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Why does shipping from China take so long?
kahlid74:
--- Quote from: Grasshopper on May 13, 2012, 09:51:32 am ---What you've just described was essentially plan B, for when our manufacturing sector became uncompetitive. And for a few decades we (more or less) got away with it. However, even the relatively well paid knowledge-based jobs are beginning to be outsourced to places like China and India, and there doesn't appear to be a plan C.
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Don't believe all the hype about outsourcing, it's not happening anywhere close to the scale you think it is. It's security theater, to rile up supporters and gain political advantage. Does outsourcing happen? Yes. Are well paid knowledge-based jobs coming back to countries originally farming them out? Yes. Is it the end of the world? Nope.
--- Quote from: Howard_Casto on May 12, 2012, 07:47:21 pm ---Anything more complex than a toaster (ironically including your average toaster) is made in China. 90% of the shelves in your local S-mart are stocked with Chineese merch. Even "American" and "Japanese" products have 50-90% of their components made in China.
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I think your percentages are a bit off and difficult to actually prove. There is also still a significant difference in capacitors/transistors made in Japan vs China.
--- Quote from: Howard_Casto on May 12, 2012, 07:47:21 pm ---Our industrial age was several decades ago. We are now in the business of services and r&d... get used to it, this is how capitalism works. I don't think people understand that the local economy doesn't exist anymore. It's been purely global for decades, ESPECIALLY when the internet poped up. China in terms of their social-economic state are stuck in the 50's in many respects. It's their turn to work factories. Don't worry, when the next industrial age hits we'll be ready.
Also communism isn't bad, nor are the Chinese people or their businesses. It's just the creepy little fat kid that opresses them that is bad. ;) As a whole the business aspect of China is very similar to our own countries.
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It always irks me when people call China Communist. Their country is anything but communist. They are closer to a capitalist dictatorship than anything else.
Vigo:
--- Quote from: kahlid74 on May 14, 2012, 09:47:49 am ---It always irks me when people call China Communist. Their country is anything but communist. They are closer to a capitalist dictatorship than anything else.
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Well, a capitalist dictatorship is not right at all. First, a dictatorship would require a dictator. China actually is single party controlled and can place anyone they want as president. Second, capitalism requires the notion of private property rights which are not granted under the Chinese constitution. There have been some watered down laws recently in China granting certain land use privileges and personal assets, but the fact is that according to the Chinese government, everything people have is still granted and owned by the gov't. Combine that with the fact that the single party in control of China is in fact the Communist party, and that they impose abolishment of religion, widespread censorship of information, and they are a de facto party (there is no legal means for an opposing party to take control), Calling China a communist country is actually a much closer definition.
kahlid74:
--- Quote from: Vigo on May 14, 2012, 01:20:23 pm ---
--- Quote from: kahlid74 on May 14, 2012, 09:47:49 am ---It always irks me when people call China Communist. Their country is anything but communist. They are closer to a capitalist dictatorship than anything else.
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Well, a capitalist dictatorship is not right at all. First, a dictatorship would require a dictator. China actually is single party controlled and can place anyone they want as president. Second, capitalism requires the notion of private property rights which are not granted under the Chinese constitution. There have been some watered down laws recently in China granting certain land use privileges and personal assets, but the fact is that according to the Chinese government, everything people have is still granted and owned by the gov't. Combine that with the fact that the single party in control of China is in fact the Communist party, and that they impose abolishment of religion, widespread censorship of information, and they are a de facto party (there is no legal means for an opposing party to take control), Calling China a communist country is actually a much closer definition.
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All great points. My thoughts however dealt more with that even though the "communist" party is in control, behind closed doors a select few members of said communist party actually control all of the wealth and power, really IMO making it feel like a dictatorship. As far as the Gov't owning everything sure, but if person A has a 4000 sq house with 4 Mercedes Benz's and Person B works for FoxConn at $1 per hour, that's not really communism is it? Isn't the true point of communism that all are equal regardless of skill? Everyone gets enough for their selves right?
China is struggling with it because they've allowed businesses to grow at a rate where personal wealth is beginning to thrive in China, which doesn't exist in communism. So they're in this new world somewhere between the economic freedoms of capitalism and the social constraints of communism.
Vigo:
Even in a pure communist country, being classless is only an ideal that is never achieved. But yeah, I understand your overall point though, people are allowed to succeed. China has allowed for a far less regulated trade that any form of communism in the past, seperating it from a country like North Korea.
I think you are right about their internal struggle as well. There is a push for a number of laws that go against the China constitution, but at the same without certain changes they are not allowed to progress like they would like.
BadMouth:
....OH, you meant the hippie kind of communism.
(Item from India should be delivered today :D )