforsale, if you are actually seriously inquiring about a price quote for getting some art done for you, please send your questions through PM.  I don't discuss prices in a public forum.

But if you're asking more of the philosophical question of "what's it really worth?", I invite you to read this thread again from the beginning.

 

[yotsuya]

Hmm... so how's about $5 for a drawing of grizzled Sonic the Hedgehog nursing a whiskey in a dive bar and pondering his direction in life?

Twist - Sonic is a metaphor for pinballjim.

I did get a request like that. pacman and bunch of other characters in a tiki bar..make them wear skirt and dance or something too..maybe smoke weed

Reminds me of this one I saw on KLOV...

[SNAAKE]

lol thats great actually 

[morton]

As someone who is dabbling with art themselves, I can say unequivocally that paying someone is the best course of action. I do not consider myself an expert, nor do I see myself as a layperson. Even knowing how to use the programs to a certain degree, the workflow is extremely slow and one mistake at a certain point can undo hours of work if you aren't careful. I have probably spent 6-10 hours total in my free time, and am still not done. I figure another few hours at least... so if that is the case, essentially you're almost gonna be at 1/3 of the hours in a work week (depending what you do for a living). If a guy wants 1/3 of my weekly pay to do art, and it's gonna be better than what I can do and it's gonna look good... its a no brainer.

Look at the art some of the sellers are creating, and the type of reception folks get when they share what they have commissioned... That alone is worth it. Anyone who isn't seeing the value in this, just remember, you're gonna have to look at it forever. It's art. No different than a painting on a wall. If you want a big portrait, you don't paint your own if you cant paint. When I used to paint, I was constantly unhappy with my work and constantly tweaking to the point I ruined some great pieces... anyone I know who owns any of my completed work just enjoys it.

Not just to the artists but.... Hats off to the pros out there who do what they do and do it well.