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Author Topic: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table  (Read 96809 times)

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Sshado

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #360 on: May 17, 2013, 08:47:42 am »
Still eagerly watching this thread. I am trying to decide if I am going to buy a 29" Ultrawide or a DMD so I want to see how yours turns out with the 29"...

Maximus

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #361 on: May 17, 2013, 09:38:36 am »
Yeah sorry not much traction on this, I'm waiting on some final pieces to finish up the Paperboy and get it out of the garage, also I have to throw out a bunch of other junk that has built up and get ready for a potential house move in a few months so I've been taking a bit of a break from the builds.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #362 on: June 02, 2013, 02:22:10 pm »
Finally I get to return to the beast now everything else is out of the way.

Completely redoing the sides with a new more traditional profile.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #363 on: June 02, 2013, 04:23:05 pm »
Happier with this,  much more pinbally

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #364 on: June 02, 2013, 07:35:14 pm »
Too late for mitre joints?

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Re: Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #365 on: June 02, 2013, 08:42:31 pm »
Too late for mitre joints?

Yeah too late for that but at least they are reinforced on the inside with the leg thingy bobs

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #366 on: June 02, 2013, 08:47:24 pm »
Nearly all the new framing finished, can't find my dang leg bolts though

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #367 on: June 02, 2013, 10:50:54 pm »
Ran to Home Depot for some hardware I just had to see what the new framing looked like




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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #368 on: June 03, 2013, 08:44:45 am »
Wow, she's a tall broad ain't she?  ;D  Nice to see it coming together, how are you handling the side projection since you've reduced the panel size?

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #369 on: June 03, 2013, 10:03:51 am »
Yeah that back box is a bit nuts now I have redone the base, looks like it's going to need some redesign too, I need to relocate those speakers so I can drop the height.

Projection should actually be easier now that I have redesigned the screen area, it's not as long as it was, but it is higher which should fit the aspect ratio of the projectors better. The main thing was to make sure I was filling as much of the side as possible but while also retaining structural integrity. Also I wanted the screens to be an irregular shape that you couldn't achieve without projection.


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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #370 on: June 03, 2013, 10:16:16 am »
I'd drop the height of the backbox down myself. The speakers make it look out of proportion, but I'm not sure there is anywhere to put them. I'd also mitre cut those sides, but if it's too late, it's too late.  :cheers:
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #371 on: June 03, 2013, 10:27:48 am »
Yep I think I'll have to have them fire up from behind the main back glass then I can bring the height back down.

I still have more bracing work to do inside the main box but as usual it's a game of millimeters making sure the playfield is as tight in as it can go and have cross braces without interfering with the light path of the projectors.  Hey why make something easy when you can make it crazy complicated

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #372 on: June 03, 2013, 11:24:42 am »
Wow, you really emptied that garage out  :) Can't wait to see how this turns out!

drventure

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #373 on: June 03, 2013, 11:33:56 am »
Hey why make something easy when you can make it crazy complicated

Truer words I think have never been spoken!  :applaud:

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #374 on: June 03, 2013, 01:29:09 pm »
Yay!!!

I woke up to a flooded downstairs bathroom this morning, HAPPY MONDAY!!!!


But while I was waiting for the plumber I decided to test out the projection on the new frame. I just stretched some of the gray lycra over the frame for a quick and easy test screen, but it's good enough to see the results...



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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #375 on: June 03, 2013, 01:45:48 pm »
You gonna put two projectors in there, or just one and use some kind of mirror/beam splitter trick?

Also, where's the PC going to go?

Awesome idea, regardless. Really looking forward to how this comes out.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #376 on: June 03, 2013, 02:00:00 pm »
Yep there will be two projectors. Splitting the beam would require some crazy optically perfect prism from space, I think the same type they used to imprison ZOD and his buddies in Superman.

There's space inside the cabinet for the PC, you just have to stay out of the path of the light beams.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #377 on: June 03, 2013, 02:08:49 pm »
Yeah, i figure there's optics out there to do it, but they'd likely be more $$$ than a second projector.

You're gonna need some http://www.bigassfans.com/ for that puppy.  ;D

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #378 on: June 03, 2013, 03:29:41 pm »
You're gonna need some http://www.bigassfans.com/ for that puppy.  ;D

Heat shouldn't be too much of an issue as the projectors themselves aren't housed within the cabinet but underneath it. The PJ exhausts are on the back so they will blow out to the sides of the cabinet. I'll definitely make sure I am moving some air through there just in case, but hopefully it won't be too nuts.

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Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #379 on: June 03, 2013, 10:33:58 pm »
This is such a cool idea. How is it in normal light? Washed out at all?

Jigenjuke

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #380 on: June 04, 2013, 03:04:33 am »
Yep there will be two projectors. Splitting the beam would require some crazy optically perfect prism from space, I think the same type they used to imprison ZOD and his buddies in Superman.

There's space inside the cabinet for the PC, you just have to stay out of the path of the light beams.

Heh heh all I could come up with was this...

"There is something very important I forgot to tell you."
"What?"
"Don't cross the streams."
"Why?"
"It would be bad."
"I'm fuzzy on the whole good/bad thing.  What do you mean bad?"
"Try to imagine all life as you know it stopping instantaneously and every molecule in your body exploding at the speed of light."
"Total protonic reversal."
"Right, OK that's Bad?  Alight, important safety tip, thanks Igon."


Maximus

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #381 on: June 04, 2013, 12:25:54 pm »
Tell him about the Twinkie.

Finished creating the channels for the light path


Starting on the light box housing


Now I have my 'safe zones' that I can use for computers speakers wiring etc etc

Jigenjuke

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #382 on: June 04, 2013, 07:08:34 pm »
Tell him about the Twinkie.

Heh heh!

"Well, let's say this Twinkie represents the normal amount of psychokinetic energy in the New York area. Based on this morning's sample, it would be a Twinkie... thirty-five feet long, weighing approximately six hundred pounds."

"That's a big Twinkie."

You can say that again!  Lookin' good Maximus.


Maximus

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #383 on: June 05, 2013, 09:25:56 am »
Inverted optically centered dual projectors firing the same image at each other through a first surface mirror. Hopefully this won't cause a black hole or create a locked state of wave particle duality resulting in a non collapsing infinity of possible outcomes.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #384 on: June 05, 2013, 03:43:26 pm »
WOW..just..WOW!  :notworthy:

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #385 on: June 05, 2013, 03:45:28 pm »
You're gonna have to get the ABEC bearing upgrade for your power meter in the new house!

AJ

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #386 on: June 05, 2013, 04:03:14 pm »
You're gonna have to get the ABEC bearing upgrade for your power meter in the new house!

AJ

i've got a flux capacitor I've been working on

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #387 on: June 05, 2013, 09:38:26 pm »
Inverted optically centered dual projectors firing the same image at each other through a first surface mirror. Hopefully this won't cause a black hole or create a locked state of wave particle duality resulting in a non collapsing infinity of possible outcomes.

Wow!  Maximus, Quantum Entanglement, String Theroy, and Quantum Physics Oh my!

Is there anything you don't have a handle on?? ;D

Seriously, what do you do for a living?

Jigenjuke

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #388 on: June 05, 2013, 11:19:45 pm »
Lol I give rides in a crop dusting biplane for money ;)

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #389 on: June 05, 2013, 11:42:30 pm »
Saweet!  When I get out there I want to do some wing-walkin!  That's if the Cali gubment will let my tea-party ass in.

AJ

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #390 on: June 05, 2013, 11:47:27 pm »
Plenty of you right wing walkers here in San Diego with all the military around here you should be fine.  As for me I'm neo-Buddhist

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #391 on: June 06, 2013, 09:48:27 am »
Boxing out the projection area

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #392 on: June 06, 2013, 10:31:43 am »
Griff-

Will you have easy access to the projector controls once this part is installed? You're going to eventually get filter warnings (though I suspect you won't be running it for long periods of time). Are you able to remove the filter covers with those slots you already have cut?
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #393 on: June 06, 2013, 12:11:05 pm »
I'm not fully decided on how this unit is going to attach/dock with the main cabinet base, but whatever I do it will be easily removable for service, adjustment, cleaning and moving.

The quandary I am chewing over is one of vibration/shock and alignment. Because I'm working with extremely tight tolerances to get the maximum picture size in the smallest space, changes of angle or position of the projector as small as an eighth of an inch are enough to throw the projected images out of alignment. Also impact/shock and vibration could be an issue with hot projector bulbs breaking. Combine those issues with a style of machine that requires a bit of slamming and banging to play it properly and it causes some design headaches.

I'm still thinking over PL1's suggestions for a dynamic tilt built into the lock down bar area to minimize vibration through the cabinet and generally reduce the abuse the frame takes, not to mention the transmission of shock into the projector housing etc.

I may try keeping the housing completely separated from the case, just have it lifted into position under the cabinet. This way there's no chance of shock transmission and the cabinet will be heavy enough that it should stay put even with moderate to heavy nudging. Sure there may be a small chance of the cabinet moving out of alignment but it's an easy fix to realign and avoids the other risks of damaging the bulbs.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2013, 12:16:59 pm by Maximus »

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #394 on: June 06, 2013, 12:26:32 pm »
Couldn't you float the entire thing under there and isolate the mirrors and projectors on that floating platform?  So, like base of cabinet, with a finish washer:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/10-Stainless-Steel-Finishing-Washers-6-Pack-32721/202706391#.UbC3OZzAnQM
then the platform hanging from that on long bolts with a phillips raised countersunk screw that goes through the finish washer, through the cabinet bottom and suspends the shelf underneath?



AJ

I'm not fully decided on how this unit is going to attach/dock with the main cabinet base, but whatever I do it will be easily removable for service, adjustment, cleaning and moving.

The quandary I am chewing over is one of vibration/shock and alignment. Because I'm working with extremely tight tolerances to get the maximum picture size in the smallest space, changes of angle or position of the projector as small as an eighth of an inch are enough to throw the projected images out of alignment. Also impact/shock and vibration could be an issue with hot projector bulbs breaking. Combine those issues with a style of machine that requires a bit of slamming and banging to play it properly and it causes some design headaches.

I'm still thinking over PL1's suggestions for a dynamic tilt built into the lock down bar area to minimize vibration through the cabinet and generally reduce the abuse the frame takes, not to mention the transmission of shock into the projector housing etc.

I may try keeping the housing completely separated from the case, just have it lifted into position under the cabinet. This way there's no chance of shock transmission and the cabinet will be heavy enough that it should stay put even with moderate to heavy nudging. Sure there may be a small chance of the cabinet moving out of alignment but it's an easy fix to realign and avoids the other risks of damaging the bulbs.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #395 on: June 06, 2013, 12:33:58 pm »
Vibration is a good thing to worry about. I deal with projectors on a regular basis in my job, and you don't want to jostle it so hard the optics get out of whack. If that happens, you can use 3D glasses to look at your sides, because that's how colors will be shifted. I had a teacher do that with a projector. He claims it must have "fallen off the cart somehow". Knowing the guy like I do, I think it was trying to commit suicide.
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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #396 on: June 06, 2013, 12:35:37 pm »
Yep hanging the unit may work as long as it isolates vibration a little.

I guess it's one of those things where I'm only going to really know when I have more of the unit ready for testing. I'm using a tilt bob from a real pinball machine modified with three contacts for the three nudge functions in the VPin games, not analog I know, but at least it will use real-world kinetic energy to fire the nudges. Until I know how much force that will require to fire a nudge it's all up in the air.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #397 on: June 06, 2013, 12:37:23 pm »
You might try piecing together a larger version of the vibration isolation bolts commonly used in PC cases for harddrives (my antec uses them). Soft silicon washers on both sides of the case, and then screw into the HD goes a long way toward isolating it from vibrations and shock. just use bigger screws and washers.

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Re: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« Reply #398 on: June 06, 2013, 12:40:09 pm »
Yep soft isolators will definitely be worth a try too, it would be nice to have the projection box mated to the main base for sure, I just have to experiment and find the most effective approach.

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