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RIP Amy Winehouse

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AtomSmasher:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 24, 2011, 03:28:12 pm --- If you dont have compassion for your fellow man or woman, why should anyone care about you, at the time you need people the most?

--- End quote ---
I have all kinds of compassion for my fellow man and woman, which is why I wouldn't say those things if she was still alive.  Now that she's gone, theres no point in wallowing in sorrow for her.  Sure, she might have had a hard life, but guess what, a lot of people have a hard life and turn out fine (from the stories you've told, you should know this better then most), and most of those people who turn out fine don't have a boatload of cash and tons of friends to support them.  She had everything going for her and showed zero interest in bettering herself even when everyone around her begged her to, and now that she's gone theres no reason to feel sorry for her.

Sometimes your purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.

Howard_Casto:
I just believe in self-responsiblity. 

If this was a woman that was abused, poverty striken, and didn't have friends or family trying to help her then my opinion of her death would be wildly different.  When you have that kind of money and people are trying to help you with your problem, you refuse and then you die because of it then it's your falut and yours alone.  I never like to see anybody die, but sometimes you get what is coming to you. 

Religion is the worst cop-out for self-responsibility btw.  When someone does something bad they did it...  it wasn't the devil it was them.  Likewise when a doctor saves your life it is the incredibly medical staff that helped you, it wasn't a miracle.  This can be applied to communially good and bad actions as well. 

Life isn't black and white but when you understand that everyone is responsible for their own actions and vices then a whole hell of a lot of gray is washed away. 

Xiaou2:

--- Quote ---I just believe in self-responsiblity.
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---and didn't have friends or family trying to help
--- End quote ---

Those two statements conflict.
 
 If you believe in self responsibility, then in a way, you dont believe anyone should help you.  In the way in which you have responded, that indeed is the way you view things.

 And because you are strong enough to be able to handle yourself without help from others... it works just fine 'for you'.  And is very easy to cast the opposing view onto others less fortunate in 'internal strength'.


--- Quote ---She had everything going for her
--- End quote ---

 As Ive said before, it doesnt matter if you have all the money (or friends) in the world.  If you are internally a mess... everything will turn for the worst.

 My uncle is a Alcoholic.  Though, unlike Amy, he is verbally / mentally abusive to others... which is much much harder to forgive.  His father drank himself to death, and was also abusive.  His mother, allows him to act out in rage, and lets him do whatever he desires without a single word.  And because of this, his behavior is that of a beastly nasty 7yr old, in a 50 yr old body.

 However, on the flip side... hes not a murderer or bank robber. He also helps out friends who are in need.

 The stuff that effected me, was a fraction that was laid upon him and his brother and sister.  And because of that, its understandable that I was much more able to pull myself out of the hole... where they have not been able to do so.  Its not an excuse... but its a realization, that when the hole is 3000 more feet deep... some just may never see the light of day.

 IMOP, its the system that fails these people, far more than themselves.

 If dangerous & illegal behavior is found... mandatory rehab, anger management, psychological sessions..etc.. should be required & enforced.   A mere fine and finger wagging isnt going to change things.  Which is why drunk drivers are going to continue to end up taking innocent peoples lives.


 Anyway, some of you may have heard some of the twisted things I had done as a kid. The way I responded... was black as could be.  If some people hadnt saw past that, saw my potentials, loved me unconditionally, & for the little bit of good in me... rather than the darkness that I contained at that time... I might have become a crazed monster, rotting in prison.  Luckily, not everyone was as harsh a judge as some here... and I was given the chance to grow into a better person (which took like +10yrs of hard fought efforts)... rather than be stoned to hell immediately.


 Im not saying Cry for these people.  But to rip a snide harsh comment and judgment about them, is just not right IMOP.

Edit:

 Additionally, I dont believe I ever mentioned Religion. Nor did anyone else.  And while I do not agree with much of organized religion, I also feel that forceful anti-religion can be just as.. if not much more, messed up.  You obviously have an Axe to grind when you make it a point to bring it up.

 As for life, its more than black and white, or even gray.  Its a Rainbow of colors.  Of Infinite possibilities.

kalars123:

--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on July 24, 2011, 08:03:50 pm ---
 IMOP, its the system that fails these people, far more than themselves.

 If dangerous & illegal behavior is found... mandatory rehab, anger management, psychological sessions..etc.. should be required & enforced.   A mere fine and finger wagging isnt going to change things.  Which is why drunk drivers are going to continue to end up taking innocent peoples lives.

--- End quote ---

I wasn't going to post on this because drug addiction is a very personal subject for me, but saying the system is at fault? That just strait pisses me off, there isn't anything wrong with the "system" the "system" works just fine the problem is SELF-ACCOUNTABILITY, I have been through the "system" I have had several friends that have been through the "system", in 8/10 cases it's not the "system" that fails it's the person not wanting to take responsibility for their actions or just not giving a crap. Amy Winehouse is of the later group, she just straight didn't care about herself or anyone else that was affected by her actions I will shed no tear for her nor will I grieve her in the slightest.  IN FACT I will probably use her as an example for my children and tell them this is what happens to you when you don't take care about yourself and take responsibility.

Some friends I have had and lost that went through the system just didn't care they wanted to do what they wanted to do, regardless of the consequences, who are you to say that the "system" failed them. They failed them selves and while I will and do grieve for their family's, I do not and will never grieve for them they got what they were asking for.

Xiaou2:
Its obvious you are angered at losing them, so maybe you are taking it out on anyone who has a problem.

 I never said that it was the Systems fault. However, the system does not work well, and does share some things to blame.

 I said to have compassion for those not strong "internally" as ourselves.

 Just because you know the consequences of actions, does not make you strong enough to overcome them.

 As I said, if it were So EASY, then there wouldnt be so much loss would there?

 And as I said before... which I believe you skipped right over... is that without a much more harsh penalty system & much better therapy, people are going to be running over others in drunk driving accidents.  IE: If someone gets 2 DUI's in a years time, there should be a forced evaluation, with frequent checkups, and possibly limited driving privileges.

 Currently I know how bad the system is, because both my uncle and my father have evaded it for nearly their entire lives.   And when they did get into it, it was a joke.

 My father, an ex-postal worker, was making threats of blowing up the building with pipe bombs, in his past. Hes was arrested in florida for something, and with one legal slip up, he was able to escape evaluation / treatment.  It was only after he came back up here, that he was arrested again for something different, that they finally had him evaluated and forced into a few programs. 30 yrs way too late.
And had they dealt with his father... maybe he would not have died at the age of 35 from liver poisoning... as well as possibly taking away the kids much earlier, or kicking the him out, sparing the kids from a life of torture, which ultimately ruined them.

 Good for you that the system did work for you.   But sadly, not so good for those it did not work for... and those who are never ever forced to be in any system.  And yeah, reckless people need to be forced into these programs... Unless we just take away their licenses on the 2nd DUI.

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