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Q*Bert_OP:
--- Quote from: Pinball Wizard on August 10, 2010, 12:10:23 am ---I don't understand this, John Borg designed this game, yet Stern didn't want to take on Steve Ritchie's version that he had started in 2008 during movie production.
--- End quote ---
Steve Ritchie owns his design, Stern does not. Steve Ritchie Productions did commission based work for Stern, and was not employed like John Borg...Stern bought designs from Steve Ritchie, but anything created by Borg is owned by Stern.
Pinball Wizard:
IIRC Stern did buy into Ritchie's design and just didn't produce it. I do know that Steve Ritchie doesn't work for Stern he own Steve Ritchie Productions just like Pat Lawlor is the same way. I just must of misunderstood the events that occurred between Steve and Stern.
Xiaou2:
--- Quote ---Back when pinball was much better off than it is today, the GLORIOUS AND UNTOUCHABLE Medieval Madness couldn't even move 4,000 units.
--- End quote ---
IS Pinball better back then? Not so sure about that. Because there was stiff
competition with video games (as well as other pin mfg)... and the Home enthusiast
was not even in the equation. Also, The advertisement for a game like MM was horrible
& thin to say the Least. MM was also in the tail end of the video game era... where
game income was flat-lining, & standard arcade games costs were skyrocketing
(huge 52" projector screen games, massive dual sitdowns..etc)
Today, there is basically no competition with arcade vids & other Pin Mfgs.
However, selling to ops today is very difficult, because most are out of buis.
Then again, many Ops are buying pins to resell them later.
The advantages today, is the Home gameroom sales. There is a ton of opportunity
that never used to exist... merely because people didnt think it was possible to
purchase them.
You put a good pin like MM in the local Walmarts, and it will get 1 Million times
more exposure to potential clients than the days when it was about to be released to
the Arcade industry.
Granted, at +$3000 a pop, pins are not going to sell like candy. However, they
have potential to sell better than current and past methods.
I have a feeling Stern couldnt even sell 4000 pins of something like Family guy.
They are probably sitting in a warehouse waiting to be stripped of parts.
LOTR has a production of like 5000, and that is basically their best pin. (The pin
which was spared the least amount of budget cuts, and even was re-ran)
This was sold to ops who resold to home owners. Most people paid retail, or close
to it, were home buyers. 5000 home purchases is nothing small to sneeze at...
and yet, that is just the tip of the iceberg of sales possibilities. LOTR isnt that good,
and plenty of people do not own it... nor care less to own it. It wasnt in the local
walmarts, which still could drum up at least one more large run.
(Instead, they choose to put the worst machines on test Sales locations.
BRILLIANT STERN!)
--- Quote ---For today's market, a license like Shrek or Family Guy has much more pull and appeal for the masses than does Medieval Madness. It doesn't matter what game is superior, it matters what people are willing to play and try out.
--- End quote ---
Sorry, but thats not true at all.
You put a shrek / family guy next to a MM, TOM, etc in a walmart, and the shrek/fg
will get 1/10th the plays, and 1/1000th the purchases. Meaning, youd sell 1000 TOM
to 1 FG/Shrek.
Similarly, if you put a LOTR next to just about Any of Sterns machines, and the
LOTR will take the cake.
The quality is what people will notice, be attracted to, want to play/purchase,
much more so than generic well known themes.
Marketing is for eggheads who dont know anything about reality of what they are
selling. Markers were the ones behind Marble Madness II, and their stupid ideas
Ruined a possibly great sequel.
If it wasnt for on-site tests, the game would have been produced in Mass, and they
would have lost their shirts long before the final days of typical operations. Yet, Stern is
not testing EXTERNALLY.
Sterns is producing a Theory, that with lower quality... they can make more money...
so should be able to stay alive. That theory can be tested in one week time,
using the poor-quality -vs- well known quality good pins 'onsite' tests.
You could easily put MM, TOM -vs- FG, SM, out at a walmart, and ask people which
one are they most attracted to. Giving them credits, which one they chose to play
first, and which out of all of them did they like the best. Which one, if they were
for sale, would they want to purchase.
Sterns chepo quality theory would be blown right out of the water. SO would your
theory that cheaply made generic theme would trump a quality made Original theme.
The only reason Original themes didnt sell in the past, was because it was Ops
who were doing the buying, and they thought the same way... that unknown theme
would not draw people to play. And yet, just how much money did Johnny Mnemonic,
Judge Dread, sega? Batman.. really earn an OP? I can tell you it wasnt much. (much
much less than the better playing original themed "NO Fear" we had sitting next to them
making all the money)
Jeff AMN:
Errors in the above post:
1. Stern does do "external" testing on location
2. Pinball is far worse off than it ever was in the '90s.
3. Home sales are nowhere near as big as location sales used to be
4. Licensed titles have ALWAYS sold better than original themes...and it's not even close.
5. No Fear is a licensed title, and a pretty poor and extremely dated license
6. I better stop now or else I won't get any work done, but there's at least 3-4 more really poorly defended or outright false claims made there...
pinballwizard79:
---fudgesicle--- not this ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- again.
Look Stern is cool, WMS is cool, DE is cool & etc....they all offer different flavors of pinball.
If WMS is so ---smurfing--- cool why are they out of business & getting their IP panhandled & pimped like a hooker by a hoarding Australian?
Money cash hoes money cash hoes whuuut!
Edit: F Billy Mitchell too
Edit again: Did Xiao just say MM would out earn Shrek @ walmart? WTF dude a "cloudy with meatballs" machine would out earn a MM in this day & age.
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