Author Topic: greyhound crane claw problem (Read 13758 times)

thelosthero · « **on:** May 18, 2011, 04:23:54 pm »

so i just bought my first skill crane it is a push button greyhound crane. the problem im having is the claw drops like 6-8 inches closes and returns home. can any1 maybe tell me where to start to figure it out like my profile says ima newbie with these

thelosthero · « **Reply #1 on:** May 18, 2011, 06:31:17 pm »

so i think i its some kinda limit switch my friend came over and helped me look at it. i think the string is bad its kinda frayed after like 3 in or so

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #2 on:** May 18, 2011, 09:42:08 pm »

Definitely check the length and condition of the string. You are correct, there is a limit switch that tells the machine when the claw has "reached the bottom" or "end of the string" so to speak. Sounds like the string is tripping that switch early. (either frayed/knotted up or too short)

thelosthero · « **Reply #3 on:** May 19, 2011, 06:04:38 am »

yea its the string any1 got any suggestions for a replacement one should i use some nylon string of similar thickness, or is there a specific kind i should get

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #4 on:** May 19, 2011, 06:35:32 pm »

Anything of similar thickness will work. A decent quality is recommended just to avoid issues later.
Biggest thing is to get the length set where it trips the limit switch when the claw gets close to the bottom.

thelosthero · « **Reply #5 on:** May 19, 2011, 07:57:11 pm »

string is really shot, just gotta figure out how to about replaceing it i haven't got a clue where to startand not a whole lotta luck finding any diagrams or anything theres also a spring on the tension arm that looks outta place $:-\$

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #6 on:** May 20, 2011, 08:47:12 am »

If it's possible for you to grab some pics of your carriage assembly maybe we can point ya in the right direction. (just so we're pointing at the right bits)
Usually winding a new string up is fairly straight forward once you get the old one out.

thelosthero · « **Reply #7 on:** May 21, 2011, 05:45:42 pm »

so i got some pictures

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0161.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0160.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0159.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0158.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0157.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0156.jpg

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #8 on:** May 22, 2011, 04:33:26 pm »

Could you try and grab a pic of each of the circuit boards?
Looks like you have the older stuff in there which I may have some more info to give for testing, dipswitches, etc, etc. (see attached pic)

Try this -
With the machine off, gently pull straight down on the whole claw assembly. It should unwind the string.
Look to see how the string is attached to the spool up top.
Measure a length of string that will go from that attach point to where the claw will just be short of reaching the bottom of the cabinet.
You'll have to undo the couple screws to undo the top of the claw itself to get the string fed through and tied off to the center of the claw itself.
Once you start the machine back up it should wind itself back up.

EDIT: Woops, forgot the pic.

thelosthero · « **Reply #9 on:** May 22, 2011, 09:34:45 pm »

so i replaced the string the claw still drops like 6-8 inches closes and goes up and returns home. I think its a dip switch for the tension arm telling it the claw its loose like it hit a stuffed animal causing the early close and return

thelosthero · « **Reply #10 on:** May 22, 2011, 10:05:06 pm »

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0164.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y84/tiedyeskater/IMG_0162.jpg

best pics i can get without pulling them outta the machine

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #11 on:** May 22, 2011, 10:18:56 pm »

There should be a tension switch that is physically activated when the string reaches it's full length. Sounds like "something" is triggering that switch too soon.
I have seen something as odd as the string being wound "backwards" on the spool cause this, but not sure if this is your situation or not.

Try this -

First look at your dipswitches and note what positions they are currently in. (1-8)

Now....Let's put it in selftest mode -

With the machine OFF, turn ALL dipswitches to the OFF position and flip #8 to the ON position.
Turn machine ON.
Flip dipswitch #2 ON.
You should now be able to control the claw and carriage and watch the "SECONDS" display. As each limit switch is activated a number should appear in that display.
Drop the claw, watch the display and see if a number shows up right when it reaches the point where it wants to come back up.
When the claw drops, the display will show a #5, when all the way up it will show a #6. (or vice versa, I forget now)
Let us know how it reacts.

I want to see if that tension switch is getting triggered early.

Just an FYI...In this mode Dipswitch 1 will test the displays, Dipswitch two tests limit switches like above, Dipswitch 3 will run the auto bridge test and cycle itself, Dipswitch 4 is the sound test. (5-7 are not used) You can run through these tests one at a time, so if running #2, turn it OFF before turning on #3 ON, etc, etc. Leave dipswitch #8 ON during all the tests. To get back to game mode turn machine OFF, turn #8 OFF, reset any 1-7 dipswitches you may have moved before going into test mode, turn machine back on.

You might want to also try the #3 test and see if the claw drops and comes up at the same point it does in game mode.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #12 on:** May 22, 2011, 10:30:54 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 22, 2011, 10:05:06 pm

best pics i can get without pulling them outta the machine

Those pics were fine. Just wanted to see if they were the older version boards like I thought they were.

But that board everything is mounted to should slide out somewhat.
Unless yours is setup a bit different from the smaller cranes.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #13 on:** May 22, 2011, 10:55:17 pm »

Been a while since I messed with one of these, so bear with me.....but this should be the area you want to watch closely to see what is physically happening.

thelosthero · « **Reply #14 on:** May 22, 2011, 11:05:01 pm »

so they were all down when i started i moved em all up but 8 turned it off and started it up and put 2 down once i add credits i can move the claw only left to right then when it times out and drops it stays all zeros and when it returns and opens it flashes 99 and then 11

thelosthero · « **Reply #15 on:** May 22, 2011, 11:27:02 pm »

as soon as i let go of the right button there's a click so i think a limit switch is bad

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #16 on:** May 22, 2011, 11:37:27 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 22, 2011, 11:05:01 pm

so they were all down when i started i moved em all up but 8 turned it off and started it up and put 2 down once i add credits i can move the claw only left to right then when it times out and drops it stays all zeros and when it returns and opens it flashes 99 and then 11

I believe because the way your board is mounted down is OFF and up is ON.
(the side with numbers 1-8 on it is the OFF side)

So make sure they are all down except #8 before you turn the machine on.
The move #2 up to start that test.

You shouldn't have to add credits or anything like that.

Quote from: thelosthero on May 22, 2011, 11:27:02 pm

as soon as i let go of the right button there's a click so i think a limit switch is bad

That actually sounds about right if you were still in game mode.
As soon as you let go of the "right" button it should stop and drop the claw. It will also drop if the timer has run out even if you don't move to the right at all.

FYI - You could convert it to use a 4 way joystick.

thelosthero · « **Reply #17 on:** May 23, 2011, 05:02:50 pm »

when i turn it on with only 8 up it goes crazy, it goes to the back then to the front then about halfway to the back then seems to go all the way right and keeps trying to go right for a sec(through the numbers 10 down to

then drops the claw part way like it has been and returns home when the claw drops it stops on 07 on the display and doesn't count any lower im goin to try the test with 2 on and it does nothing button don't move the claw at all same with 3

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #18 on:** May 23, 2011, 05:32:45 pm »

Try flipping each dipswitch up and down a few times and the try with just the #8 up again.
Might be some flaky dipswitches.
The "going crazy" thing sounds like the auto bridge test. (test #3)

When first put into test mode (switch #8 by itself) it shouldn't do anything at all until one of the other switches are activated.

Have you tried watching up inside at that limit switch I pointed to while it was running in regular game mode? See if it is getting triggered early when the claw comes down.

thelosthero · « **Reply #19 on:** May 23, 2011, 05:43:14 pm »

yea i always here a click from somehere up there its gotta be one of the 2 switches on the one side there also the claw doesn't stop going right when u let go of the button it coasts and drops the claw when the button is released i'll play with the dip switches a bit i switched them all back and then set it up again and it did the same thing im try switching em once more

thelosthero · « **Reply #20 on:** May 23, 2011, 06:24:55 pm »

i got it to go into test mode but when i put 2 on i only got left to right movement with the claw and i seem to have an issue with the coin mech the display flashes 02 06 then 19 87 and keeps resetting

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #21 on:** May 23, 2011, 06:31:04 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 06:24:55 pm

the display flashes 02 06 then 19 87 and keeps resetting

OK, now I'm getting confused....let me ponder this a moment because that stuff you're seeing on the display is the date code for the version of software (ie ROM) that it's running.
Just like it reads when you look at it. 02-06-1987

I keep thinking you only see that at normal startup in game mode, I don't remember if it is suppose to show in test mode......let me go check something.

I'm also used to the joystick models where you have a button to drop the claw when testing, so this may be a tad different with the two button setup. Not sure if it should still timeout and drop the claw even in test mode.

thelosthero · « **Reply #22 on:** May 23, 2011, 06:33:24 pm »

it does drop if i let it timeout

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #23 on:** May 23, 2011, 06:55:22 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 06:33:24 pm

it does drop if i let it timeout

Ok, that sounds right then since you don't have a "drop button".

And these machines DO show the date code like you mentioned when in test mode. (had to go fire up my little crane to double check)

When you first put it in test mode and turn the machine on, does BOTH displays show 00 ?
Game mode will have alternating flashing 00, test mode will have just solid 00's.

thelosthero · « **Reply #24 on:** May 23, 2011, 07:04:04 pm »

yesh solid zeros

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #25 on:** May 23, 2011, 07:06:00 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 07:04:04 pm

yesh solid zeros

That's a good sign, no errors or "stuck" limit switches. If there were it would show numbers in the displays instead of 00.

I'm going to try and get a couple quick video clips together of the drop limit switch.....but bear with me, we're watching tornadoes near us, so if I disappear.....send help.

(seriously, we are watching storms here in good ol' Oklahoma tornado alley)

thelosthero · « **Reply #26 on:** May 23, 2011, 07:09:24 pm »

Quote from: Kevin Mullins on May 23, 2011, 07:06:00 pm

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 07:04:04 pm
yesh solid zeros

That's a good sign, no errors or "stuck" limit switches. If there were it would show numbers in the displays instead of 00.

I'm going to try and get a couple quick video clips together of the drop limit switch.....but bear with me, we're watching tornadoes near us, so if I disappear.....send help.
(seriously, we are watching storms here in good ol' Oklahoma tornado alley)

oo thats no good i got nothing but time wish u luck with the storms

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #27 on:** May 23, 2011, 08:29:02 pm »

Things are calm right now, but there's a string of storms looking awfully mean still headed this direction.

But anyways....
These first two videos are just to kinda show what should be happening during a claw drop as far as the linkage and switches.

- Specifically watch the right side where the spring is attached to that lever. When the claw hits bottom it slacks up the string allowing the small spindle that the string is looped over to raise which causes the arm that reaches across to the other side to release the limit switch. When that switch gets released it tells the machine to reverse the motor and raise the claw back up. If that switch or arm is "bouncing" it may cause it to raise the claw early.
The when the claws hits that plate it activates the UP limit switch which will stop the motor and send the whole carriage "home".

- Shows the opposite side where the switch is a bit better. Claw drops, relaxes the string, arm raises which releases the switch, claw comes back up.

- Normal machine startup in GAME mode with no errors. Flashes date code then goes to alternating 00's waiting for credits to be added.

- Machine startup in TEST mode with no errors. Flashes date code then goes to solid 00's. If there were any numbers showing then it could mean there was a stuck switch somewhere. (each switch has a designated number)

- This one shows the displays during the drop sequence while in test. Mine is joystick operated with a button to drop the claw, so yours may show slightly different numbers, but the "sequence" should be similar. The top digit changes to a 05 showing that I hit the drop button. The bottom display shows a 06 when the drop limit switch is released when the claw reaches the bottom and the string gets slacked up. (the one being shown in videos 01 & 02) When the claw comes back up and hits the UP plate it changes to an 05 showing that switch being activated.

So check these out a bit, I know the quality isn't all that hot. But see if there is anything out of the ordinary going on with that switch sequence.
I'm just trying to eliminate anything goofy, because otherwise your crane sounds like it working properly when in game mode.

I noticed your date is a few years older than mine, so there might be some slight differences here and there, but I doubt much changed on these things over the years.
Mine is 11-21-1993 your is 02-06-1987. I'd actually like to get a copy of your older ROM file to play with someday. Information for these older machines is hard to come by.

Ok.... back to storm chasing.

thelosthero · « **Reply #28 on:** May 23, 2011, 08:41:13 pm »

yea my arm never has a chance to move it just drops about 8 in closes and returns home also i think the right bumper isn't working cause the claw carrage will keep trying to go right even after it hits the bumper

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #29 on:** May 23, 2011, 09:23:35 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 08:41:13 pm

yea my arm never has a chance to move it just drops about 8 in closes and returns home

I'd check the switch itself and see if it is stuck/bad. You could probably just test continuity with a meter and see if it is "switching" at all by manually moving that arm. (might need a third hand) I can't remember if the wiring goes to the Normally Open or normally Closed terminals on the switch itself. (heck, might be wired backwards)

Quote from: thelosthero on May 23, 2011, 08:41:13 pm

also i think the right bumper isn't working cause the claw carrage will keep trying to go right even after it hits the bumper

That sounds like the right carriage limit switch for sure. If it's not the switch itself, then sometimes it'll be a break in the wiring harness leading down to the circuit boards. You can do the same continuity check as above with the carriage all the way right and move away from all the way right and see if that particular switch is "switching".

thelosthero · « **Reply #30 on:** May 23, 2011, 09:28:29 pm »

yea i need to invest in a meter tomarro and check those out so if they are bad how hard is it gunna be to get replacements

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #31 on:** May 23, 2011, 09:50:00 pm »

They are just generic arcade switches, same thing used on most any standard joystick or pushbutton.
But get a multimeter handy and we'll get them checked out first. (not sure if the wires are soldered on or if yours has push on terminals) The meter doesn't have to be anything fancy.

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #32 on:** May 23, 2011, 10:00:35 pm »

You might even be able to reach up in there with your finger or something small and see if those two switches feel "springy" and "clicky". If they feel loose and dull, then they are most likely bad.
Not the whole thing, just the red part in the pic above of course.

And note which terminals have the wires going to them.

I'm sure we could scrounge ya up a couple switches if that's all you end up needing.

thelosthero · « **Reply #33 on:** May 23, 2011, 10:19:27 pm »

alright thanks for all the help for the price i paid i couldn't pass it up i am so glad i found some help with it

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #34 on:** May 24, 2011, 12:45:45 am »

Well, stick with it and we'll get through the troubleshooting side of things and it'll up and running before ya know it.

mgb · « **Reply #35 on:** May 24, 2011, 04:49:03 pm »

I'm not sure if it's been mentioned yet ( I get lazy reading through) but alot of times this problem is due to a bad carriage harness. The wires get beat up over time.
Obviously your limit switches need to also be looked at, if the carriage wants to keep moving when it's already in the home position.

I just had an Ice Crane that was doing the exact same thing. Changed the Carriage harness and it then worked fine. another problem now came up where the claw won't drop at all and it turns out its an issue with the prize sensor. Disconnect the prize sensor and the claw works.

thelosthero · « **Reply #36 on:** May 24, 2011, 08:00:19 pm »

so i tested the switches both seem to work the one on the tension bar is closed at rest the other right bumper switch is open at rest

thelosthero · « **Reply #37 on:** May 24, 2011, 10:04:23 pm »

after testing those switches that work fine, my friend found a wire with solder not connected to anything so we found where that goes and im going to get it soldered when he comes over with his stuff but the claw drops all the way perfectly and goes up and return home , my new problem is my coin mech just keeps clicking and doesn't give u a chance to add credits sometimes it clicks and the light comes on and then turns off and on repeatedly

Kevin Mullins · « **Reply #38 on:** May 24, 2011, 11:04:09 pm »

Quote from: thelosthero on May 24, 2011, 10:04:23 pm

my friend found a wire with solder not connected to anything so we found where that goes and im going to get it soldered when he comes over with his stuff but the claw drops all the way perfectly and goes up and return home

Where did that broke wire lead to ?

Quote from: thelosthero on May 24, 2011, 10:04:23 pm

my new problem is my coin mech just keeps clicking and doesn't give u a chance to add credits sometimes it clicks and the light comes on and then turns off and on repeatedly

The coin counter/meter keeps clicking ?

Try unplugging the meter. (if that's what is clicking)
Try unplugging that OBA bill acceptor control unit.

thelosthero · « **Reply #39 on:** May 24, 2011, 11:13:40 pm »

Quote from: Kevin Mullins on May 24, 2011, 11:04:09 pm

Where did that broke wire lead to ?

i believe it was a black wire coming from the right bumper and tension switches ,going to the plate drop switch

the bill acceptor is disconnected


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