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spinner sensitivity

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tony.silveira:

hey guys,

i have a small issue with my turbo twist 2 spinners, they seem to be way to sensitive and i'm getting what i think is called backspin.  meaning, if i spin it really hard in one direction, it registers as if it's going the other way.  is there some windows setting where i can cut the sensitivity?  i've tried the sensitivity in mame but that doesn't really seem to help.

thanks

gamuhar:

What MAME, what game, what Windows? Did they work properly before, what MAME, game and Windows was then?

There is "mouse polling rate" in Windows set as default to 125Hz. If you think some software or new hardware drivers might have changed that value then you should check it by downloading program called "mouserate". If it's already at 125Hz don't set it any lower, and actually you may try increasing the rate, but I'd assume the real problem in that case would be somewhere else, MAME settings most likely.

I'd try temporarily moving or deleting INI file and stuff in CFG folder, then take at least three games and test it again.



In another thread about 720 Degrees controller I am stuck at similar question as yours, only I don't have a spinner yet, so if you take 720 degrees game for one of your test games you will help us both solve our problems, besides 720 Degrees is excellent game to test your spinner accuracy and robustness all in the same time.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=117130.0



If you don't already have a dot you can just mark it with a piece of sticky tape, screw-handle is optional. The point of the test is to set up sensitivity in MAME so the dot always points the same way as character by matching their rotation 1:1. Then start making turns all in one direction and the number of turns you can make before the dot de-synchronize with the character will determine spinner's accuracy and robustness. Ideally, if it's possible to match rotations 1:1 via sensitivity settings, and if the spinner is well made, you should be able to make dozens, if not hundreds, of full circles in one direction with the dot and the character still being aligned.

RandyT:


True "backspin" is not possible with any TurboTwist2's shipped after 03/09.  There is code in the controller to prevent any possibility of this happening.  Increasing the mouse polling rate will prevent it with earlier versions.  Regardless, there are no games which require the hard spin where this could occur, so it has no effect on actual gameplay, even with the earlier units.

Something else to keep in mind is that some "backspin" will be tied specifically to the game you are playing, meaning that if you can do it with the post 03/09 TurboTwist2, it can be done with the original spinner as well.  A good example of this is with Tempest.  A sensitivity setting of 6 will give a 1:1 resolution correlation to the actual controller shipped with the game.  But that particular ROM will show backspin if the spinner is spun hard enough.  It will do this with any spinner, including the original.  As for the sensitivity setting in MAME not having any effect, I don't believe that this is actually the case.  It may not eradicate what you have been observing, but the lower settings should improve it considerably.  Higher sensitivity settings than 6 in Tempest, for example, will exacerbate the issue inherent to this particular ROM.

As for 720, it looks like the same resolution encoder was used for that game as was used for Tempest, and being that both are Atari titles, I wouldn't hold much hope for any regular spinner being able to stay in sync.  There is a reason why that title included an extra index wheel to re-sync with the control on every rotation, and I believe it has equally to do with the initial syncing of the control position upon power up, as well as the possibility that the user could induce a "backspin" which would un-sync it in the absence of the regularly occurring index pulse.  Also, since the original was "geared" through the use of a chain mechanism, one would need to know exactly the number of pulses per revolution to get the sensitivity correct.  If this is off by even the tiniest bit, sync would be lost.

To do a proper controller of this nature, the same type of setup would need to be duplicated.  Something as simple as a magnetic reed switch in proper proximity of a small magnet attached to the ESC, or other holder fixed to the lower part of the shaft, should be able to provide a reasonably good index pulse for this purpose.  The game would also need to support a "button" for the index input, which IIRC, later versions do.

RandyT

gamuhar:


--- Quote from: RandyT on June 03, 2012, 02:55:19 am ---As for 720, it looks like the same resolution encoder was used for that game as was used for Tempest, and being that both are Atari titles, I wouldn't hold much hope for any regular spinner being able to stay in sync.  There is a reason why that title included an extra index wheel to re-sync with the control on every rotation, and I believe it has equally to do with the initial syncing of the control position upon power up, as well as the possibility that the user could induce a "backspin" which would un-sync it in the absence of the regularly occurring index pulse.  Also, since the original was "geared" through the use of a chain mechanism, one would need to know exactly the number of pulses per revolution to get the sensitivity correct.  If this is off by even the tiniest bit, sync would be lost.

--- End quote ---

Sounds like a bet to me. How about I make an order for two spinners from you right now. Then you perform the test as I described above, but try as best as you can to first match rotation 1:1, and if you then make more than 10 full circles without de-synchronization you give me one spinner for free. How about it?

Although, it sounds like you'd be betting against your own spinners. Never underestimate the power of your own spinners, maaan!! I'd bet they can be synchronized perfectly with ANY game and stay in sync for hundreds and thousands of turns! You get to sell at least one spinner in any case, so do you accept the bet?

RandyT:

No need for such silliness.  If the code in 720 checks the index after the first time the control is calibrated, and I am quite sure it does, then it does so for the reasons I described above.  Otherwise, it's just wasting cycles.  If the game itself needs to keep checking for synchronization with it's own control, then it similarly will need to do so with any other.  Also, if the number of pulses per revolution, as defined by the gearing, is not evenly divisible as whole percentage points into the native 1200 transitions of the TT2, then it's an exercise in futility.

Relative positioning encoders <> absolute positioning encoders.  The TT2 (and every other normal spinner, mouse, trackball, etc...) is the former, and the 720 controller is much more closely related to the latter.

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