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Yie Ar Kung-Fu has THREE buttons, not TWO!?!
Xiaou2:
--- Quote ---While the physics itself may be absolute, the joystick is not the only relevant mechanical construct that matters here. It is unwise to underestimate "human machine", it's flexible, adaptive, and as much as you can guarantee the physics is the same for all, you are still dealing with unknown boundaries of human abilities, not to talk about the mind and subjective perception here, plus the interesting combination of the two.
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Some truth to it... but when you consider that the actual physics of the human side of things also work against you in such a case... then you are fighting about 3 places of mechanical losses.
As said, try moving your mini analog back and forth repeatedly for like 30 seconds.
The try that same thing with a stick. You will beat the number of times, as well as be less fatigued. Its physics of the body that counts as well... (which is why people with two good arms dont steer a car with their feet, for normal driving)
Ive not really read up on Tommy. But more than likely he was playing the older style EM machines. These machines have a slower ball speed, and you can hear the ball roll across the surface of the field better. He would also hear where the ball was hitting due to the bells and thugs on any posts... and could triangulate the general positions. When it hit a flipper, he would feel that too.
Turns out that many people lose a ball because they misjudge something visually, and pop a flipper up at the wrong time, which leaves an even larger hole down the center for the ball to exit.
And because the ball was slower, a small bump would rocket the ball 2 or more times further than a later machine. In one game I played, you could bounce the ball from one side of the playfield to the complete opposite side with Ease.
edit - Missed the deaf part. (which could be partial? or misdiagnosed?) But if thats so, then it would all boil down to vibrations and hypersensitivity w/ no distractions. He wouldnt fare long in robotron however ;)
Hoopz:
--- Quote from: abaraba on November 17, 2010, 06:00:51 pm ---
--- Quote from: pinballjim on November 17, 2010, 02:13:39 pm ---I rest my case.
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I have no idea what are you talking about or who are you talking to, but could you tell me more about that game? What is it called in English? How many games, what games, are they licensed? Screen rotation supported, vertical/horizontal?
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Seriously? I don't think that it's a leap of faith to assume that PBJ is showing the PS2 cocktail rendition of the cabinet in question and the fact that it shows 3 buttons.
Hoopz:
--- Quote from: abaraba on November 17, 2010, 08:43:04 pm ---In what section of this forum do I post the question about Popeye PCB and those problems with non-standard power supply or something? Also, where to ask question about Green Beret PCB, which to my surprise seem to run on 30Hz. I do not have arcade monitor but SCART TV and I'm afraid it is not interlaced resolution and so this TV can not really sync to 30Hz vertical refresh. It looks like the screen gets refreshed only half the time - everything is much darker than with in any other boards or MAME, poor contrast, kind of washed out picture.
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I'd try Misc Arcade:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?board=24.0 for the power supply question
And Monitor/video for the Green Beret issue.
abaraba:
--- Quote from: Hoopz on November 17, 2010, 11:40:45 pm ---Seriously? I don't think that it's a leap of faith to assume that PBJ is showing the PS2 cocktail rendition of the cabinet in question and the fact that it shows 3 buttons.
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Heh. That would be great, but no, seriously, I could not follow what was he responding to, and do not see anything there that says "Yie Ar Kung-Fu". In fact, I'm pretty sure that is illegal compilation with more than one game, probably running some version of MAME.
abaraba:
--- Quote from: Xiaou2 on November 17, 2010, 09:04:44 pm --- Some truth to it... but when you consider that the actual physics of the human side of things also work against you in such a case... then you are fighting about 3 places of mechanical losses.
As said, try moving your mini analog back and forth repeatedly for like 30 seconds.
The try that same thing with a stick. You will beat the number of times, as well as be less fatigued. Its physics of the body that counts as well... (which is why people with two good arms dont steer a car with their feet, for normal driving)
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I was alluding to Vader's: "Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed. The ability to destroy a planet, or even a whole system, is insignificant next to the power of the Force." Overcoming your childhood problems should give you more belief in this quite real mechanical adaptivity/flexibility or "compensation ability" of that "robotron/transformer" body your mind dwells in. - "I find your lack of faith disturbing."
The point is, you have to take argument back from "personal/individual" to "theoretically possible" in order to reach any meaningful conclusion. Interestingly, here, just like in the main argument of this thread about edge connector and harness, here too it is critical to understand when on thing starts, ends, and when another one begins.
Funny enough, just like PCB edge connector and harness may appear to be one entity on arcade cabinets, here your mistake is to assume the mechanical system of "person playing a game" is limited only to joystick mechanics, while, in fact, you have "mind" on one side, and joystick *together* with muscles and bones as another entity, "as a whole", on the other side , where "harness" are nerves conducting electric impulses. The point where your hand grasps a joystick handle is just another 'joint' in this combined mechanical extension of the brain, the physical/mechanical interface between the mind software and game software.
"He stands like a statue, Becomes part of the machine..."
In other words, I completely agree with what you are trying to say, but you have to rethink your phrasing if you want to "win" the argument or reach some agreement. Until then it can be argued that all the disadvantages you mentioned for those ugly analog thumb sticks can work as an advantage once the muscles and reflexes adjust to *compensate* for it. It might turn out body can adapt in such way as to use this large dead zone in its favor and minimize movement errors due to rapid change of direction, for example. You have to make the argument more general, statistical, there must be a room for that exception that proves the rule, you know?