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Dream features for a new PCI-e card for arcade games?
Xiaou2:
Some of the Devs have expressed interest in a Hardware based mame. I suggest you post on Mameworld forum, where a lot of them hang out. Even if they were not.. Im pretty sure someone would be interested. Any time there has been some hardware produced... eventually a version of mame has been created for it.
As for the idea... I think its cool. However, if you lock your technology into a video card... and then computers change Slot types due to new advances... your card will be obsolete.
Eventually, old Pc hardware will fail.. especially in these days, where things are made as cheaply as possible.
I wonder if some sort of pass-thru box might be a better idea? Stand-Alone device? I dunno.
I do also agree that some form of flash memory slot option may be nice as well.
(but not limited to that alone)
A big factor to consider, is making sure there is full unique controller capability.. such as spinners, trackballs, pedals, shifters... and even unique controllers. 4 speaker output would be good too. Shaker motors, Force Feedback wheels, Lamp output, arcade guns....etc..
When we think of Mame -vs- a hardware multikit... the advantage usually goes to mame in software format, because of mames flexibilities and lack of restrictions.
I think something has to be exceptional, and give functionality that isnt easily achieved in mame, to really be successful.
How about instead...to develop something to compliment the many missing things in emulated games, both mame, and elsewhere?
A common problem with Driving games is lack of good shifter support. There are multiple kinds of arcade shifters. 2 way arcade shifters cant be used with standard mame.. due to the press and release toggle issue. Shifters use hold-down to activate. But mame simply toggles by a button press.
Additionally, if you had an 4, 5, or 6 way shifter, NO emulated games, or console games, and even most PC games.. wouldnt allow its proper use. I think a system Could be developed to send pulses based on the position the shifter is in.
Analog shifter support would also be desired. Race Drivin's analog shifter design is probably the best ever developed. They would work great for Race Drivin as-is, as well as any other game... if they were read and translated correctly via hardware, to a digital form.
A toggle mode button(s), would allow flexibility for on-the-fly functionality changes, of the type of device, and how its being translated... for all around compatibility and flexibility. (allowing multiple shifter types if one really wanted it.. as well as ability to read multiple ways without too much hassle)
Then you have issued with force feedback. Mame only supports it externally, with Howards 'Mame Hooker' program. But most people have only basic wiring skill.. and do not have the hardware / electrical knowledge to out together a real force feedback wheel interface, coil interface...etc. With mame hooker (or similar) , and a simple pre-built kit, one could get a ffb wheel, or wire some Terminator 2 coils up... and have the correct arcade experience. It might also be used in conjunction with scripting/programming, in other emulators or games... to add things to games that never existed before. Such as a force feedback coil tripping when a character is hit on the screen, in a fighting game.
(a good example of this showed up recently with a program that looks for the Tron Light Cycle stage, then disables diagonals when it detects it)
Direct force feedback output might also be handled directly in mame, should the hardware be readily available...rather than use an outside program like Mamehooker. Missing hardware has always been a huge stumbling block.
Light output support, is in many devices.. However, Im not so sure how easy it is... or if its even possible.. to drive a games leds per emulation. Such as in Spy Hunters weapons lights... or T2's leds that flash based on the games gun power levels.
Real pinball control might be a farfetched output dream.. but with Pinmame and a good hardware kit.. Pinball machines might be able to be reproduced.
(or at least just some coils activated for better simulated flippers or pop bumper activity)
Malenko:
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm ---Some of the Devs have expressed interest in a Hardware based mame. I suggest you post on Mameworld forum, where a lot of them hang out. Even if they were not.. Im pretty sure someone would be interested. Any time there has been some hardware produced... eventually a version of mame has been created for it.
As for the idea... I think its cool. However, if you lock your technology into a video card... and then computers change Slot types due to new advances... your card will be obsolete.
Eventually, old Pc hardware will fail.. especially in these days, where things are made as cheaply as possible.
I wonder if some sort of pass-thru box might be a better idea? Stand-Alone device? I dunno.
I do also agree that some form of flash memory slot option may be nice as well.
(but not limited to that alone)
A big factor to consider, is making sure there is full unique controller capability.. such as spinners, trackballs, pedals, shifters... and even unique controllers. 4 speaker output would be good too. Shaker motors, Force Feedback wheels, Lamp output, arcade guns....etc..
When we think of Mame -vs- a hardware multikit... the advantage usually goes to mame in software format, because of mames flexibilities and lack of restrictions.
I think something has to be exceptional, and give functionality that isnt easily achieved in mame, to really be successful.
How about instead...to develop something to compliment the many missing things in emulated games, both mame, and elsewhere?
A common problem with Driving games is lack of good shifter support. There are multiple kinds of arcade shifters. 2 way arcade shifters cant be used with standard mame.. due to the press and release toggle issue. Shifters use hold-down to activate. But mame simply toggles by a button press.
Additionally, if you had an 4, 5, or 6 way shifter, NO emulated games, or console games, and even most PC games.. wouldnt allow its proper use. I think a system Could be developed to send pulses based on the position the shifter is in.
Analog shifter support would also be desired. Race Drivin's analog shifter design is probably the best ever developed. They would work great for Race Drivin as-is, as well as any other game... if they were read and translated correctly via hardware, to a digital form.
A toggle mode button(s), would allow flexibility for on-the-fly functionality changes, of the type of device, and how its being translated... for all around compatibility and flexibility. (allowing multiple shifter types if one really wanted it.. as well as ability to read multiple ways without too much hassle)
Then you have issued with force feedback. Mame only supports it externally, with Howards 'Mame Hooker' program. But most people have only basic wiring skill.. and do not have the hardware / electrical knowledge to out together a real force feedback wheel interface, coil interface...etc. With mame hooker (or similar) , and a simple pre-built kit, one could get a ffb wheel, or wire some Terminator 2 coils up... and have the correct arcade experience. It might also be used in conjunction with scripting/programming, in other emulators or games... to add things to games that never existed before. Such as a force feedback coil tripping when a character is hit on the screen, in a fighting game.
(a good example of this showed up recently with a program that looks for the Tron Light Cycle stage, then disables diagonals when it detects it)
Direct force feedback output might also be handled directly in mame, should the hardware be readily available...rather than use an outside program like Mamehooker. Missing hardware has always been a huge stumbling block.
Light output support, is in many devices.. However, Im not so sure how easy it is... or if its even possible.. to drive a games leds per emulation. Such as in Spy Hunters weapons lights... or T2's leds that flash based on the games gun power levels.
Real pinball control might be a farfetched output dream.. but with Pinmame and a good hardware kit.. Pinball machines might be able to be reproduced.
(or at least just some coils activated for better simulated flippers or pop bumper activity)
--- End quote ---
John Blund:
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm ---Some of the Devs have expressed interest in a Hardware based mame. I suggest you post on Mameworld forum, where a lot of them hang out. Even if they were not.. Im pretty sure someone would be interested. Any time there has been some hardware produced... eventually a version of mame has been created for it.
--- End quote ---
Ok, I will check that out. And I have started to learn about how MAME works, it looks like it wasn't that hard as I thought to begin with. I have found a couple of great recourses with inside information. There are many things to learn form the work with MAME and the source code. But the actual MAME software is something I will not use. MAME is emulation, and that is not what I am trying to do.
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm --- As for the idea... I think its cool. However, if you lock your technology into a video card... and then computers change Slot types due to new advances... your card will be obsolete.
Eventually, old Pc hardware will fail.. especially in these days, where things are made as cheaply as possible.
I wonder if some sort of pass-thru box might be a better idea? Stand-Alone device? I dunno.
I do also agree that some form of flash memory slot option may be nice as well.
(but not limited to that alone)
--- End quote ---
Well I can agree. The technology I will use, does not depend on things that go obsolete. And at the moment it looks like the device will be stand alone. And it will probably use some kind of flash card like SD-card. And it will be totally independent from other systems as much as possible.
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm --- A big factor to consider, is making sure there is full unique controller capability.. such as spinners, trackballs, pedals, shifters... and even unique controllers. 4 speaker output would be good too. Shaker motors, Force Feedback wheels, Lamp output, arcade guns....etc..
--- End quote ---
Well, when you make all the hardware, it is easy to support things like that. But for a normal PC, these king of things can be a big problem. Many companies that build components for PC's depend on making hardware obsolete to keep the competition away. Good examples of that is HDMI and Thunderbolt.
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm --- When we think of Mame -vs- a hardware multikit... the advantage usually goes to mame in software format, because of mames flexibilities and lack of restrictions.
I think something has to be exceptional, and give functionality that isnt easily achieved in mame, to really be successful.
How about instead...to develop something to compliment the many missing things in emulated games, both mame, and elsewhere?
--- End quote ---
Well to get rid of Windows, and Linux is a good start I think. They are only in the way if you try to make a good emulation. I think the PC has served well as a platform for emulation. But things has changed. And as the cost of hardware is going down, the biggest cost will eventually be to try to hang on to the chicken race.
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm ---Real pinball control might be a farfetched output dream.. but with Pinmame and a good hardware kit.. Pinball machines might be able to be reproduced.
(or at least just some coils activated for better simulated flippers or pop bumper activity)
--- End quote ---
I didn't know of Pinmame. I will look in to it.
PL1:
--- Quote from: John Blund on July 17, 2012, 06:46:29 pm ---
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 16, 2012, 11:52:34 pm ---Real pinball control might be a farfetched output dream.. but with Pinmame and a good hardware kit.. Pinball machines might be able to be reproduced.
(or at least just some coils activated for better simulated flippers or pop bumper activity)
--- End quote ---
I didn't know of Pinmame. I will look in to it.
--- End quote ---
Here's the place to look.
http://www.vpforums.org/index.php?
Scott
Yvan256:
You mean something like FPGA Arcade?
My wish-list of features for such a product are:
- stand-alone (no Windows, no Linux, no Mac required)
- can work from a small power supply (ATX is way too big for small projects)
- can access ROM files via CompactFlash or SD cards
- JAMMA connector + whatever other standard connectors for things not available on JAMMA. I'm thinking about maybe using the DB15 Neo-Geo game ports? DB15 connectors are easy to find, even in 2012.
- stereo line level output (1/8" stereo connector would be fine)
- can output to composite, S-Video, VGA, DVI-D/HDMI (you never know what kind of monitor each project might require)
- hardware scanning lines options would be nice, if the output resolution allows it (depending on which video output was used, of course)
- built-in game selection interface (nothing fancy, but configurable to at least one full-screen image per game, or ideally using a 32-bit PNG for each game and a 32-bit PNG for the interface overlay to save space and keep the interface editing to a minimum)
- two 8-way joysticks with 6 buttons per player minimum
- trackball and spinner
- steering wheel, accelerator and brake pedals
- coin mechanisms + player start buttons
- Neo-Geo features (game select button, multi-cart with highlighted selection for DIY backlight mini-marquees, from 1 to 6 games, dual 7-segment credit displays for each player)
- output the selected ROM filename on a SPI port (or something) for dynamic LCD marquees, even from the game selection interface
So, as you see, I'm not asking for much. ;)
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