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Why current age 'video gaming' is a joke

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danny_galaga:

--- Quote from: 404 on July 06, 2012, 01:04:41 pm ---
--- Quote from: Well Fed Games on July 06, 2012, 11:09:20 am ---Hmm. Definitely disagree with your summary of indie development. A lot of new programmers basically re-make the games they loved when they were younger as a way to learn, but I think most of the popular retro-styled indie stuff adds a lot of new stuff or refines the gameplay for modern tastes (Super Meat Boy, Spelunky, Braid, etc.)  I mean, blatant copying happens way too much, even of new game concepts, but not sure if it characterizes all of indie game development. Care to mention the name of that Castlevania rip-off? Perhaps it was more of an homage?

--- End quote ---

Hence why I wrote this:

--- Quote from: 404 on July 06, 2012, 09:24:53 am ---I don't have a problem with developers adding new elements to classically inspired games. I just have a problem with guys that do nothing more than steal the IP of other, larger companies who published the same exact game 25 years earlier, changing a few pixels and pushing this garbage over steam in order to make a quick buck.

--- End quote ---

http://www.destructoid.com/creator-of-iwbtg-is-making-a-castlevania-esque-platformer-227389.phtml

The castlevania clone is just a clear example of what I'm talking about. Sure, castlevania has had its fair share of clones over the years but this is just a blatant copy.  Another being retro city rampage. A classic GTA clone with clear ripoffs (they like to call them inspired references) to mario, contra, ninja turtles, back to the future, bionic commando and at least a dozen other games. Where's the originality in this? For the record, there was already a freely available classic gta clone years ago. A whole year before the same author released grand theftendo.

--- End quote ---

 :dunno

Free market. They aren't ripping off code, are they? How many 'rip offs' of Coke are there? You are free to pick the one you want...

shmokes:

--- Quote from: danny_galaga on July 07, 2012, 12:53:44 am ---
Free market. They aren't ripping off code, are they?

--- End quote ---

Why is 'free market' not an equally acceptable answer to ripping off code?

Xiaou2:

--- Quote ---this is where me and you are just going to have to agree to disagree. IMO, there are penty of free homebrew games that pay homage to classic games nearly all of them are free and readily available. This has been going on for years and while some companies are bothered by it, some others are flattered, as they should be. However when you go about stealing the concept physics and other dynamics from a game, change a few pixels around and sell it to a mass market, that's just theft in my eyes. They are undercutting the original authors. Not to mention there is almost no excuse to play the original games. There are tons of oldschool titles sold on compilation discs, psn, xbox live, wii channel etc.
--- End quote ---

Lets say you want to make a Marble Madness Clone...  But, you realize you cant do it for free, cause you need to pay all kinds of talent to actually finish the project.  Sadly, most people, when faced with the Reality of all the hard work that goes into a game, disappear quickly.

 You call Midway up... And they tell you that they wont allow you to purchase the rights.  They would program it themselves IF they thought the idea was good... BUT, they wont ever remake MM cause its a puzzle game, and puzzle games dont sell well.

 Now what?

 I can understand your viewpoint, and in certain cases, I agree.  But in a case like this, and many other cases... I disagree.

 Many of these games have already made their money ages ago.   And if the company wanted to make a new version, they are well and free to do so... and would probably trounce all over your efforts, due to the manpower, experience, and talent, behind them.

 The Classic download packs are a joke.  They probably cost more to set up & run than any company ever makes on them.  And worse yet, they are a rip-off... offering almost nothing extra to the person buying them, AND, having substandard controls to boot.

 Corporate re-issue game packs have always been a rip off.  Its only recently that emulation has improved things, merely from the fact that theres no need to reprogram a game from scratch (in most cases).

 
And as said... Almost everything you see is a derivative and or copy of something from the past. 

 Personally, I cant see why anyone would want to make an Identical game.  I always want to take what was, and Add something to the mix.  Graphics are just a shell, but good gameplay is key.

404:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 07, 2012, 01:24:59 am ---Lets say you want to make a Marble Madness Clone...  But, you realize you cant do it for free, cause you need to pay all kinds of talent to actually finish the project.  Sadly, most people, when faced with the Reality of all the hard work that goes into a game, disappear quickly.
--- End quote ---

If you aren't talented enough to make the game then who's fault is it?



--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 07, 2012, 01:24:59 am --- You call Midway up... And they tell you that they wont allow you to purchase the rights.  They would program it themselves IF they thought the idea was good... BUT, they wont ever remake MM cause its a puzzle game, and puzzle games dont sell well.
--- End quote ---

Can you really blame them for protecting their IP?

 Many of these games have already made their money ages ago.   And if the company wanted to make a new version, they are well and free to do so... and would probably trounce all over your efforts, due to the manpower, experience, and talent, behind them.


--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 07, 2012, 01:24:59 am ---The Classic download packs are a joke.  They probably cost more to set up & run than any company ever makes on them.  And worse yet, they are a rip-off... offering almost nothing extra to the person buying them, AND, having substandard controls to boot.

 Corporate re-issue game packs have always been a rip off.  Its only recently that emulation has improved things, merely from the fact that theres no need to reprogram a game from scratch (in most cases).
--- End quote ---

I'm not here to debate how good the game packs are. There are plenty of other ways to get the games you want.


--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 07, 2012, 01:24:59 am --- Personally, I cant see why anyone would want to make an Identical game.  I always want to take what was, and Add something to the mix.  Graphics are just a shell, but good gameplay is key.

--- End quote ---

Agree 100%

As i mentioned before, there are tons of platform games over the decades that take aspects from other platform titles and so fourth. I have zero problem with that. I have a problem with some of these guys that want to make a quick buck creating an "indy" title completely based off of another franchise with zero originality whatsoever.

Xiaou2:

--- Quote ---As i mentioned before, there are tons of platform games over the decades that take aspects from other platform titles and so fourth. I have zero problem with that. I have a problem with some of these guys that want to make a quick buck creating an "indy" title completely based off of another franchise with zero originality whatsoever.
--- End quote ---

 What about all those FPS games they have made in the last 20yrs?   The gameplay mechanics are pretty much identical.  The only thing that changes, are layouts, graphics, sounds, and story.   Which is pretty much the same as the scenario as the Indie situation you speak of...

 Once you start thinking about chopping up games by mechanics however.. it could ruin the entire creative industry.  As only a company with millions of dollars behind it could afford the lawyers to actually produce anything without a lawsuit, as well as need for legal standings on every move you made, and licensing that big companies will never give out to the little guys.

 
--- Quote ---Can you really blame them for protecting their IP?
--- End quote ---

 If they never intend to USE that IP, then whats the use protecting it?  Why not allow others the use of it, and share in the profits?   Its pathetic man. Really pathetic.  A corporation does not care about the artistry and preservation.  They would let a game Rot.. merely cause its a business, and nothing else.  Luckily we have things like Mame, else the past would be lost forever.   When we talk about things like this... we realize, that its not a Black and White matter at all.  Legality isnt always the right thing.


--- Quote ---If you aren't talented enough to make the game then who's fault is it?
--- End quote ---

 Making a game relies on Multiple disciplines.  Its very rare that there are people out there that can: Program, Create sounds, Compose Music,  Render in 3D, Draw in 2d, and make excellent challenging levels.   To make a great game, you need many excellent players in your band.   Not many band members are going to work for free, let along work for free making a free game.  Especially if they are Told what to do, rather than getting a say in it. And frankly put, thats when problems occur.  People like programmers want to change vital gameplay elements... and they simply dont understand how bad that can ruin a game.  But unless you have the money to keep them doing it the Right way... then you will end up with a big mess.


--- Quote ---There are plenty of other ways to get the games you want.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, LUCKILY not everyone has a stick up their butts, and doesnt think in pure black and white...

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