Basic CRT EMU driver questions

[Tatas]

Calamity,

I'm not sure I'm doing things properly at this point.  Originally I had some difficulty with TV output that caused me to delay in using your crtemu drivers.  I've now since gone back and uninstalled the latest ATI drivers and replaced them with yours(as well as replacing the CCC with your version).  I then proceed to begin using VMMaker.  This is where I think I have made a mistake.  I changed the VMMaker.ini file so that the Monitor Type variable is set to NTSC.  I felt that it best matched the screen I was using.  I'm using a 27" Sony Trinitron Flat-Screen CRT television hooked up to my PC via Component (RGB cables).  Running Arcade_OSD I see that only around 50 or so modelines have been generated, when by reading the forums here it seems I should be getting around 120.  Should I set it to something else?  Emulation has improved even with the 50 or so lines, games like Puzzle Bobble 2,3, and 4, which used to studder horribly (even though I have a 3.2 GHz dual core WinXP x64 system), now run great.  However games like DoDonPachi, which looked pretty decent at 640x480 (forced by the old drivers) now seem very squished on screen and only take up a very small portion of it.  Please help.  Thanks.

[Tatas]

To add a little more info, I'm using an ATI HD4870.  With this card I'm not sure if I need to change from the static dot clock setting that is in the ini file.

[Calamity]

Hi Tatas,

Have a look at the Modeline.txt file inside and see how many modelines where created. If the number matches the one you get with Arcade_OSD, everything is fine, otherwise if there are more modelines there it means that the hacked version of Catalyst is not active, and has been replaced by the default one, which only supports 60 modelines.

Attach a log of the ddonpachi game (command line: groovymame ddonpachi -v -md 4 >ddonpachi.txt) so I can see what's happening.

HD 4870 needs no special dotclock settings.

[Tatas]

Thanks for the answers.  I'll check this stuff and get back with you.

[Tatas]

Ok.  I've checked the modeline.txt file and it only contains 60 modelines.  As you say, the hacked Catalyst driver must not be working.  Any recommendations to get all the drivers stripped off so I can start things from scratch again.  It's very possible that there are remnants of the newer driver still there.

[Tatas]

Alright, I've uninstalled the drivers and the CCC package.  I used driver sweeper and regcleaner to make sure all parts of it were gone.  I then reinstalled the modified 9.3 catalyst driver and ran VMMaker.  Again this only produced 60 modelines when choosing "NTSC" as the monitor type.  Just for fun I switched it back to "Custom" as the file has it set natively.  Voila, 118 modes detected.  I tested out a few games and things look good.  However some games are still causing issues DoDonPachi is one of them.  I've attached the txt file as you've asked.  It looks like the 57HZ it's trying to use might be out of range for the TV.  Another side issue is that Hyperspin will now no longer launch.  Not sure how it's related to the steps I've taken, but I'll be troubleshooting that in the meantime.  Thanks again for your help.

[Calamity]

Hi Tatas,

The HS problem with CRT_Emudriver is a classic indeed, it crashes when there are too many modelines installed in the system. That should be fixed in HS 2.0.

There's a temporary workaround for it (check this thread, "magic resolutions"):

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=110905.msg1209299#msg1209299

You'll probably need to make a custom monitor_specs line for your TV, limiting lower vertical refresh to something higher than 57.55 Hz.

[Tatas]

Roger that.  Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.  I'll get to work on this tomorrow night when I get back in town.

[Tatas]

Ok, I followed the link your provided and thought I followed the steps correctly, but it seems I've taken a few steps backwards now.  Now I have difficulty running just about any game.  The screen flips constantly and seems to be pushed to the left.  I've attached the output files for two sample games (dodonpachi and puzzle bobble 3).  I've also attached my vmmaker.ini and modeline.txt file.  I tried changing what I thought was the lower end of the v freq., but that doesn't seem to change the accepted modelines list. 

monitor_specs_0 = "15625-16200, 58-65.00, 2.000, 4.700, 8.000, 0.064, 0.160, 1.056, 0, 0, 288, 448"


It still looks like frequencies of lower than 58 are being chosen.  Thank You.

[Tatas]

It looks as if every "magic" resolution is flipping vertically on me.  I've reverted the modeline a bit after reading some more.  I'm now attempting to use:

monitor_specs_0 = "15625-15800, 49-65.00, 2.000, 4.700, 8.000, 0.064, 0.160, 1.056, 0, 0, 288, 448"


Unfortunately it doesn't seem like anything is changing after modifying this line in the vmmaker.ini, running vmmaker, and then rebooting.  I still see the vertical flipping of the picture.

[Calamity]

After looking through your logs everything seems fine but for the -video ddraw, that could be the problem, try changing it to -video d3d if using "magic" resolutions.

You need to add the same monitor_specs line to VMMaker.ini and to mame.ini, otherwise GM won't follow. There's a slight difference in syntax, check this thread: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=116023.0

Unfortunately, the lower vertical refresh limit doesn't work very well and can be underflowed when the horizontal frequency is forced to keep below its max value (15800). This happens because the horizontal frequency value (= monitor-breaker value) check has higher priority. This is a flaw in the modeline generator I'm aware of, I'll try to fix it at some point.

[Tatas]

Interesting.  I have a sneaking suspicion that I don't have a mame.ini file.  I know I haven't created one from the command line.  Also, would I be hurting myself if I haven't installed directx yet?  I don't think I did that when I built this XP x64 build.  Could that be affecting the ddraw?

[Tatas]

OK, I was correct.  I was not using a Mame.ini file.  I have used the switch -createconfig with groovymame and I now have one.  I also installed DirectX just in case it was needed.  I've attached the VMMaker.ini and Mame.ini files that I'm using.  I switched to d3d for -video and I think I have the monitor_specs variables set correctly.  For some reason things still aren't working.  I'm trying to use the magic resolutions approach, but a lot of games are still having issues with the flipping screen.  I've attached two zip files, one testing with NTSC as the mode, and one testing with CUSTOM/GENERIC).  They also contain a txt output file for two games, one for Mortal Kombat which does not flip in NTSC mode, but does with CUSTOM.  The other game is Killer Instinct, which is still flipping the picture with either mode.  Any ideas?  Sorry to be such a pain on this, I just would really like to have things looking good and I'm sure your program can do that.  Unfortunately I've got a party coming up soon that I was hoping to have the cabinet working for.  Could you show me how to remove a few of the extra modes that cause Hyperspin not to launch when using the default CRTEMU driver method(120+ modes) as a last resort?  I'd at least like to have most of the games working well until I can figure out the "Magic" modes.  Thanks again

[Calamity]

It's definitely odd because the only mode which doesn't flip is mk with hfreq of 15.2 KHz, everything with a higher hfreq flips... can you check this with Arcade_OSD?

You would need to use a line like this:

monitor_specs0  15200-15500, 49-65.00, 2.000, 4.700, 8.000, 0.064, 0.160, 1.056, 0, 0, 288, 448

And keep lowering the 15500 value until it gets fixed.

Anyway if that's the issue I don't undestand why it should work with the normal approach (120 modelines). In order to reduce the number of modelines, edit the TotalModes option in vmmaker.ini with a value of 80-90 and recalculate the modelines. Find the figure that keeps HS working in your system.

[Tatas]

Thanks a ton Calamity.  I'll try that.  When using the magic modes.  I see that in the Arcade OSD, most modes are set as Native, but there are around 4 or 5 maybe that are custom.  Most of them display ok, but a few do flip.  I will post back with the results.  Thanks.

[Tatas]

Also, the mode that MK is picking doesn't really even look right.  It doesn't flip, but it definitely doesn't look as good as what ever mode the original Custom settings with 120 modelines chose.  That seemed spot on.

[Calamity]

There's something else I forgot.

Don't use the NTSC settings for serious stuff specially with magic resolutions. The problem is that as the hfreq window for NTSC is so narrow, it just creates too few modelines. That's why you're seeing very few custom modes in Arcade_OSD. This wouldn't matter if it wasn't because the dynamic modeline method does not work unless at least 17-20 custom modelines are defined in the system. That's why you're seeing very few custom modes in Arcade_OSD.

[Tatas]

Ok, I've verified that I'm seeing 25 custom modelines created as they all show up in Arcade_OSD.  I've attached 3 pictures of what my Arcade_OSD looks like.  The first has the initial batch of modelines created (I don't think they are the magic ones, as they don't start with an xres of 1234).  These all display properly.  The second image is of some of the "Magic" resolutions.  None of these display properly, they all flip.  I've tried changing the Hfreq all the way down to 15300.  So my modeline eventually looked like 15200-15300, 49-65.00, 2.000, 4.700, 8.000, 0.064, 0.160, 1.056, 0, 0, 288, 448.  The third picture show's what the flipping image looks like.  I'm wondering now, if the issue isn't the fact that the xres is too high.  If it's trying to display 1234 as the X value, it will never show properly.  I think that 720 is the max value that this TV will display.  I've got the desktop running at 720x480, anything higher and it also will flip.

[Calamity]

I'm wondering now, if the issue isn't the fact that the xres is too high.

Well, I must admit that it looks like that's the issue indeed, though its VERY odd, I mean the TV should not care about horizontal resolution, only vertical resolution is critical for CRTs. It's also strange that some normal modes also had the same flipping problem, is that right? Does it fail either with progressive and interlaced modes?

Looking through your modelines everything seems fine. There are two possibilities I can think of:

- Video modes are not properly created by the driver, for whatever reason.
- Your TV has a digital chassis that's introducing some issues.

Of course the best test you could do is trying to plug another TV while the screen is flipping. You can also try to switch it off and back on to see if the mode is properly recognized by doing so. The chasis might be fooled by the signal changes or something. I'm sorry I can't be of more help.